The Last Jedi *Spoilers*

[sharkkiller]

On 12/25/2017 at 2:48 AM, Toolbox said:

Sad that now only 3cpo, R2D2, and chewie is all that is left of iconic star wars characters..

Leia is still around. And probably some that have not been needed yet.

 

I loved the movie. I think people are reading to much into Kylo Ren telling Rey her parents are junkers (and it is junkers dammit, not junkies). Why would he tell her the truth. He was trying to turn her and telling her she was a nobody to everyone but him, was his attempt to fill the void she has by not knowing who her parents are.It does not mean that it is true. It is not lazy writing. Not recognizing this is lazy film watching. He actually says that after he tells her. 

As for the Fin and Rose story line, I agree that more should have been done with Del Toro's character, but I get the feeling that he will be back in Episode IX.  The rest of the story line was important in that it established Fin and Rose as a possible love interest arc. Still not sure how they got her out of the mine, but I can overlook that part.

As for why Leia did not move the rocks herself, I think there are two reasons, she was still weak from her Guardians of the Galaxy space walk, and also, Rey needed that moment to establish herself as the new Luke character. 

And on that note, Luke was a badass. To force project himself, not just as a vision to Kylo, but to everyone is something that requires more power than you can imagine. That is why he went away in the end. 

Overall great movie.

[t96]

On 12/23/2017 at 6:15 AM, Jeremy Igo said:

I didn't know Abrams didn't direct it. 

 

Explains a lot. 

 

Just wasn't a good movie. A whole lot of folks in here want it to be a good movie so badly they are convincing themselves it is. 

 

It isn't. 

You liked Force Awakens? I thought Last Jedi and Force Awakens were very similar, and both not that great. Although I'm one of the weird people who thinks all the originals AND prequels are good.

[CarolinaCoolin]

2 hours ago, sharkkiller said:

Leia is still around. And probably some that have not been needed yet.

 

I loved the movie. I think people are reading to much into Kylo Ren telling Rey her parents are junkers (and it is junkers dammit, not junkies). Why would he tell her the truth. He was trying to turn her and telling her she was a nobody to everyone but him, was his attempt to fill the void she has by not knowing who her parents are.It does not mean that it is true. It is not lazy writing. Not recognizing this is lazy film watching. He actually says that after he tells her. 

As for the Fin and Rose story line, I agree that more should have been done with Del Toro's character, but I get the feeling that he will be back in Episode IX.  The rest of the story line was important in that it established Fin and Rose as a possible love interest arc. Still not sure how they got her out of the mine, but I can overlook that part.

As for why Leia did not move the rocks herself, I think there are two reasons, she was still weak from her Guardians of the Galaxy space walk, and also, Rey needed that moment to establish herself as the new Luke character. 

And on that note, Luke was a badass. To force project himself, not just as a vision to Kylo, but to everyone is something that requires more power than you can imagine. That is why he went away in the end. 

Overall great movie.

https://www.google.com/amp/www.syfy.com/syfywire/rian-johnson-explains-that-huge-reveal-about-rey%E2%80%99s-parents-in-the-last-jedi%3Famp

 

the director of the movie disagrees that ren is lying.

 

the real problem with TFA going into TLJ is that Abrams wrote TFA but gave no direction on plot points heading into TLJ and rian could do with the story as he wished. That’s why we have a disconnect in the story when t comes to snoke and Rey’s parents and phasma and the knights of ren. All these plot points started in TFA not continues or wholly discarded in TLJ. 

 

Thats lazy or inconsistent writing. Has nothing to do with lazy viewership.

 

there is a reason audiences aren’t really liking this movie. It isn’t because they are all lazy watchers. There’s merit to the critism 

[cookinwithgas]

They packed a lot of stuff in that movie even with the long running time. To cover everything the fanboys wanted from TFA would have made it difficult for the director to do anything on his own, which is why he was hired. I really don't care about Snoke and have a feeling any actual backstory would seem lame in comparison to what he is in my head now. What's fascinating is that now JJ gets to return the favor by doing the next one. So there's still hope you will get some things resolved.

[CarolinaCoolin]

1 hour ago, cookinwithgas said:

They packed a lot of stuff in that movie even with the long running time. To cover everything the fanboys wanted from TFA would have made it difficult for the director to do anything on his own, which is why he was hired. I really don't care about Snoke and have a feeling any actual backstory would seem lame in comparison to what he is in my head now. What's fascinating is that now JJ gets to return the favor by doing the next one. So there's still hope you will get some things resolved.

The whole casino/rose-finn plot could be removed and that adds more than enough time to just have an actual plot that makes sense in context with the first movie. 

 

It has nothing to do with fanboys. That’s you using a cheap way to dismiss legit critism of the film and what it’s lacking. 

 

Like i said, there’s a reason why the audience is mixed on this movie and a lot are saying they didn’t like it. 

 

Maybe you dont agree with it but it’s valid. It’s not just whiny fanboys not getting exactly what they want. They just want it consistent. Luke’s character wasn’t consistent. The Rey parentage story line wasn’t consistent. Snokes backstory and how ren fits in is nonexistent. The Finn rose plot wasn’t needed at all. Like they could have not even left the ship and the story would have been the exact same. The only reason they needed to go to that planet that meant anything was to give that one kid at the end of the movie hope and tie him in the story. 

[cookinwithgas]

no, they needed something for the Finn and Poe characters to do while Rey did her thing and Leia/Holdo did theirs. Poe and Finn got the kids storyline in which things blow up, they save some animals, simple moral lessons are displayed, and BB8 gets to do something cool. The point of what they are doing is to back up Roses idea that you are going to win protecting who you love, not destroying what you hate, which I thought was a great sentiment that gets overlooked by us older people waiting to see what's up with Luke. The kids watching now look at Luke as some old dude sitting on a rock. They will remember Rose and Finn talking more than Luke and Leia.

Del Toro is still completely out of place in these scenes to me though. He seems to exist just to blow Leia and Holdos cloaked transports idea, with no explanation of how he knows they would do that.

Saw it for the third time yesterday and I am more satisfied with not really caring about Snoke. He existed in this movie as a way for Kylo Ren to assert himself as the primary mover in all of the events, not as Hans kid, which was the point of his character in this movie. To spend a lot of time with Snoke would have diluted that move.

The real character getting the shaft in this movie is R2-D2 by the way. C-3P0 has more to do in this movie than R2. He basically sits on the Falcon the entire movie, and yells at Luke once. Character overload, I guess - and without Luke. he'll probably have even less next time. I guess BB8 toys sell a lot better than R2 toys these days.

[Cary Kollins]

Rian Johnson did a short podcast interview with Spike Jonez recently. He talks about the writing process on TLJ and gives insight into how he came to certain decisions in the film.

Definitely worth a listen.

http://collider.com/the-last-jedi-rian-johnson-spike-jonze-interview/#star-wars

 

The biggest takeaway for me was that Johnson wrote TLJ before The Force Awakens was released in theaters, so he was only using TFA's script to base TLJ off of without the influence of audience reaction.

[CarolinaCoolin]

2 hours ago, Cary Kollins said:

Rian Johnson did a short podcast interview with Spike Jonez recently. He talks about the writing process on TLJ and gives insight into how he came to certain decisions in the film.

Definitely worth a listen.

http://collider.com/the-last-jedi-rian-johnson-spike-jonze-interview/#star-wars

 

The biggest takeaway for me was that Johnson wrote TLJ before The Force Awakens was released in theaters, so he was only using TFA's script to base TLJ off of without the influence of audience reaction.

Explains why the characters and plot are inconsistent from film to film. 

[Darth Biscuit]

I saw it for the 2nd time yesterday and it gave me a chance to nitpick it a little more.  I disliked the beginning much more the 2nd time around. The humor was forced and the plot felt flaky and setup just to make one point... that Poe's (and almost the entirety of the original trilogy plots of daring, crazy plans) was morally "wrong".

I still enjoyed the movie...  it is way too long. About 30-45 minutes too long.

I think my biggest criticism is the treatment they gave Luke's character.  Obviously they had to go someway with him, and they really wanted to distance the old characters from the new, but they could have done it without making Luke so...  pathetic.   Idk it just felt... wrong.

Still enjoyed the ending despite my misgivings. 

Rogue One is still my fav.

 

[Still Brooklyn]

I will admit only one thing in my love of this film. We have one of those Alamo Draft Houses here. So ... yeah ... I drank beer, had a burger and fries, and also a milkshake during it. They also have cocktails. Makes watching anything pretty much great.

[Bronn]

Okay, we saw it as promised on Xmas Eve Eve (Saturday.)

Going in, the only things I knew were what I saw in the previews, a good movie buddy of mine seemingly disappointed and offering the non-spoilery comment of "the middle is kinda bad," and accidentally seeing biscuit's thing about Akbar dying...

I missed like 3 mins, 1.5 each around the point where Leia goes into the sickbay and then one later on (can't remember where) for pee breaks (GDI getting old sucks... first one was mine, second time was both me and my oldest son, lol)

Overall, I really liked it. It is what it is, a modern Star Wars film that extends the nostalgia of my childhood.

Things I really liked:
Leia's stuff - literal tears at some points because: Carrie Fisher

the Porgs and the Lanais - Call me a sucker for the cuteness/humor factor of the Porg and the Lanais reminded me of something out of Labyrinth or another Henson creation

The action sequences - from Poe's space battles to the escape from Canto Bight to the standoff on the salt flats of Crait, not many can do what Star Wars does when it comes to this

Things I thought were good or okay:
Yoda

The humor - some came off forced, yes, but I am glad that my kid and I can share a laugh about some things from the movie

The subtle stab at rich "both sides" people (arms dealers, class system on Canto Bight)

The Cantina-esque environment in the casino, complete with a tune that would make Figrin D'an proud

Hux's rage

3P0 still being annoying, and the callback to the odds of successfully navigating an asteroid field (3,720 to 1 in case you didn't know)

 

Things I thought weren't that good:

Rose - she seemed like a forced attempt at bringing in/appeasing another demographic, but it came across to me as almost playing up to racial misnomers, right down to the Yin-Yang style amulet

Chasing someone through hyperspace - I just didn't think it was all that possible or logical to track someone through hyperspace, much less take the same route. Call me uneducated on the subject if it is indeed explained elsewhere in canon. But, I seem to recall "jumping into hyperspace" as an easy way to get away from someone (I suppose it is easier if they can't track you, obviously, but still...)

Admiral Holdo - I kept hearing "Admiral Hodor" and she basically served the same role, with a little more dialogue and bad character

Benicio Del Toro turning heel. What a cheap cop out. I was hoping it was a double cross and we'd see him help Finn and Rose get back to the rebels, but meh

Luke's death. I mean, I get that he died, but I still don't understand exactly how. Was it because he used so much of the Force to project himself and fight Ren? Or, was it because Ren struck down the projection? How could they physically fight (clashing sabers and all,) but then Ren's lightsaber just poke in and out of Luke at one point? That whole sequence was just confusing as hell to me. Maybe a second viewing would clear it up, not sure.

 

Creepy things:

I could have done without Luke milking that alien on the coast. Kind of a pointless scene, and kinda creepy.

Seeing Kevin Garvey in the casino as the code breaker had me wondering if he was dreaming/sleepwalking/dying again and the whole Star Wars universe is somehow tied into the Other Side of the Leftovers universe, lol.
 

 

Overall, and again, you take the good and the bad and come out with exactly what I hoped for going into it. It was a continuation of the nostalgia of my childhood with enough freshness/lore of its own to hopefully be passed on to my kids' generation.

If I had to reshuffle my order of favorite Star Wars films now, it would look like this:

ESB, TFA, R1, ANH, TLJ, ROTJ, ROTS, AOTC, TPM

[Still Brooklyn]

2 hours ago, Bronn said:

Luke's death. I mean, I get that he died, but I still don't understand exactly how. Was it because he used so much of the Force to project himself and fight Ren? Or, was it because Ren struck down the projection? How could they physically fight (clashing sabers and all,) but then Ren's lightsaber just poke in and out of Luke at one point? That whole sequence was just confusing as hell to me. Maybe a second viewing would clear it up, not sure.

Yes, the going theory is that he used up every ounce of life energy to project himself. And DID their sabers connect? I don't remember. I know Luke dodged Kylo's attempts. Also, Luke didn't leave red foot prints. A nice touch.

[Darth Biscuit]

Sorry if I spoiled anything @Bronn

Luke and Kylo did not touch lightsabers at anytime during their "fight"... I confirmed on my 2nd viewing.

 

 

[CarolinaCoolin]

Making Rey’s parents nobodies confirms she is a Mary Sue. 

 

That’s not good writing.