Just how bad will the 2018 OL be?

[MHS831]

First of all, Happy Easter and this is not an April Fool's stunt. 

Since I saw the topics on here ranging from Wing's understandable rage in his "Screw Disney" thread to one about Greg Hardy playing arena football, I thought I would get us focused on the real issues.  Many are concerned about the WRs, others the DBs--and a few are uptight about the tight ends.  I get that, and feel your pain.  As much as I dislike Hurney, he has done a good job bringing in some budget talent at WR and DB that makes us better now than we were last year.  He got Peppers back, and that was huge.  I think the Poe signing will pay off.  For the most part, we can assume that we will address S, WR, and CB in the draft-possibly taking us from mediocre to good at spots that were weaknesses.  I even  see a shiny new TE in Santa's bag. 

The Offensive Line:  But not much has been done to address the OL

So let's analyze each OL position: 

Right Tackle:  First of all, I was raving all season about Williams at RT.  No wasted motion; total control.  One of the best RTs in the NFL, and that is not an exaggeration.   Lock him up, Marty.  Depth:  We really  don't have any with  Moton at G, but Duane Clausell seems to be a name you hear as the 3rd or 4th T.  Sirles and Banner are also options.

Right Guard:  Aside from having Fletcher Cox eat his lunch one Sunday, Turner is solid.  I do think , however, we paid the wrong Guard, but Turner is solid.  Depth:  Sirles, Silatolu, Larsen, Van Roten

Center: Let's assume Kalil will be healthy and note that the team performed better when he was in the lineup for the most part.  If he fails to heal, we have a serviceable backup. 33 is not that old for a C.  I do believe if Ryan is healthy he is going to be decent.  Depth: Larsen, Van Roten

So the right side of the line is actually one of the best in the NFL.

Left Guard:  When we signed Sirles, Banner, and there was talk of Larsen at LG, I was a bit nervous and outraged because it meant  we would have  either a bad player or a rookie at LG.  When Rivera contradicted his previous statement (about Moton being a Tackle) I was relieved.  First of all, it was a no brainer, which does not always  exclude  Rivera from making the wrong choice, but  secondly, Guard  is Moton's position.  Although he played tackle at WMU for 3 seasons, he  played G his junior year, something that impressed his college coach: "Then he played offensive guard his junior year, and he was a very dominant performer getting a push in the middle in the run game while giving us a stout pocket in pass protection."   Another website refers to a game that year vs. Ohio State, and how he dominated their  interior defensive linemen. Moton was a good OT, but his best position  was Guard--he was just needed at RT most of the time.  At LG, Moton brings intelligence and power--what we just lost. Depth:  Sirles, Silatolu, Larsen, Van Roten

Left Tackle: We have the #4 overall pick from his draft at LT--a man on a $55m contract.  With  Moton at LG, we have nothing behind  him, unless you believe in  Amini Silatolu like Rivera does.  We need a developmental LT in the draft.  However, can Norv protect Cam if we have 4 of 5 OL playing at a high level?  Probably.  If we have 3 of 5 we have a problem.  We need to draft a deveopmental LT, someone in the fifth round.  Brandon Parker (NC A&T), Austin Corbett (Nevada), Jamarco Jones (Ohio State), Joseph Noteboom (TCU) are all collegiate LTs who should be available in the fifth round.  Depth: Taylor Moton.  If Kalil goes down, we would most certainly move Moton to T and bring in a G---like Wharton.

Analysis:  This is potentially a very solid OL with the exception of LT. But I think Norv will do some things to help Kalil reach a level of mediocrity that has somehow avoided him.  That is where the 2 TE sets come in.  I see Armah or another TE lining up at the wing.  I see our RB/FB  helping on the left side.  Matt Kalil was healthy in 2017, so we saw his best. 

I see no way we improve the LT this season, but if we are hitting on 4 cylinders, we should be Ok.  Last year, we had Williams in his first year as a starter, Turner was dinged and sat a few games, Kalil was out most of the season, and we still had Matt, which is an appropriate name for him.

Now, isn't this better than a Greg Hardy Arena League Highlight post?  No?

 

[MHS831]

11 minutes ago, Marcogreenbush said:

Oline and secoundary will be our biggest problems once again . 

That is how it appears, but I think WR was our biggest weakness in 2017, followed by the secondary. 

I think we have about a 70% chance of drafting a WR in round 1--If Ridley or Moore is there, that is the pick.  Our WR corps will be very good--when have we ever said that?  Moose and Smith?

In the second round, we will go S, CB, or RB in all probability.  I am guessing a S.

In the third round, RB and TE.

That means that we may not draft a CB that can come in right away and help--and that is not as bad as it seems. 

Here is why  I think so:  Our CBs are babies  for the most part.  They need to develop.  Without a DC that blitzes every down, they can play more zone CB, what they are wired to do.   Bradberry and Cockrell is not that bad...Too  many people have given up on Bradberry--that is a mistake.  He will be better in 2018 for this reason.  Cockrell is a huge step above Worley.

Worley  was picked on so often, we rolled a S to his side quite a bit (as best I could tell on TV).  Since we were blitzing a lot, that put Bradberry in a situation where he had limited to no S help.  He could not be beaten deep, so they started running the digs and slants to his side.  Bradberry will be OK when we balance things out.  Trust me!

[mc52beast]

Don’t really need an all star o-line when you have a qb that can take the kind of hits Cam takes... 

 

Shula was like “ let them defensive muther fuggers eat”

[thennek]

I agree that O-line is a big concern specifically as you mention at C, LG and LT. It seems like every year O-line is a concern for the Panthers though.  

I’m beginning to wonder if there aren’t that many good offensive lineman available anymore. Perhaps colleges are not preparing O-lineman for the NFL any longer. How many other teams in the NFL struggle to have solid O-lines just like the Panthers do?  

 It’s been many years since the Panthers have had an effective power running game without Cam being a big part of it.  And I think this is byproduct of having an ineffective offensive line. Cam  is not getting any younger and if the Panthers want to win the Super Bowl they better figure this out as we don’t need our franchise quarterback being a battering ram anymore. 

[MHS831]

28 minutes ago, thennek said:

I agree that O-line is a big concern specifically as you mention at C, LG and LT. It seems like every year O-line is a concern for the Panthers though.  

I’m beginning to wonder if there aren’t that many good offensive lineman available anymore. Perhaps colleges are not preparing O-lineman for the NFL any longer. How many other teams in the NFL struggle to have solid O-lines just like the Panthers do?  

 It’s been many years since the Panthers have had an effective power running game without Cam being a big part of it.  And I think this is byproduct of having an ineffective offensive line. Cam  is not getting any younger and if the Panthers want to win the Super Bowl they better figure this out as we don’t need our franchise quarterback being a battering ram anymore. 

You are right about the scarcity of OL.  It seems the NFL has to keep adapting to the college game based on the talent.   We are a bit misinformed about our OL because Cam inflates the rushing stats and avoids sacks.  But I think we are 1 player (LT) away from  being good across the LOS and I think we could have decent depth.

[Moo Daeng]

They were in the better half last year and will likely be about the same again. Ok to good but not great.

[Smithers]

Should easily be top 30 in the league this year.  

[Hoenheim]

You cant assume Ryan will be healthy, hes been banged up for 2 years straight. 

We have big questions at LT, LG, and C if Ryan isnt healthy again. 

I'm somehow hoping that Matt Kalil performs alot better. We dont know who the LG will be at this point, Moton , Sirles, draft pick? Probably a competition for the starting spot. Could be a disaster if Matt Kalil is still bad and we end up getting bad LG play too.

[panther4life]

My biggest question is if they think Moton can play Guard then why did Amini start 3 games for Turner when he was out last year?

[Paa Langfart]

I don't think O line is going to be as big a problem as some of you think.  Unlike Shula ,  Norv will be able to recognize his Offenses strengths and weaknesses and adjust accordingly.

[Paa Langfart]

1 hour ago, panther4life said:

My biggest question is if they think Moton can play Guard then why did Amini start 3 games for Turner when he was out last year?

You obviously haven't seen Rivera coach before.

[Moo Daeng]

12 minutes ago, Paa Langfart said:

You obviously haven't seen Rivera coach before.

You don't impress the halfwits who frequent message boards. Odds say you  can't educate a guy coaching in the NFL for 19 years. Go for it.

[MHS831]

1 hour ago, panther4life said:

My biggest question is if they think Moton can play Guard then why did Amini start 3 games for Turner when he was out last year?

Good question.  For some reason Rivera thinks  Silatolu is a player.  Several weeks ago, Rivera said, "Moton is a Tackle"  when asked about the chance Moton would play G.  Recently,, he said he  would compete at G....Someone got to him.  I personally do not think Rivera has an eye for talent beyond the front 7.  That is OK, just listen to your experts.

Ryan Kalil should not be laying on a full salary this year.  The fact that they have already paid him a bonus for the season suggests they will pay the full salary.  Marty is the same old Marty--promoting and rewarding the players he picked to make himself look good.  IF Kalil is healed, he would be 33--not that old.  The fact that he is saying ""this is my last year.: is concerning to me.  Maybe Marty is great with it, but there is no way we get $9m worth out of him.

[panther4life]

1 hour ago, MHS831 said:

Good question.  For some reason Rivera thinks  Silatolu is a player.  Several weeks ago, Rivera said, "Moton is a Tackle"  when asked about the chance Moton would play G.  Recently,, he said he  would compete at G....Someone got to him.  I personally do not think Rivera has an eye for talent beyond the front 7.  That is OK, just listen to your experts.

Ryan Kalil should not be laying on a full salary this year.  The fact that they have already paid him a bonus for the season suggests they will pay the full salary.  Marty is the same old Marty--promoting and rewarding the players he picked to make himself look good.  IF Kalil is healed, he would be 33--not that old.  The fact that he is saying ""this is my last year.: is concerning to me.  Maybe Marty is great with it, but there is no way we get $9m worth out of him.

Yea I think Rivera was just doing typical coach speak when he said he'd compete at LG. Hasd he named him the starter thats completely different. 

I don't fault Hurney for keeping Kalil. The net savings to cutting him would only have been about half of his cap number. At that point its easy to justify keeping him as we really don't have a better place to use that 4.5 million quite frankly.