So, To The Point That Supposedly The 8th Overall Should Be An Immediate All-Pro, Here's A List Of The Last Ten 8th Overall Picks

[KendrickPanther]

I think the concern with CMC is his athletic abilities and playstyle don't have a ton of room to grow. I pass rusher might get 6 sacks as a rookie and its a very exciting thing because maybe 3 years from now they are getting 16.... 

Can CMC Rush for 1k, catch for 500 and 10 TDS for a three year run? That is the sort of production you would hope for. I could understand if someone thinks he's already near his ceiling. He's a good player though. 

[iamhubby1]

4 hours ago, KendrickPanther said:

I think the concern with CMC is his athletic abilities and playstyle don't have a ton of room to grow. I pass rusher might get 6 sacks as a rookie and its a very exciting thing because maybe 3 years from now they are getting 16.... 

Can CMC Rush for 1k, catch for 500 and 10 TDS for a three year run? That is the sort of production you would hope for. I could understand if someone thinks he's already near his ceiling. He's a good player though. 

 

    There ya go. Set those expectation way up there. That way, when he can't reach them. You can flame away about it. Win-Win.

[KendrickPanther]

1 hour ago, iamhubby1 said:

 

    There ya go. Set those expectation way up there. That way, when he can't reach them. You can flame away about it. Win-Win.

Well yeah. He's a top 10 pick. Should we expect less? We aren't supposed to draft in the top 10 often, and when we do, we need to make the most of it. Are we supposed to be satisfied with 500 rushing yards a year from a top 10 RB draft pick? There are always expectations. 

[iamhubby1]

9 minutes ago, KendrickPanther said:

Well yeah. He's a top 10 pick. Should we expect less? We aren't supposed to draft in the top 10 often, and when we do, we need to make the most of it. Are we supposed to be satisfied with 500 rushing yards a year from a top 10 RB draft pick? There are always expectations. 

 

    Expectations are great. As long as they are grounded in reality. 

 

    Expect him to get 1,000 yards. Just not until he gets enough carries to, you know, actually get there. If he gets the carries, but not the yards. Then you can harp on the kid.

 

    He has hit his ceiling? After his 1st 10 games? But he is a good player.

 

    10 TDs? That expectation may get met this year.

 

    500 yards receiving? That is an every year expectation. As a floor.

 

    I do believe your expectations are being clouded by the fact you don't like the pick.  

    

[SeoulPanther]

9 minutes ago, iamhubby1 said:

   Expect him to get 1,000 yards. Just not until he gets enough carries to, you know, actually get there. If he gets the carries, but not the yards.

    I do believe your expectations are being clouded by the fact you don't like the pick.  

    

Trouble is this is a chicken and egg argument. What comes first- opportunity or demonstration of capability? A bit like Funchess last year.                                                                                                                 Hes getting 2.something yards a carry. Fault O-line? Shula? Maybe. But whatever is to blame he doesnt look like an RB. This just happens to have been one of his biggest question marks coming out. Were his stats padded by the Stanford line? As Daks are padded by his.                                                                                           Point is, if you can acknowledge that his rush numbers are below expectations, he isnt a top 10 pick. The fact that he has been productive and improved us in many areas including 3rd down conversion doesnt make him an RB.

[csx]

6 hours ago, iamhubby1 said:

 

    Although the execution left a little to be desired. The basic concept was there. I think too many Panther fans look at CmC's rushing numbers, and are not happy. They are willing to overlook what is happening in the passing game for whatever reason, to make their stance sound better. Yet, the vast majority see the value he brings.

 

    Keek did win DROY, YEA. Loved it. But Smitty? Not so much. As@csx stated. If Smitty, even as a 3rd rounder, had been drafted last year. Most folks would be riding his azz like a broke bronc.

I'm referring to what people here said not actually how good a player was. 

Kuechly win DROY because off his late season performance. It was after Thanksgiving when he and the defense tightened up considerably. Even after that the word was. "Yeah he's looking good but was it necessary with Season on roster?" This communuty has a dreadful history of short sighted emotion based player judgement that it should at least be able to acknowledge exists 

[KendrickPanther]

25 minutes ago, iamhubby1 said:

 

    Expectations are great. As long as they are grounded in reality. 

 

    Expect him to get 1,000 yards. Just not until he gets enough carries to, you know, actually get there. If he gets the carries, but not the yards. Then you can harp on the kid.

 

    He has hit his ceiling? After his 1st 10 games? But he is a good player.

 

    10 TDs? That expectation may get met this year.

 

    500 yards receiving? That is an every year expectation. As a floor.

 

    I do believe your expectations are being clouded by the fact you don't like the pick.  

    

I never said I didn't like the pick. I'm glad we have him, I'm just not sure it was worth a top 10 pick. I never said I expected those number this season. I said those should be his numbers at his prime. Obviously he needs 200+ carries to have a reasonable chance at 1k yards. But again, if we don't give him 200 carries when he's in his prime, was he picked too high? 

I'm not sure how much room he has to grow. I hope quite a bit. But he's already polished in route running. He won't be getting faster on long speed. Maybe he can learn to use blockers better downfield. 

Without a doubt though, if he doesn't have 3 years with 1500 yards of offense, you would say he produced below expectations. 

[iamhubby1]

2 minutes ago, SeoulPanther said:

Trouble is this is a chicken and egg argument. What comes first- opportunity or demonstration of capability? A bit like Funchess last year.                                                                                                                 Hes getting 2.something yards a carry. Fault O-line? Shula? Maybe. But whatever is to blame he doesnt look like an RB. This just happens to have been one of his biggest question marks coming out. Were his stats padded by the Stanford line? As Daks are padded by his.                                                                                           Point is, if you can acknowledge that his rush numbers are below expectations, he isnt a top 10 pick. The fact that he has been productive and improved us in many areas including 3rd down conversion doesnt make him an RB.

 

    Oh, I get it. Folks who see the rushing yards, but don't factor in the meager rushing attempts, don't think he is a RB.

 

    Here's a thought. Why don't we wait until, you know, he gets more than a few carries a game, before we call him not a RB.

 

    Let's just ignore the impact he has had on this Offense. Instead, let's zero in on his lack of rushing yards. Seems fair.

 

    I am sure that if his carries, and yards go up. Folks will find another reason to call it a wasted pick.

 

   

    

 

    

[iamhubby1]

4 minutes ago, KendrickPanther said:

I never said I didn't like the pick. I'm glad we have him, I'm just not sure it was worth a top 10 pick. I never said I expected those number this season. I said those should be his numbers at his prime. Obviously he needs 200+ carries to have a reasonable chance at 1k yards. But again, if we don't give him 200 carries when he's in his prime, was he picked too high? 

I'm not sure how much room he has to grow. I hope quite a bit. But he's already polished in route running. He won't be getting faster on long speed. Maybe he can learn to use blockers better downfield. 

Without a doubt though, if he doesn't have 3 years with 1500 yards of offense, you would say he produced below expectations. 

 

    That is fair, in a "I'll hedge my bet" kinda way. So if he doesn't produce, "In his prime", then we can call it a bad pick?

 

    So, what do we do until then? 

[SeoulPanther]

31 minutes ago, iamhubby1 said:

 

    Oh, I get it. Folks who see the rushing yards, but don't factor in the meager rushing attempts, don't think he is a RB.

 

    Here's a thought. Why don't we wait until, you know, he gets more than a few carries a game, before we call him not a RB.

 

    Let's just ignore the impact he has had on this Offense. Instead, let's zero in on his lack of rushing yards. Seems fair.

 

    I am sure that if his carries, and yards go up. Folks will find another reason to call it a wasted pick.

 

   

    

 

    

Good grief you are so reactionary. For the umpteenth time- nobody is calling it a wasted pick. My post acknowledged the positive impact he has had and there are plenty of reasons to be cheerful about it. No true panther fan isn't happy about that.                                                                                    But look at what you're saying. We are to praise him for his passing numbers despite the fact that he is the most targeted rookie in the NFL filling a role that could be played by any number of players drafted later (remember this is a thread about draft position). But we are to ignore the fact that the primary role and reason that he was drafted to be an RB is something that he has been ineffective at. If you want to believe that hes gonna morph into Eric Dickerson in years to come I fear you have a long wait ahead. He is not a top 10 RB. Therefore on the basis of what he has done very well he shouldnt have been a top 10 pick.

[csx]

1 hour ago, iamhubby1 said:

 

    That is fair, in a "I'll hedge my bet" kinda way. So if he doesn't produce, "In his prime", then we can call it a bad pick?

 

    So, what do we do until then? 

Watch him get better and score touchdowns 

[iamhubby1]

1 hour ago, SeoulPanther said:

Good grief you are so reactionary. For the umpteenth time- nobody is calling it a wasted pick. My post acknowledged the positive impact he has had and there are plenty of reasons to be cheerful about it. No true panther fan isn't happy about that.                                                                                    But look at what you're saying. We are to praise him for his passing numbers despite the fact that he is the most targeted rookie in the NFL filling a role that could be played by any number of players drafted later (remember this is a thread about draft position). But we are to ignore the fact that the primary role and reason that he was drafted to be an RB is something that he has been ineffective at. If you want to believe that hes gonna morph into Eric Dickerson in years to come I fear you have a long wait ahead. He is not a top 10 RB. Therefore on the basis of what he has done very well he shouldnt have been a top 10 pick.

 

    I didn't speak in absolutes. You did. You put a ceiling on him. You also said he needed to have 3 years of 1500 yards and 10 TDs to be considered good enough for that #8 pick. Yet you try and say I expect him to be Eric Dickerson? 

 

    All I have said to you was, why can't we wait until he either does, or does not get enough carries to be called a RB. But hey. Go ahead and put more words in my mouth.

[iamhubby1]

20 minutes ago, csx said:

Watch him get better and score touchdowns 

 

    I can live with that.    

[SeoulPanther]

58 minutes ago, iamhubby1 said:

 

    I didn't speak in absolutes. You did. You put a ceiling on him. You also said he needed to have 3 years of 1500 yards and 10 TDs to be considered good enough for that #8 pick. Yet you try and say I expect him to be Eric Dickerson? 

 

    All I have said to you was, why can't we wait until he either does, or does not get enough carries to be called a RB. But hey. Go ahead and put more words in my mouth.

Wrong again. That was @KendrickPanther not me. 

I don't know how to make this clearer for you. This discussion is not an attack on CMC it is questioning his value at the #8 pick.

Fact: He is a top 10 pick who wouldn't have been in the conversation as a top 10 pick if he wasn't supposed to be a RB.

His saving grace and the thing that makes him a safe pick 1st round is his catching ability. This, and his volume of usage makes him a worthwhile addition but it wasn't the reason he was sold as #8 pick. This skill set - 3rd down back/slot receiver, can be found throughout the rounds of most drafts in most years. That's why at #8 people question it. Never mind Dickerson, CMC's not going to come close to 800 yards rushing this year.  If you want to give him credit for something that he hasn't done yet, in your assessment of his draft value then you could say the same for anyone.