Panthers continue to hold out for Hurney

[Mr. Scot]

1 minute ago, Jon Snow said:

This exact scenario has been I had read was the case behind the scenes at BOA.  We are about to witness the final act of Jerry Richardson and the Marty Hurney era.

God have mercy on our souls.

Here or elsewhere?

(you don't necessarily have to say, just asking)

[Jon Snow]

1 minute ago, Mr. Scot said:

Here or elsewhere?

(you don't necessarily have to say, just asking)

Typo, meant to type feared.  I'm on a phone and 3 beers in.

[Palmetto]

IF Hurney is not named GM thats when i'll be surprised

[Mr. Scot]

Friday is "news dump" day, when NFL teams dump stories they'd prefer not get much attention on the media and then run and hide for the weekend.

That'd probably be a good day for a "hey we hired Marty again see ya" story.

[DaveThePanther2008]

58 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

Got permission to share what I've heard.

Let me stress again up front that I personally do not have any inside sources. What I'm going to share here was given to me by someone who does, and a very legitimate source at that.

No, I'm not going to say who told me this or who they got it from. They may choose to do that themselves at some point, but I'm not going to make that decision for them. I offered instead to share what they knew while protecting their anonymity, and they agreed. If you choose not to believe it, your decision. Doesn't bother me either way.

I've had other people tell me "inside info" that turned out to be BS before which is why I generally don't share that kind of thing unless I feel certain it's reliable. I'm comfortable in this case that it's legit.

So here goes...

___________________________

In your life or your career, you've probably known somebody who desperately wanted to be good at something - and maybe even worked very hard at it - but for whatever reason  just wasn't.

I think that's a fitting characterization of Marty Hurney.

Hurney basically isn't a great football mind. He certainly wants to be, and he tries to be. He was even mentored by one, but he just doesn't have what it takes. Unfortunately, Hurney's attempts to do something brilliant manifest themselves as him coming up with a lot of crazy ideas that ultimately just don't pan out.

Stuff like keeping two kickers, trading high future picks, drafting guys like Amini Silatolu and signing Brad Kaaya would likely be examples. Kaaya is one that was specifically mentioned to me by my source. Apparently Hurney thought Kaaya was something really special. He's not, and thankfully that project was over before it really began. Still, it cost us Joe Webb.

And it would seem, sadly, that this is a common occurrence.

Per the info, Marty tends to get a lot of crazy ideas that somebody (usually someone from the scouting department) has to talk him out of. How frequently does this happen? The word my source used was "consistently". That means the people under him really have to be on their toes, and have to work harder than they should to keep the boss from screwing things up.

The situation sounds a lot like a sitcom with a bumbling boss who's always coming up with hare-brained ideas that his more knowledgeable employees have to somehow put a stop to. The boss in these stories tends to think he's smarter than he really is, and smarter than his employees, which is what leads to comedy on TV, but failure in real life.

One of the prime examples of this is a topic that's been discussed on here before.

My source confirmed that yes, Marty Hurney was indeed trying to trade a future first round pick to move up and get Jimmy Clausen. That ultimately didn't happen, but it wasn't because Marty was unwilling to pull the trigger. Per the story, Hurney was convinced enough that Clausen was a franchise QB that he  was cocked, locked and ready to rock.

So why didn't it happen? Not because Marty changed his mind on his own. It was because people from the scouting department were trying desperately to talk him out of it. And lucky for all involved, they succeeded.

Other tidbits include that the current atmosphere in the Panthers offices in the wake of the Richardson scandal is highly dysfunctional. That, and the fact that age has indeed taken a toll on Jerry Richardson himself. This source described him as "slipping away" over the last five to ten years or so. Given the current scandal, that's not hard to believe at all.

Basically, we're in Al Davis territory. And our version of Al wants to leave the franchise in the hands of a guy that his other employees are consistently having to talk out of doing something that's a bad idea.

Oy...

I already wasn't a big fan of Marty Hurney based on his past performance. Since hearing this, the idea of Marty being in charge again has reached "hell no" levels of unwanted for me.

But with an owner who's not totally in his right mind (and who wasn't exactly known for making great choices even before that) it's a good possibility that's exactly what's going to happen.

Thanks Mr. Scot.  I have always felt what you just stated.  If it weren't for bunch of good scouts we would be worse than Cleveland.

You don't even have to believe me.  Go look at his draft picks.   2nd round picks should almost always be starters if not contributors.   Eric Shelton, Dwayne Jarrett and A Edwards just to name a few.   This list is full of guys that never even saw the field and they were picked far ahead of players we could have really used.  

I like Hurney but as a professional football GM, he sucks.   I remember back when he was originally hired Hurney was mentioned to be a CAP Guru and we saw where that went.

We are about 10 days away from the Combine.  We need a GM in place to pay attention.  Than again if we can get through the Combine without Hurney than he won't fall in love with Western Central Northwest University Left Tackle that beat up on 175lb Defense Ends.  All because he has potential.

JR got a suggestion for you.  Keep him on the staff and let him announce our 1st round pick.  He's Solid there.  Than Dawson for the "Real GM" work.

[tondi]

So Marty Hurney is the Michael Scott of NFL GMs?  Sounds about right.  At least Michael Scott was funny.  

[Mr. Scot]

4 minutes ago, DaveThePanther2008 said:

Thanks Mr. Scot.  I have always felt what you just stated.  If it weren't for bunch of good scouts we would be worse than Cleveland.

You don't even have to believe me.  Go look at his draft picks.   2nd round picks should almost always be starters if not contributors.   Eric Shelton, Dwayne Jarrett and A Edwards just to name a few.   This list is full of guys that never even saw the field and they were picked far ahead of players we could have really used.  

I like Hurney but as a professional football GM, he sucks.   I remember back when he was originally hired Hurney was mentioned to be a CAP Guru and we saw where that went.

We are about 10 days away from the Combine.  We need a GM in place to pay attention.  Than again if we can get through the Combine without Hurney than he won't fall in love with Western Central Northwest University Left Tackle that beat up on 175lb Defense Ends.  All because he has potential.

JR got a suggestion for you.  Keep him on the staff and let him announce our 1st round pick.  He's Solid there.  Than Dawson for the "Real GM" work.

My source didn't mention this, but there's been speculation before that Cam and Luke were actually "Rivera picks".

Is there any truth to that?  No idea. 

It is true that a head coach isn't necessarily a bad guy to consult when it comes to first rounders.

Beyond the first round though? Hell no!

I remember an interview some years back with a successful longtime GM who accepted that his job was to get the kind of player the head coach wanted, but who absolutely hated when coaches got involved in the scouting process.  He especially hated when they looked at a highlight reel of some guy and said "man, we gotta have him" without getting the whole picture.

Coaches aren't scouts.  They don't go deep into the draft pool looking at guys who might be available in the sixth round.  That's what scouting departments and, theoretically, GMs are for.

[DaveThePanther2008]

20 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

My source didn't mention this, but there's been speculation before that Cam and Luke were actually "Rivera picks".

Is there any truth to that?  No idea. 

It is true that a head coach isn't necessarily a bad guy to consult when it comes to first rounders.

Beyond the first round though? Hell no!

I remember an interview some years back with a successful longtime GM who accepted that his job was to get the kind of player the head coach wanted, but who absolutely hated when coaches got involved in the scouting process.  He especially hated when they looked at a highlight reel of some guy and said "man, we gotta have him" without getting the whole picture.

Coaches aren't scouts.  They don't go deep into the draft pool looking at guys who might be available in the sixth round.  That's what scouting departments and, theoretically, GMs are for.

Makes sense but a GM should be listening to his scouts as well.  They get paid to give a good insight into what we can expect from a particular player.   I get the feeling, based on what you wrote, that Hurney falls in love with a player and regardless of what his scouts tell him he picks who he wants.

Agreed?

[Black&Blue]

I still don't have a clear answer as to who is doing the hiring.  It's a very confusing, dysfunctional situation.  I can't find anything to compare it to.  

 

[Mr. Scot]

12 minutes ago, DaveThePanther2008 said:

Makes sense but a GM should be listening to his scouts as well.  They get paid to give a good insight into what we can expect from a particular player.   I get the feeling, based on what you wrote, that Hurney falls in love with a player and regardless of what his scouts tell him he picks who he wants.

Agreed?

Yeah, which I'd be okay with if I trusted his judgment on that kind of thing.

Since I don't, oy...

[TheSpecialJuan]

2 hours ago, Palmetto said:

IF Hurney is not named GM thats when i'll be surprised

right

[AceBoogie]

What’s stupid is actually attempting to hire a new gm right now. 

[AceBoogie]

7 hours ago, Mr. Scot said:

Got permission to share what I've heard...

Let me stress again up front that I personally do not have any inside sources. What I'm going to share here was given to me by someone who does, and a very legitimate source at that.

No, I'm not going to say who told me this or who they got it from. They may choose to do that themselves at some point, but I'm not going to make that decision for them. I offered instead to share what they knew while protecting their anonymity, and they agreed. If you choose not to believe it, your decision. Doesn't bother me either way.

I've had other people tell me "inside info" that turned out to be BS before which is why I generally don't share that kind of thing unless I feel certain it's reliable. I'm comfortable in this case that it's legit.

So here goes...
___________________________

In your life or your career, you've probably run across somebody who desperately wanted to be good at something - and maybe even worked very hard at it - but for whatever reason  just wasn't.

I think that's a fitting characterization of Marty Hurney.

Hurney basically isn't a great football mind. He certainly wants to be, tries to be, and may believe that he is. He was even mentored by one (Beathard) but sadly Marty just doesn't have what it takes. Doesn't stop him from trying, though.  Unfortunately, his attempts to do something brilliant tend to manifest themselves as him coming up with a lot of crazy ideas that ultimately just don't pan out.

Stuff like trading high future picks, keeping two kickers, drafting guys like Amini Silatolu and signing a player like Brad Kaaya would likely be good examples. Kaaya is one that was specifically mentioned to me by my source. Apparently Hurney thought Kaaya was something really special. He's not, and thankfully that project was over before it really began. Still, it cost us Joe Webb.

And it would seem, sadly, that this sort of thing is a common occurrence.

Per the info, Marty tends to get a lot of crazy ideas that somebody (usually someone from the scouting department) has to talk him out of. How frequently does this happen? The word my source used was "consistently". That means the people under him really have to be on their toes, and have to work harder than they should to keep the boss from screwing things up.

The situation sounds a lot like a sitcom with a bumbling boss who's always coming up with hare brained ideas that his more knowledgeable employees have to somehow put a stop to. The boss in these stories tends to think he's smarter than he really is - and smarter than his underlings - which is what leads to comedy on TV, failure in real life.

One of the prime examples of this is a topic that's been discussed on here before.

My source confirmed that yes, Marty Hurney was indeed trying to trade a future first round pick to move up and get Jimmy Clausen. That ultimately didn't happen, but it wasn't because Marty was unwilling to pull the trigger. Per the story, Hurney was convinced enough that Clausen was a franchise QB that he was cocked, locked and ready to rock.

So why didn't it happen? Well, not because Marty changed his mind on his own. It was because people from the scouting department were trying desperately to talk him out of it. Lucky for all involved, they succeeded.

Other tidbits include that the current atmosphere of the Panther offices in the wake of the Richardson scandal is highly dysfunctional. That, and the fact that age has indeed taken a toll on Jerry Richardson himself. This source described him as "slipping away" over the last five to ten years or so. Given the current scandal, that's not hard to believe at all.

Basically, we're firmly in Al Davis territory. And our version of Al wants to leave the franchise in the hands of a guy that his other employees are consistently having to talk out of doing something that's a bad idea.

Oy...

I already wasn't a big fan of Marty Hurney based on his past performance. Since hearing this, the idea of Marty being in charge again has reached "hell no" levels of unwanted for me.

But with an owner who likes him, and who's not totally in his right mind (and who wasn't exactly known for making great choices even before) it's a good possibility that's exactly what's going to happen.

All made up bullshit to further push your agenda

[The Natural]

I'll confer with my source and if he gives me the "all clear" I'll let you guys in on some CRAZY details.  Let's just say Dave Gettleman probably won't retain his position in NY for much longer once the investigation pivots.