Monday Morning GM

[MHS831]

22 minutes ago, *FreeFua* said:

Of course we have other needs but none of those compare to the need at WR, how are you still struggling at comprehending this? 

But fine let’s say we only draft one... so we’re trading up for Calvin Ridley then? Because he’s the only WR in this draft that we can expect to plug in and play from day 1 and do everything we’d need.

”What am I expecting?” Lol, oh I don’t know maybe surrounding Cam with actual weapons. Cam masks so many damn problems on this team could you imagine what he’d be able to make up for with an actual WR? Christ, he had the Saints beat in the dome in the playoffs had Funchess and Clay caught gimme’s. 

You’re acting like this is rocket science when it’s really not. 

You do not know how to disagree without being childish.  You have to look at the youth you are developing, IR, and what your actual needs are.  We have a #2 (Funchess).  He was injured and vs. their best CB.  Samuel is the slot.  Why replace him?  We need a #1 WR who can take it deep and who can draw focus off what we have.   We have Byrd who is developing rather nicely and we have CMC who can slide outside. 

So what else do we need? 

It is not rocket science, but it is science.  Is Funchess a weapon if he were not vs. the best CB?  Yes.  He is also developing.  Is Samuel not a pretty ideal slot WR?  Is he not a weapon?  Is CMC not a weapon?  Is Olsen not a weapon?  Would a first round draft pick not also be a weapon?

We have other needs.  Don't tell me about science when you don't seem to understand limitations and variables.  Read the entire passage next time and you may get a point.  I assure you, we will not add a "bunch of weapons" and throw these players out.

[MHS831]

6 minutes ago, SOJA said:

WR we have plenty of young talent. Funch + Samuel + Byrd. What we need is a GOOD veteran. I would look to trade for TY Hilton or Desaun as @*FreeFua* suggested. 

Wouldn't mind at all if we went after another Veteran in FA. 

think we're going to have to choose between Star and Norwell. 

My god do we need young talent at safety, defensive end, tight end, and center though

Good stuff.  I try to look  at the cuts and the drafts, knowing what we are likely to spend in free agency.  I love the idea of a free agent WR and would agree, but we would have to spend some bucks.  If not, there are some decent options on day 1 or 2 maybe.  

[*FreeFua*]

4 minutes ago, MHS831 said:

You do not know how to disagree without being childish.  You have to look at the youth you are developing, IR, and what your actual needs are.  We have a #2 (Funchess).  He was injured and vs. their best CB.  Samuel is the slot.  Why replace him?  We need a #1 WR who can take it deep and who can draw focus off what we have.   We have Byrd who is developing rather nicely and we have CMC who can slide outside. 

So what else do we need? 

It is not rocket science, but it is science.  Is Funchess a weapon if he were not vs. the best CB?  Yes.  He is also developing.  Is Samuel not a pretty ideal slot WR?  Is he not a weapon?  Is CMC not a weapon?  Is Olsen not a weapon?  Would a first round draft pick not also be a weapon?

We have other needs.  Don't tell me about science when you don't seem to understand limitations and variables.  Read the entire passage next time and you may get a point.  I assure you, we will not add a "bunch of weapons" and throw these players out.

Also when you’re suggesting things like moving Turner to C it’s hard to have a real discussion with you. 

No one here is being childish, you’re getting defensive because you’re getting called out for a bad post 

[grimesgoat]

4 minutes ago, *FreeFua* said:

Also when you’re suggesting things like moving Turner to C it’s hard to have a real discussion with you. 

No one here is being childish, you’re getting defensive because you’re getting called out for a bad post 

The statistic above is potentially misleading.  Is this a criticism of receivers not getting separation or a criticism of Cam throwing into tight coverage instead of other options? 

The post was not bad.  Some people are able to think out of the box.  Critical thinking appears to be a lost art.

 

[grimesgoat]

Thank you OP - good opening.

I agree we need to get our guys healthy (particularly WR) in lieu of wholesale changes.  I actually think we are pretty damn close and with some tweaking here and there (plus some help from the injury gods), we will be in a position to make another run next year.

Offense

WRs - I like the Funchess, Samuel, Byrd group.  There is speed and possession receivers in the group.  I don't think we need a superstar or another rookie - the group is young enough and will get better.  I'd lean more towards a savvy vet with a history of moving the chains and catching balls in the end zone.  Not sexy - but I'd offer Decker a decent 2 year contract.  We can save a couple mil by cutting Shepard, but someone needs to play special teams and I don't see any of the above group capable of doing this.  If Shepard is cut, keep Clay for 5th WR, special teams returns.

RBs - The stewie era is over.  We can't pay him 5.2 million for what he is doing.  We need to eat the 1.5m dead cap and move along.  CMC and CAP can manage.  Maybe grab a guy with our 3rd rounder.  Keep Fozzie around for special teams.

OL - Because of the contract, Matt Kalil will be here 1 more year - then he can be cut.  I'm on the fence between giving Norwell 10m or plugging in Moton.  I believe he will be ready to play next year.  I'd draft an C/G with the buffalo third for grooming.  We may want to use our second and let Norwell walk if some things below fall our way.

QB - I agree Anderson is done.  He has deteriorated this year.  I'd look at the free agent market for a backup as I do not believe grooming QBs are a strength for this franchise.  Matt Moore is 33 and could potentially come in and win a game or two if necessary.

Defense

DE - Either draft a DE in the first or second or go all in on Ansah.  Try to get Peppers back for one more run.  Re-sign Horton.  CJ should not be re-signed.  (Addison, Peppers, Ansah/1st rounder, Horton, Hall)

DT - Re-sign Star and Love.  Star might cost 8-10 but I think he is worth it.  If he is too costly, see if we can coax Ngata down here for our rotation.  A 2 year, 10 mil. deal might get it done.  (Star/Ngata Short Love Butler)

LB - If I'm not mistaken, I believe the cap hit on TD is 10 mil.  We need to restructure at the very least.  If we somehow land Ansah, we'll probably need to cut TD and save 6 mil.  We can move shaq over to his spot and pick up a decent LB with the Buffalo 3rd. 

CB - I agree CBs are probably ok.  They will get better with better safety play and I have pretty high hopes for Corn.  I'd love to cut Munnerlyn, but his dead cap is really bad.

S -  We need to draft a safety in round 1 or 2.  I'm one of the few that like Adams and believe he is pretty good at what he does, however he is old and Coleman is average at best.  Need some new blood back there.  If Jones wants to come back for 1m per year for special teams and spot duty, that would be fine.

Key adds: Ansah, Decker, Safety in First, C/G in Second, RB in 3rd, LB in 3rd, back-up QB, Maybe Ngata.

Re-signs: Maybe Star, Peppers

Key losses: Stew, Norwell, CJ, TD.

 

[heel31ok]

1 hour ago, TheRumGone said:

Having turner play center is laughable. 

no, it's really a good idea...

[uncfan888]

1 hour ago, *FreeFua* said:

Of course we have other needs but none of those compare to the need at WR, how are you still struggling at comprehending this? 

But fine let’s say we only draft one... so we’re trading up for Calvin Ridley then? Because he’s the only WR in this draft that we can expect to plug in and play from day 1 and do everything we’d need.

”What am I expecting?” Lol, oh I don’t know maybe surrounding Cam with actual weapons. Cam masks so many damn problems on this team could you imagine what he’d be able to make up for with an actual WR? Christ, he had the Saints beat in the dome in the playoffs had Funchess and Clay caught gimme’s. 

You’re acting like this is rocket science when it’s really not. 

Can't really disagree with any of this. Give cam a serious weapon or two since he's stuck with an incompetent GM and let him work

[Anybodyhome]

I don't always like or agree with everything Aikman says, but he did make an interesting point yesterday:

Subtract Cam's rushing from the team total and Carolina's running game stunk this season. Almost the worst in the league. How does that mesh with a coaching ideology that claims they want to be a formidable run-first attack? 

And, no, CMC nor Fozzy, nor CAP are starting between the tackles RBs.

[PantherOnTheProwl1523]

Is everyone wanting to get rid of CMC RB/WR because he isn't on any list of names mentioned.

[grimesgoat]

14 minutes ago, Anybodyhome said:

I don't always like or agree with everything Aikman says, but he did make an interesting point yesterday:

Subtract Cam's rushing from the team total and Carolina's running game stunk this season. Almost the worst in the league. How does that mesh with a coaching ideology that claims they want to be a formidable run-first attack? 

And, no, CMC nor Fozzy, nor CAP are starting between the tackles RBs.

Its an interesting stat, but maybe misleading.  The offense is built around Cam running.  His dual threat ability is why he was drafted #1.  If we did not want to take advantage of these gifts, we'd probably run a more traditional offense and get his yards in different ways (although maybe not as efficiently).  To me its like saying 'running back x would only have y yards if we take away those 4 really long runs he had'.  Cam's yards are supposed to happen based on how we play.

[bababoey]

2 hours ago, *FreeFua* said:

Of course we have other needs but none of those compare to the need at WR, how are you still struggling at comprehending this? 

But fine let’s say we only draft one... so we’re trading up for Calvin Ridley then? Because he’s the only WR in this draft that we can expect to plug in and play from day 1 and do everything we’d need.

”What am I expecting?” Lol, oh I don’t know maybe surrounding Cam with actual weapons. Cam masks so many damn problems on this team could you imagine what he’d be able to make up for with an actual WR? Christ, he had the Saints beat in the dome in the playoffs had Funchess and Clay caught gimme’s. 

You’re acting like this is rocket science when it’s really not. 

So let's draft a young WR since we only have 1 WR on the team that has at least 3 years of experience.   That's not maybe the best way to surround Cam with actual weapons.

[TheRumGone]

38 minutes ago, heel31ok said:

no, it's really a good idea...

Thanks for the info as to why you think this

i don’t see why that move is even a remote possibility in someone’s mind when he’s a proven all-pro at RG. Turner has that prototypical guard size and arm length. You don’t mess with that chemistry especially when we paid him to be an all-pro right guard. 

[heel31ok]

1 minute ago, TheRumGone said:

Thanks for the info as to why you think this

i don’t see why that move is even a remote possibility in someone’s mind when he’s a proven all-pro at RG. Turner has that prototypical guard size and arm length. You don’t mess with that chemistry especially when we paid him to be an all-pro right guard. 

you are welcome...

[top dawg]

You're right,  I don't agree @MHS831, but I respect the thought and effort. 

WR and DB needs to be a priority in my opinion. No way in Hell we can trot out the present players and expect to get over the hump. 

I've seen enough of Bradberry to know that he isn't on J-No's level.  He doesn't have the instincts or the athleticism. He gives up way too many plays,  as does Worley who just doesn't look good enough in coverage to hold any decent receivers down with any consistency. 

As for the receivers,  we can't gamble that anyone of them will stay on the field.  I believe we may have something, especially in Funchess who should just keep getting better and better.  I was encouraged somewhat by Samuel,  but he has to be able to stay on the field.  The way that some people talk of Byrd,  you'd think that he was the next Smitty or T.Y. Hilton or something, but I don't  see it.  I think that he may provide good depth, but his play hasn't proven that he's a legit starter at this point.

I don't think Coleman was necessarily as bad as people say. He certainly didn't meet expectations,  but I believe that with the proper pieces surrounding him, he can be above average to good once again. 

As for DE, I believe that we're good enough to stick with what we have (with Pep) if necessary. Totally comfortable with the group with or without CJ.  Daeshon Hall is essentially still a rookie,  so there is new blood and upside to unleash.  

I would love to keep Star at a reasonable price,  but if we can't keep him,  it is what it is. I haven't looked at the FA list,  but there's always someone to fill space.  I would most certainly keep Love.

McCaffrey is the only lock at RB.  I would re-sign Stew on the cheap, but draft his replacement at tailback.  

Olsen is the only lock at TE.  

The O-line is such that you always take the opportunity to improve it---especially at LT---when you can whether it's via FA or the draft.

As for the draft,  I don't believe that you can go into it saying I've got to get this or that position in this or that round.  It's a dynamic, not a static proposition, so I feel we should just go with the flow based upon value and need.