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The case to release Ryan Kalil, JStew, and CJ

MHS831

By MHS831,
in Carolina Panthers

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MHS831 Grand Master

MHS831

Posted
Posted

Ryan Kalil has missed 18 games in 2 seasons, playing in a total of 15 games (including playoffs) at a cost of over $20m.  Worth it? 

2017 6 games

2016 8 games

http://www.nfl.com/player/ryankalil/2495655/profile

Ryan has already announced his plan to play another season, which if you follow the recent trend, means we should expect 4 games from him.  (kidding?) His cap figure  is over $10m, but we save about $7m for  sending him away now. 

http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/carolina-panthers/ryan-kalil-1229/

Jonathan Stewart Has averaged more than 4 yards per carry 2 of the last 6 seasons, and his progress is aligned with the research about the decline of running backs.  http://www.espn.com/blog/nflnation/post/_/id/123542/inside-slant-running-back-cliff-after-age-27

Using this as a basic formula, Stewart, whose total yardage is higher than the average, is likely to average somewhere between 3.0 and 3.2 yards per carry in 2018.  During Stewart's first five season, he averaged close to 5.0 yards per carry.

http://www.espn.com/nfl/player/stats/_/id/11247/jonathan-stewart

Charles Johnson made or assisted in 54 tackles and had 4 sacks--over the past 3 seasons.  To put that into perspective, the three seasons before that, he had 113 tackles and 32 sacks.  Wes Horton, fwiw,  playing behind CJ over the past 3 seasons (fewer snaps) had 35 tackles and 9 sacks over the same 3-year period.  

http://www.nfl.com/player/charlesjohnson/2507187/profile

Cap Savings to release all 3 players: approximately $13.75m

  • Ryan Kalil: $6.8 m
  • Charles Johnson: $3.25 m
  • Jonathan Stewart: $3.7 m

While Marty would never release his "big name" draft picks, a new GM might.

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Doc Holiday Veteran

Doc Holiday

Posted
Posted
6 minutes ago, MHS831 said:

Ryan Kalil has missed 18 games in 2 seasons, playing in a total of 15 games (including playoffs) at a cost of over $20m.  Worth it? 

2017 6 games

2016 8 games

http://www.nfl.com/player/ryankalil/2495655/profile

Ryan has already announced his plan to play another season, which if you follow the recent trend, means we should expect 4 games from him.  (kidding?) His cap figure  is over $10m, but we save about $7m for  sending him away now. 

http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/carolina-panthers/ryan-kalil-1229/

Jonathan Stewart Has averaged more than 4 yards per carry 2 of the last 6 seasons, and his progress is aligned with the research about the decline of running backs.  http://www.espn.com/blog/nflnation/post/_/id/123542/inside-slant-running-back-cliff-after-age-27

Using this as a basic formula, Stewart, whose total yardage is higher than the average, is likely to average somewhere between 3.0 and 3.2 yards per carry in 2018.  During Stewart's first five season, he averaged close to 5.0 yards per carry.

http://www.espn.com/nfl/player/stats/_/id/11247/jonathan-stewart

Charles Johnson made or assisted in 54 tackles and had 4 sacks--over the past 3 seasons.  To put that into perspective, the three seasons before that, he had 113 tackles and 32 sacks.  Wes Horton, fwiw,  playing behind CJ over the past 3 seasons (fewer snaps) had 35 tackles and 9 sacks over the same 3-year period.  

http://www.nfl.com/player/charlesjohnson/2507187/profile

Cap Savings to release all 3 players: approximately $13.75m

  • Ryan Kalil: $6.8 m
  • Charles Johnson: $3.25 m
  • Jonathan Stewart: $3.7 m

While Marty would never release his "big name" draft picks, a new GM might.

Made a thread calling for the same players to be cut week after the season. would be very curious to see if it happens. 

Kalil is the only one that when on the field has played at a high level, the other not so much. PS if you dont think Stewart could be replaced with a mid-tier FA running back you have another thing coming.

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therealmjl Grand Master

therealmjl

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Posted
Just now, Ace_Aladdin said:

Idk about Kalil but yes for them and maybe add:

Adams

Colin Jones

Dickson

Gano

This should free enough cap space to extend Star & Norwell  while adding dcecent FA.

Adams was literally the only person in our secondary who brought it every single week. He may be a dinosaur, but he isn’t going anywhere.

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Ricky Spanish Grand Master

Ricky Spanish

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Posted
5 minutes ago, rhyslloyd said:

Cutting CJ and Stew shouldn't even be a question.  Kalil obviously has the injury concerns, but IF he somehow manages to stay healthy for his last season, he's a top center in the league and produces as such.  

Agreed. As frustrating as it's been with Kalil's injuries the past two years, We look like a different team when he is at C. I have no issues releasing Stew and CJ because the production just isn't there, but I am just not sure if releasing Kalil is within the team's best interests. 

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Riverboat Ron Mentor

Riverboat Ron

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Unless Kalil gets cut and re-signs for a team friendly deal I think we need to move on. I'd rather use that $7 million to bring back Norwell and draft a Center rather than spend $10 million on an often injured, aging player who has one year left. We know we have to replace both Matt and Ryan by 2019 so why lose Norwell and surround either Moton, a rookie or God help us Silatolu with speed bump and a center that plays less than 8 games? This draft is also decent at OG and C.

 

Johnson...bye Felicia!

 

Stewart back on a team friendly number or draft a RB. Also a solid RB draft.

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grimesgoat Experienced

grimesgoat

Posted
Posted
20 minutes ago, Ace_Aladdin said:

Idk about Kalil but yes for them and maybe add:

Adams

Colin Jones

Dickson

Gano

This should free enough cap space to extend Star & Norwell  while adding dcecent FA.

Cutting Adams and Jones is worth about 3m.  Finding similar talent will probably cost the same or more.

We can't cut Dickson/Gano - they are free agents. 

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Zaximus Veteran

Zaximus

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Posted

All three need to go.    CJ needs to go, and be gone, he brings nothing sadly, he's done.    Stewart I wouldn't mind bringing back on a better deal.    Kalil the same, because he's getting paid too much for the injury history he brings.    It also comes down to if Kalil's contract prevents us from signing a key young player or making a needed FA signing.     As fun as the "retirement tour" is with him/Pep/TD, it's not worth sacrificing our future.     We couldn't run well with Kalil in, we couldn't run well with him not there, I didn't see a big difference in Larson this year to be honest.

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grimesgoat Experienced

grimesgoat

Posted
Posted
38 minutes ago, MHS831 said:

Ryan Kalil has missed 18 games in 2 seasons, playing in a total of 15 games (including playoffs) at a cost of over $20m.  Worth it? 

2017 6 games

2016 8 games

http://www.nfl.com/player/ryankalil/2495655/profile

Ryan has already announced his plan to play another season, which if you follow the recent trend, means we should expect 4 games from him.  (kidding?) His cap figure  is over $10m, but we save about $7m for  sending him away now. 

http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/carolina-panthers/ryan-kalil-1229/

Jonathan Stewart Has averaged more than 4 yards per carry 2 of the last 6 seasons, and his progress is aligned with the research about the decline of running backs.  http://www.espn.com/blog/nflnation/post/_/id/123542/inside-slant-running-back-cliff-after-age-27

Using this as a basic formula, Stewart, whose total yardage is higher than the average, is likely to average somewhere between 3.0 and 3.2 yards per carry in 2018.  During Stewart's first five season, he averaged close to 5.0 yards per carry.

http://www.espn.com/nfl/player/stats/_/id/11247/jonathan-stewart

Charles Johnson made or assisted in 54 tackles and had 4 sacks--over the past 3 seasons.  To put that into perspective, the three seasons before that, he had 113 tackles and 32 sacks.  Wes Horton, fwiw,  playing behind CJ over the past 3 seasons (fewer snaps) had 35 tackles and 9 sacks over the same 3-year period.  

http://www.nfl.com/player/charlesjohnson/2507187/profile

Cap Savings to release all 3 players: approximately $13.75m

  • Ryan Kalil: $6.8 m
  • Charles Johnson: $3.25 m
  • Jonathan Stewart: $3.7 m

While Marty would never release his "big name" draft picks, a new GM might.

I think cutting Johnson is a no brainer.  There is no dead money hit and we free 3+ million to help pay for Peppers.  Peppers, Addison, Horton, Hall, Cox, Obada isn't a bad base.

I'd probably keep Stewie around for one more year, but reduce his role.  He may look better in Norv's system and he can be our short yardage / goal line guy.  He'll be overpaid, but he's family.

Kalil is the tough one.  His cap hit is 9.6m but he's basically playing for 6.8m cash including 4.5m in base salary.  I'd give him 1m to restructure and cut his base salary to 1.5m , and add an extra year at a base of 2m.  That frees 2m, and reduces his cap hit to around 7m with a dead cap next year of .5m.  He gets 4.8m out of his 6.8m and avoids being cut.

We may need as much as 10m to keep Norwell.  I would not commit that kind of money to a G after giving Turner a big contract.  My preference would be to draft an NFL ready C/G this year in the first or second.  Let him play G for a year, learn from Kalil, then slide over to C in 2019.

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UpstatePanther Newbie

UpstatePanther

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The only one I feel like absolutely needs to go is CJ. He's done. Period. He's been a ghost for like 3 years. I want to keep Stew here on a team friendly deal for a year or two with the understanding that we want his leadership, but his playing time will take a reduced role. Kalil I am torn on. We don't have his heir apparent. Our offense is a completely different (and better) animal when he is in the game. The problem is that he can't stay in the game. Because he's already said he will retire after this year, I'm tempted to keep him and let him play out his career in dignity. He's worth that much. But we need to find a long-term replacement for him this year.

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