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Ted Ginn 2.0

MHS831

By MHS831,
in Carolina Panthers

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MHS831 Grand Master

MHS831

Posted
Posted

Just an observation, but I hear us talking about getting a deep threat WR, like we had in Ted Ginn.  We drafted a player like Ginn. 

We have Ted Ginn 2.0, don't we?  Curtis Samuel.  I don't think he was being used the same way, when he was healthy.  I realize some of you are going to refer to his injuries, etc., but one season does not mean squat.

  • College:  Both-Ohio State
  • Combine 40 time:  Ginn 4.28; Samuel 4.31
  • Height:  Both 5' 11"
  • Weight:  Ginn 180; Samuel 195
  • Strengths:  Athleticism, speed
  • Weaknesses:  Route running, hands
  • Draft: Ginn 1st round; Samuel 2nd round

The difference?  At Ohio State, Samuel was listed as a running back because "Swiss army knife"  is not a position.  So Samuel, despite the injuries, had a challenging transition from college to NFL.  He is also a bit raw, needing time to develop his hands and route running...Ginn has struggled with those 2 things his entire career.  Ginn was never more than a #4 WR before coming to Charlotte, so give Samuel some time. 

Having said that, we need 2 WRs that can get deep, not one--that keeps the safeties honest or requires a CB to run with 4.3 speed. So I think Samuel in the slot, Funchess as the #2 WR, and a stallion as the #1 WR is the design.  

Damiere Byrd: Yes, I know we think he is fragile, and he might be, but as for his speed, Byrd ran a 4.27 at his pro day.  He has pretty good hands and has been developing his skills as a WR.

So, my question is (and it is a sincere question): Can these 2 WRs become deep threats?  If so, do we need another speed WR?  Is the need to simply continue developing Samuel and Byrd?  

I am interested to learn what the response here is because it has a lot to do with my mock drafting, so it is urgent.

(Full disclosure:  I am of the mindset that we need another stud TE and the WR we draft should be a player with solid hands, excellent route running skills, and the ability to get separation out of cuts.)

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BrianS Veteran

BrianS

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I don't get the feeling that anyone here (or at BoA) "has it out" for Byrd or Samuel.  In fact, I think most folks believe that, barring injury, they could both become actual NFL receivers.  Everyone likes their measurables.

The concern here, I believe, is that they are not proven quantities, and we continue to put most or all of our chips on "potential" instead of finding a handful of proven players to take us to the next level.

 

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d-dave Veteran

d-dave

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I love both Byrd and Samuel.  I think the potential is there.  But healthy competition is good.  Someone has to push these guys to success. For Byrd, was it just really bad luck?  Or is he fragile?  For Samuel, he has to re-learn to do a lot of things and he missed a ton of time with his hamstrings.  

Hopefully both pan out, but I'm not going to count on their production until it happens.

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Ace_Aladdin Newbie

Ace_Aladdin

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21 minutes ago, MHS831 said:

Just an observation, but I hear us talking about getting a deep threat WR, like we had in Ted Ginn.  We drafted a player like Ginn. 

We have Ted Ginn 2.0, don't we?  Curtis Samuel.  I don't think he was being used the same way, when he was healthy.  I realize some of you are going to refer to his injuries, etc., but one season does not mean squat.

  • College:  Both-Ohio State
  • Combine 40 time:  Ginn 4.28; Samuel 4.31
  • Height:  Both 5' 11"
  • Weight:  Ginn 180; Samuel 195
  • Strengths:  Athleticism, speed
  • Weaknesses:  Route running, hands
  • Draft: Ginn 1st round; Samuel 2nd round

The difference?  At Ohio State, Samuel was listed as a running back because "Swiss army knife"  is not a position.  So Samuel, despite the injuries, had a challenging transition from college to NFL.  He is also a bit raw, needing time to develop his hands and route running...Ginn has struggled with those 2 things his entire career.  Ginn was never more than a #4 WR before coming to Charlotte, so give Samuel some time. 

Having said that, we need 2 WRs that can get deep, not one--that keeps the safeties honest or requires a CB to run with 4.3 speed. So I think Samuel in the slot, Funchess as the #2 WR, and a stallion as the #1 WR is the design.  

Damiere Byrd: Yes, I know we think he is fragile, and he might be, but as for his speed, Byrd ran a 4.27 at his pro day.  He has pretty good hands and has been developing his skills as a WR.

So, my question is (and it is a sincere question): Can these 2 WRs become deep threats?  If so, do we need another speed WR?  Is the need to simply continue developing Samuel and Byrd?  

I am interested to learn what the response here is because it has a lot to do with my mock drafting, so it is urgent.

(Full disclosure:  I am of the mindset that we need another stud TE and the WR we draft should be a player with solid hands, excellent route running skills, and the ability to get separation out of cuts.)

 

Byrd & Samuel are perfect pair for this offense to compliment Greg,Funchess & power running game. I believe Samuel takes a huge step this coming season having a full off-season to get his body molded for the pro game, hell look at how much Byrd bulked up after cpl of seasons.

 

2nd TE who can block and catch will do wonders for this offense with ability to go to run or pass at any given situation.

Draft:

TE

RB

FS

C

 

 

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jbland Rising Star

jbland

Posted
Posted
29 minutes ago, MHS831 said:

Just an observation, but I hear us talking about getting a deep threat WR, like we had in Ted Ginn.  We drafted a player like Ginn. 

We have Ted Ginn 2.0, don't we?  Curtis Samuel.  I don't think he was being used the same way, when he was healthy.  I realize some of you are going to refer to his injuries, etc., but one season does not mean squat.

  • College:  Both-Ohio State
  • Combine 40 time:  Ginn 4.28; Samuel 4.31
  • Height:  Both 5' 11"
  • Weight:  Ginn 180; Samuel 195
  • Strengths:  Athleticism, speed
  • Weaknesses:  Route running, hands
  • Draft: Ginn 1st round; Samuel 2nd round

The difference?  At Ohio State, Samuel was listed as a running back because "Swiss army knife"  is not a position.  So Samuel, despite the injuries, had a challenging transition from college to NFL.  He is also a bit raw, needing time to develop his hands and route running...Ginn has struggled with those 2 things his entire career.  Ginn was never more than a #4 WR before coming to Charlotte, so give Samuel some time. 

Having said that, we need 2 WRs that can get deep, not one--that keeps the safeties honest or requires a CB to run with 4.3 speed. So I think Samuel in the slot, Funchess as the #2 WR, and a stallion as the #1 WR is the design.  

Damiere Byrd: Yes, I know we think he is fragile, and he might be, but as for his speed, Byrd ran a 4.27 at his pro day.  He has pretty good hands and has been developing his skills as a WR.

So, my question is (and it is a sincere question): Can these 2 WRs become deep threats?  If so, do we need another speed WR?  Is the need to simply continue developing Samuel and Byrd?  

I am interested to learn what the response here is because it has a lot to do with my mock drafting, so it is urgent.

(Full disclosure:  I am of the mindset that we need another stud TE and the WR we draft should be a player with solid hands, excellent route running skills, and the ability to get separation out of cuts.)

We need a playmaker TE and another possion receiver. Unless a STUD receiver falls to us like Julio. 

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imminent rogaine Proficient

imminent rogaine

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Posted

I think Byrd and Samuel have enough to pencil in as 3rd and 4th WRs.  Byrd, for what ever reason, seems slower than I'd expect on the field. Samuel seems a bit shiftier than Teddy to me - which makes sense; he was a running back at times. If there is any belief that these guys can provide consistant deep speed, then that has to make a signing like Mike Wallace, or Torrey Smith after he gets cut, a little less likely.

I agree that Funchess is no more than a #2. - probably a pretty good one. I REALLY want a real, professional, legit, #1 WR like Allen Robinson. Having seen the same offseasons play out that you guys have, I REALLY don't think that will happen via free agency. I'd be content with another #2 WR via free agency - Lee, Hurns, Jordan Matthews etc. Let Shepard walk. Let Bersin Walk. Spend one of the top few picks at Wideout.  Spend another top pick at TE - I'd be extremely happy with  Fumagalli, Schultz, or Goedert out of South Dakota St. I know it won't happen because of needs elsewhere but I could think of worse things than to spend two of our top 4 picks at TE and get Schultz and Goedert.

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DaveThePanther2008 Grand Master

DaveThePanther2008

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Posted

The issue with most of you guys on this forum is if someone gets hurt or doesn't have that Madden numbers their rookie year you are ready to write them off and move on.  

Everyone is so ready to grab a player in the draft when we have the talent already.  IMO we waste a draft pick because so many of you are ready to jettison a good player.

We need to focus on drafting positions of REAL need.  Safety, DE, LT just to name a few.

I agree with signing a vet to improve our WR Corps but I am not one to want to waste a pick on a first round WR when we have players that are as good or even better than the talent you want to add. 

Let's focus on drafting players that can fill a real void instead of drafting another player of the same or similiar caliber just because our former rookie got hurt last year.

 

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RumHam Veteran

RumHam

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Window is closing. We need proven playmakers to step in. Not waiting around for another receiver to develop. That has been a very long process over the course of 15 years. Funchess finally has gotten to a point, but he's no number 1. We waited around for KB just to trade him. Samuel and Byrd can still develop, but there's no way in fuging hell that we enter next season with these three guys and russell shepherd as our receiving core. And no, not paying minimum for someone like Tyrell Williams is going to work either. We need to match our pro bowl - hall of fame qb with the same type of receiver. It'll just make everyone better around him too. We also can't just sit around and think Olsen is dependable after this past year. If we wanna win now, we gotta open the check book. 

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DaveThePanther2008 Grand Master

DaveThePanther2008

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2 minutes ago, Thorrez said:

40 time is one thing, top speed another and I have yet to see either of Samuel or Byrd show a top speed even close to Ginn. 

I think both Samuel and Byrd have that ability to stretch the field.   It is far too early to make a statement like this considering both got hurt just as they were starting to fit in.

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