DJ vs Sammy Watkins - Combine / Field Translation Talk

[SetfreexX]

Next up we have another comparison of measurable raw ability vs another 1st round selection:

DJ Moore - https://www.nfl.com/prospects/d.j.-moore?id=32462018-0002-5602-31ed-ce270f370fe4

Sammy Watkins - http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/sammy-watkins?id=2543457

Considering a few failed to see the point that I wasn't saying DJ Moore would be OBJ, but that I was simply stating given his raw ability he has a chance to reach that level, I thought I'd bring an even closer comparison in Sammy, a receiver many of you wanted us to break the bank for this off-season. 

In nearly every measure Moore, is equal to, or slightly better than Watkins, and if you compare some of the early win routes that Moore is projected to be best at ''early'' slants, digs, post, curls, and then you take a brief look at :

You will begin to see a clear picture, a  lot of what Watkins was successful with just last season was the same ''early win'' routes Moore is expected to run as a rookie, (slant, dig, post, curl) the vertical attempts and plays will be there. You keep seeing posters here say ''we need a receiver that turns 50/50 balls into 70/30'' and that's not what they're trying to do as an offense. That was the KB mindset, the mindset is get the ball out, and get it out quick and let the receivers do the work. 

You save that 50/50 stuff for the redzone, it's not a realistic way to expect to move the ball. Even if you go and look up some of OBJ's best plays many of them are of the same variety, I'm not saying Moore is the next Steve Smith, or OBJ, or Sammy Watkins, but what he seems to be coming in, is a receiver who can emerge as a true #1, win short, win intermediate, and has the speed to get vertical as well and win deep. 

He's going to be hard to tackle after the catch, and given his athletic ability he's going to be hard to defend in and out of breaks, especially as he continues to refine his route running ability at this level, going from Maryland QB's (8 in three years / 3 OC's) to Cam will also mean a lot to his early success. 

Having Funchess, Olsen, and CMC, as legitimate receiving threats will also go a long way in allowing him to have early success as well. Guys we got a damn good receiver, and as talented as Ridley may be, his ceiling is closer to where he is right now since he's not an elite athlete vs where Moore's could be in a year or two. And if you're taking a guy in the first the ceiling should also be a factor because he's just as good as Ridley is right now. Pretty much every scouting expert believes this to be true, he was the #1 receiver in this class for a reason, at the worst #1A/B. 

[Jeremy Igo]

Good post!

[Carolina-Chuck18]

Better comparison. But now who plays RB?

[The Huddler]

29 minutes ago, Carolina-Chuck18 said:

Better comparison. But now who plays RB?

Our Top 10 pick who has yet to have a fair shake or opportunity

[SetfreexX]

37 minutes ago, Jeremy Igo said:

Good post!

My first ever ''Igo Post Award''

[SetfreexX]

Not to derail but Reggie Bonnafon, is a ''very intriguing'' 4th HB for consideration, when you begin to consider our scheme emphasis in position flexibility, he could be a better version of Joe Webb as that multi-faceted player. 

4.4 speed, and a 43.5 in vertical, can get to the perimeter on outside runs, has the size to run inside as well (6'3 / 215), but can flex out as a receiver and is another LB / S match up problem. 

I have no idea what he may turn into, but I like the versatility and I think he can make the club as the 4th HB replacing Whittaker, as I think we should add a CJ Anderson, Alfred Morris, or Orleans Darkwa to be another complimentary between the tackles runner to CAP. 

CMC / CAP / Vet / Bonnafon -- is my early call, I like Whittaker, but at this point the UDFA is a little more intriguing. 

[Carolina-Chuck18]

13 minutes ago, The Huddler said:

Our Top 10 pick who has yet to have a fair shake or opportunity

CMC? I think he had more than a fair opportunity to at least show he could run the ball between the tackle last season. 

CMC: 117 carries

Kamara: 120 carries 

 

I’m rooting for CMC but he better show that he can run the ball in the preseason. 

[Carolina-Chuck18]

5 minutes ago, SetfreexX said:

Not to derail but Reggie Bonnafon, is a ''very intriguing'' 4th HB for consideration, when you begin to consider our scheme emphasis in position flexibility, he could be a better version of Joe Webb as that multi-faceted player. 

4.4 speed, and a 43.5 in vertical, can get to the perimeter on outside runs, has the size to run inside as well (6'3 / 215), but can flex out as a receiver and is another LB / S match up problem. 

I have no idea what he may turn into, but I like the versatility and I think he can make the club as the 4th HB replacing Whittaker, as I think we should add a CJ Anderson, Alfred Morris, or Orleans Darkwa to be another complimentary between the tackles runner to CAP. 

CMC / CAP / Vet / Bonnafon -- is my early call, I like Whittaker, but at this point the UDFA is a little more intriguing. 

Bonnafon may be the 3rd QB. Don’t see it tho. Most likely PS if we do like him that much

[The Huddler]

3 minutes ago, Carolina-Chuck18 said:

CMC? I think he had more than a fair opportunity to at least show he could run the ball between the tackle last season. 

CMC: 117 carries

Kamara: 120 carries 

 

I’m rooting for CMC but he better show that he can run the ball in the preseason. 

Kamara.   Sean Peyton

CMC          Shula

 

 

CMC would be fire in that system. And will be fire in Norvs

he needs more than a touch here or there to establish rythm. Also would be nice to not try and run behind an over complicated run scheeme that is easy to predict. A scheme that either works really good (2015), or completly fails (2017)

[SetfreexX]

4 minutes ago, Carolina-Chuck18 said:

CMC? I think he had more than a fair opportunity to at least show he could run the ball between the tackle last season. 

CMC: 117 carries

Kamara: 120 carries 

 

I’m rooting for CMC but he better show that he can run the ball in the preseason. 

The thing about this comparison is NO had a legit passing attack that allowed the box to favor the offense, CMC faced more stacked boxes than Stewart last season. 

Also from Weeks 9-17, he avg'ed 4.6 ypc, that isn't something to just be dismissed either. Also in the two games in that span that he received 12+ carries, he avg'ed 4.8 ypc. CMC really caught on down the stretch and if it wasn't for a stubborn veteran favoritism towards Stewart I think we could've seen a more consistent, and explosive rushing attack, similar to CAP who also has a 4+ ypc avg on his career if memory serves. 

We held onto Stewart a season too long, and we NEEDED to get CMC or at least CAP more of the carries down the stretch. 

So to sit here and say CMC had opportunities you need to consider the nature, and environment those opportunities came in before posting as though he's to be written off as a runner when Kamara was on a much more potent offense, with an elite play-caller / play-designer in Payton. It just is what it is in that regard. 

[Carolina-Chuck18]

31 minutes ago, The Huddler said:

Kamara.   Sean Peyton

CMC          Shula

 

 

CMC would be fire in that system. And will be fire in Norvs

he needs more than a touch here or there to establish rythm. Also would be nice to not try and run behind an over complicated run scheeme that is easy to predict. A scheme that either works really good (2015), or completly fails (2017)

Say whatever you want. I’ve seen Kamara blow through Shaq Thompson. 

[The Huddler]

43 minutes ago, Carolina-Chuck18 said:

Say whatever you want. I’ve seen Kamara blow through Shaq Thompson. 

I saw that too. Kamara is a beast

 

my main point is..   we need to give CMC a big workload to see exactly what we have in him. You gotta invest that time in a top 10 pick. We made the pick. Now its time to either sink or float with it. It would be weong imo to never give him to opportunity to find out

 

 

and tbh, im glad the FO agrees with me so far

[Carolina-Chuck18]

4 minutes ago, The Huddler said:

I saw that too. Kamara is a beast

 

my main point is..   we need to give CMC a big workload to see exactly what we have in him. You gotta invest that time in a top 10 pick. We made the pick. Now its time to either sink or float with it. It would be weong imo to never give him to opportunity to find out

 

 

and tbh, im glad the FO agrees with me so far

Well you are lucky bc CMC is gonna get all the opportunity in the world to prove that he can run the rock this season. I know what kind of player he is in the passing game. I’ve said it before. I believe that CMC would easily be a 1k slot receiver every year if healthy. I just hope that we don’t ruin this kid by trying to play him at RB if he keeps showing us that he can’t do it. BB would’ve already change him into a WR by now. 

I am rooting for him to succeed at RB.

[Manther]

1 hour ago, SetfreexX said:

We held onto Stewart a season too long, and we NEEDED to get CMC or at least CAP more of the carries down the stretch. 

I also think we held on to Shula 4 seasons to long. We'll see how well they read us now.