Torrey Smith shows leadership

[jtm]

1 hour ago, bLACKpANTHER said:

is it just me or is Torrey Smith pretty much done as a player??

I figured when we traded Worley for him - it was more of us trying to get rid of Worley than really wanting Smith.. 

his numbers have drastically gone down since his time in B-more.. his contract is also up at the end of this year.. with DJ, Samuel and Byrd (all burners) waiting in the wings - i'd figure we need another possession receiver.. his contract is up after next year and i think that's when his time will be over with us.. could be wrong thou

 

Sorry to turn this into a Torrey bashing but I love what he did with the kids.. amazing

The targets say it all and Smith has not been a primary #1 WR since leaving Baltimore.  People here see these stats and say he's done and perhaps he is, but it is more likely that his role in the offense has shifted from a primary target to a #2 or 3 target which is all we need here.  To be honest, if he still has 4.3 or 4.4 speed, if he can just run deep routes and open up the middle of the field this would be helpful.  

[Davidson Deac II]

52 minutes ago, jtm said:

Panthers essentially gave up nothing to get Smith and are paying him peanuts by WR standards.  People here act like we need Smith to have a 1,000 yard season.  We just need him to get 400-500 yards and help move the chain on 3rd down and mentor our young WR talent.  Between CMC, Funchess, Samuel, Olsen, and Moore . . . how many looks do you really think Smith will get?

We probably will end up keeping him, and I don't have a problem with that.  But for this year, he is our highest paid receiver,  and he is paid well above average for NFL receivers.  I think he might be the fifth highest paid receiver in the NFC south, only behind Sanu, Jones, Jackson, and Evans.  

[Rags]

Just now, jtm said:

The targets say it all and Smith has not been a primary #1 WR since leaving Baltimore.  People here see these stats and say he's done and perhaps he is, but it is more likely that his role in the offense has shifted from a primary target to a #2 or 3 target which is all we need here.  To be honest, if he still has 4.3 or 4.4 speed, if he can just run deep routes and open up the middle of the field this would be helpful.  

He was in SF during the meltdown, his head coaches were Jim "Scapegoat" Tomulsa and Chip Kelly, his QBs were Sans Harubaugh Kapernick and Blaine Gabbert 

In Philly he was a part of a group of receiving targets that included Alshon Jeffery, Zack Ertz, Nelson Agholor and Trey Burton. A larger chunk of his targets came with Nick Foles than with Wentz.

So no, he's not a #1 WR anymore, one can argue he never was, he just took advantage of Joe Flacco's arm.

If only we had a strong armed QB.

[Peppers90 NC]

35 minutes ago, Rags said:

https://www.profootballfocus.com/news/fantasy-football-metrics-that-matter-torrey-smiths-awful-draw-the-last-2-years

BUT HEY IF I JUST LOOK AT THE STATS I CAN PRETEND I KNOW THE WHOLE STORY

Haha, love those gize. My wife who knows zero football can do that too.

[panthers55]

37 minutes ago, Lumps said:

Huge difference in your hand being forced for whatever reason, lack of FAs, injuries or even a lack of coaching ability for certain players. In that regard Rivera does not. He is known to prefer the vet, ‘it’s his job to lose’ vs. taking a gamble. Rivera is convservative when it comes to personnel, plenty of examples of that and it’s well know to be his style.

Of course coaches prefer vets and they should. Playing rookies are always gambles as they screw up a lot. They really shouldn't play if there are better alternatives. So when your vet goes down and a rookie starts most times you have to adjust what you do to accommodate the rookie. For example when Jackson starts this week watch how much help he gets over the top with a safety versus being left on an island. It makes him look better but it isn't without cost as you have to adjust the scheme and often the complexity until they catch up.

[tondi]

I'm not passing judgment until I see him on the field in games that count. I wasn't exactly thrilled when we signed Ginn the first time and he became an integral part of our offense and I'd love for Smith to have even half of that impact. If he can catch a deep ball every few games he's worth having around but it also wouldn't surprise me if he only ended up being here a season or two. That may end up having more to do with how the young guys develop than anything he does though. 

[Pup McBarky]

Torrey is a deep threat - the only proven one on our roster - and it's unlikely he does much in pre-season since Norv is almost certainly gonna stick with a bland, vanilla offense until Dallas rolls into town. He may take a couple shots downfield to him, but don't be surprised if he doesn't get targeted in the next 3 games.

[JARROD]

1 hour ago, jtm said:

The targets say it all and Smith has not been a primary #1 WR since leaving Baltimore.  People here see these stats and say he's done and perhaps he is, but it is more likely that his role in the offense has shifted from a primary target to a #2 or 3 target which is all we need here.  To be honest, if he still has 4.3 or 4.4 speed, if he can just run deep routes and open up the middle of the field this would be helpful.  

Dude-- 

Torrey played with Flacco and then look at his first year with Kapernick-- a deep thrower-- 20 yards per reception.

He then gets stuck with Blaine Gabbert,.no more SF.  In Phili he had Jeffrey and Nelson and and a couple of tightends to spread around.  Wentz is an awesome quarterback but his strength is what Peterson had him so, short and medium throws.  Foles was more of a medium and long ball guy, so Torrey shined with Foles.

Cam is a medium and deep ball guy.

 

[jtm]

41 minutes ago, JARROD said:

Dude-- 

Torrey played with Flacco and then look at his first year with Kapernick-- a deep thrower-- 20 yards per reception.

He then gets stuck with Blaine Gabbert,.no more SF.  In Phili he had Jeffrey and Nelson and and a couple of tightends to spread around.  Wentz is an awesome quarterback but his strength is what Peterson had him so, short and medium throws.  Foles was more of a medium and long ball guy, so Torrey shined with Foles.

Cam is a medium and deep ball guy.

 

I think you misunderstood my post . . . I don't mind Smith and was defending him.  I think he'll be fine here for what we need.  

[Wolfcop]

If you are paying a player 5M, you need more than leadership. Thats not hating, it's being realistic. He very well may make this roster, but I guarantee his salary at least causes some concern among the staff. If he and a healthy Byrd give you the same thing...

[dpm0409]

3 hours ago, bLACKpANTHER said:

is it just me or is Torrey Smith pretty much done as a player??

I figured when we traded Worley for him - it was more of us trying to get rid of Worley than really wanting Smith.. 

Perfect example of how looking at stats without applying context isn't a good idea.  Do we need Torrey to put up the stats he did in '13 with the Ravens?  Absolutely not, we have too much talent to expect that.

@jtm said it best, "We just need him to get 400-500 yards and help move the chains on 3rd down and mentor our young WR talent.  Between CMC, Funchess, Samuel, Olsen, and Moore . . . how many looks do you really think Smith will get?"

A WR isn't "pretty much done as a player" just because they don't reach 1K receiving yards.  Teams do need competent # 2's, 3's, and 4's in this league.....not to mention he's shown the ability to stay healthy over the course of his career thus far.  That alone is a pretty big deal imho.

[PhillyB]

huge lockerroom addition along with what he can contribute on the field.

[JARROD]

6 minutes ago, dpm0409 said:

Perfect example of how looking at stats without applying context isn't a good idea.  Do we need Torrey to put up the stats he did in '13 with the Ravens?  Absolutely not, we have too much talent to expect that.

@jtm said it best, "We just need him to get 400-500 yards and help move the chains on 3rd down and mentor our young WR talent.  Between CMC, Funchess, Samuel, Olsen, and Moore . . . how many looks do you really think Smith will get?"

A WR isn't "pretty much done as a player" just because they don't reach 1K receiving yards.  Teams do need competent # 2's, 3's, and 4's in this league.....not to mention he's shown the ability to stay healthy over the course of his career thus far.  That alone is a pretty big deal imho.

Im looking more at the rest of his years minus his last year in Frisco.  Most of his yards with Phili happened after Foles, would have caught for 700-850 yards if Foles had played all year.  That matches up with all his other years except his peak year.  Most years he also caught 6-8 touchdowns.

That would be a home run for 5 million per year not guaranteed. His last few games in Phili showed me hes not lost a step and can thrive with the right quarterback and system.  He should match up great with Norv and Cam.

 

[Rags]

29 minutes ago, Wolfcop said:

If he and a healthy Byrd give you the same thing...

They don't.