Defensive versatility emerging as a theme

[Snake]

1 hour ago, Jeremy Igo said:

The down side here is that when you asked rookie to learn and play more than one position , it usually means excelling at none of them.

It usually means busted coverages on defense. 

[Jangler]

A Panther is a just a dark leopard. 

[MHS831]

10 hours ago, AU-panther said:

What is wrong with a CB that is relatively fast (4.4) and tall 6'0"?  What are we going to do? Have different starting CBs depending on who we are playing?  How many teams do that?  I'm sure the players and their agents will love that.

 

Sometimes it feels like we outsmart ourselves.  Cam throws high, lets get tall receivers.  Cam's receivers can't separate, lets draft really fast ones.  Our corners are big and slow.  Lets find some really fast ones that happen to be small.  

The Shaq draft still bugs me.  I think the has the potential to be a good player but we basically drafted him to be a backup in the first round.  He will become a starter once he is expensive.  We could have just signed him as a free agent.

If we used a 2nd round pick on a slot CB so be it.  I can make the argument that your slot is probably more important them a lot of your traditional 22 starters.  I just don't buy this versatility idea they are claiming.  Maybe he becomes our starting outside corner, its not like Revis was much taller.

Good points--It seems that the presser after the draft is to sell the player to the fans--maybe rightly so--but they do get idealistic.   I am curious about the 2 LBs and how and where they fit in.

[MHS831]

25 minutes ago, Jangler said:

A Panther is a just a dark leopard. 

I tend to look beyond fur color.  That's just me though.

[panthers55]

Playing in our division means you need a secondary that can play the run and the pass. When you play cover 3 on one play, come back and play cover 2 on the next play and cover 0 the next, should we really be talking about corners and safeties as if they were totally different positions with clear differentiated responsibilities. We value flexibility and athleticism with a competitive attitude and swagger. I like what we are doing and think there is not only where the NFL is going but what our teams needs at this point. I can't wait to see what this staff can do with these guys.

[panther4life]

Can’t get excited about the Curtis Samuel pick because of his versatility a year ago and then hate picks this year because they are versatile.

BTW just because the coaches say players have skill set to play multiple positions doesn’t mean they will. As matter of a fact they rarely ask anyone to play more than 1 position.

[*FreeFua*]

It’s the same sh!t on offense too.

Samuel, McCaffery and now Moore were all drafted because of their ability to line up in different spots. 

They said they took Moore over Ridley because he brought more to the table like the ability to return. Well, didn’t we just f’n draft those other two because of the same reasons?! 

At some freaking point you need guys that can actually play the position and quit sacrificing skill for versatility. 

[Mr. Scot]

One of the draft guys was in an interview prior to Thursday (Tony Pauline, I think)  and said he thought the Panthers might pass on Will Hernandez because he's really only good at one thing.

The counter of course, is that Will Hernandez is very good at that one thing.

[Hoenheim]

13 hours ago, Growl said:

"emerging" lol

the panthers have been allowing players who can play one position well to pass them by in favor of guys who play a bunch of positions poorly throughout Rivera's entire tenure

This is exactly what I was thinking for the entire draft after DJ Moore. More of the same poo. I knew it would just continue when we skipped on Justin Reid in the 2nd, which alot of people were projected us to take in the 1st round lol.

Nothings going to change unless Rivera and Hurney get fired. 

I mean, I'd love to be suprised and for all these guys to work out. But bringing in about 20 different nickle CBs since Norman left and trying to play them everywhere on the field hasnt been working going on 2+ years. 

They say doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results, is the definition of insanity. 

[panthers55]

8 hours ago, panther4life said:

Can’t get excited about the Curtis Samuel pick because of his versatility a year ago and then hate picks this year because they are versatile.

BTW just because the coaches say players have skill set to play multiple positions doesn’t mean they will. As matter of a fact they rarely ask anyone to play more than 1 position.

But the same position can have different responsibilities on different plays requiring different skill sets. The whole versatility complaints makes little sense to me. That is like saying you didn't like Magic Johnson because he was so versatile and could literally play all five positions including center. I don't agree that versatile means you are giving up quality because of flexibility. Seems to me that to be versatile you have to be athletic and fit well into the team's scheme and philosophy. Why wouldn't you want versatility and flexibility. Gaulden for example is an NFL caliber nickel corner but will be a dynamic safety in our scheme. Playing close in the line in running situations and in cover 2 in clear passing situations. 

[JARROD]

23 hours ago, MHS831 said:

We draft D. Jackson who is told he will play nickel and outside, depending on matchups.  Rivera said Bradberry will be used against the bigger WRs, etc.   Jackson is going to take away the other team's speed advantage.  Period.  He is good enough to play outside, inside, etc. but we went after him hard because he has a versatile skill set.

Then we draft Gaulden, who is told he might play CB, nickel, and S.  While I think he is a safety, and maybe they say that so the veterans don't feel threatened, he will be on the field a lot. 

Then we draft Haynes (DE...or is he?) called a DE by Rivera at the presser but he mentioned the Joker position and suggested that he is able to cover TEs in the seam--like a LB.  Personally, I think Haynes is basically going to play the Sam some, DE some, and I think we will stunt him to the QB a lot. 

Get a traditional 4-3 out of your heads.  This defense is going to hunt.  

 

Exactly we are putting in a lot of those Seattle / Jaguars concepts with hybrid schemes. Watch for man/zone coverage also with Jackson following the fastest and the others filling in zone with the others. 

Jokers are wild,... says Riverboat Ron,..

key the kenny Rogers fellas.

[Bj-Monster23]

23 hours ago, MHS831 said:

We draft D. Jackson who is told he will play nickel and outside, depending on matchups.  Rivera said Bradberry will be used against the bigger WRs, etc.   Jackson is going to take away the other team's speed advantage.  Period.  He is good enough to play outside, inside, etc. but we went after him hard because he has a versatile skill set.

Then we draft Gaulden, who is told he might play CB, nickel, and S.  While I think he is a safety, and maybe they say that so the veterans don't feel threatened, he will be on the field a lot. 

Then we draft Haynes (DE...or is he?) called a DE by Rivera at the presser but he mentioned the Joker position and suggested that he is able to cover TEs in the seam--like a LB.  Personally, I think Haynes is basically going to play the Sam some, DE some, and I think we will stunt him to the QB a lot. 

Get a traditional 4-3 out of your heads.  This defense is going to hunt.  

 

I been trying to tell a lot of Panthers fan this on Twitter. Last year we brought a lot of heavy blitz packages. I think this year we will bring even  Moore heat than most fans will expect. This defense will have to be well conditioned to RUSH how they want to but it can be done. Marquis Haynes has that potential to become a smaller but similarly explosive version of Greg Hardy. 

[pstall]

23 hours ago, LinvilleGorge said:

We've heard these defensive versatility stories before...

Rivera when he was hired:

[paraphrasing] Our defense will feature aspects of both the 4-3 and 3-4.

Reality:

We've always played a pure 4-3

Rivera after Shaq was drafted:

[paraphrasing] Shaq will give us the versatility to stay in our base defense more often.

Reality:

We played the same way on D and Shaq was simply a backup LB.

Oh, and remember this one:

"Despite his 6-foot-4, 323-pound frame, Butler is considered one of the most versatile defensive linemen in this year's draft. Not only does Gettleman covet big players, but Carolina's coaches prefer guys who can play multiple spots. In his four years at Louisiana Tech, Butler played end, three technique and nose tackle."

 

[MadHatter]

11 hours ago, Hoenheim said:

This is exactly what I was thinking for the entire draft after DJ Moore. More of the same poo. I knew it would just continue when we skipped on Justin Reid in the 2nd, which alot of people were projected us to take in the 1st round lol.

Nothings going to change unless Rivera and Hurney get fired. 

I mean, I'd love to be suprised and for all these guys to work out. But bringing in about 20 different nickle CBs since Norman left and trying to play them everywhere on the field hasnt been working going on 2+ years. 

They say doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results, is the definition of insanity. 

You mean that Justin Reid that was passed over until the 3rd round?  Maybe he just isn’t as good as everyone in here wanted him to bed.