Leadership, and lack thereof

[Still Brooklyn]

2 hours ago, xav8tor said:

Why do so many Huddle topics devolve into threads with allegations of racism, gender bias, ageism, etc., when at face value, the original topics are perfectly valid points for discussion? Are the same people questioning Cam's leadership not also holding up TD as a shining example? So where's the discrimination in that?

Duh, welcome to the Huddle! Where you have me, a man who is bitter while logical; TheRed, who is a Cam homer and cries racism at anything directed poorly towards his beloved idol; AceBoogie, who idolizes Cam, and then a handful of trolls, armchair QBs, one or two racists (true), and SanJay or whatever who everyone should put on ignore.

Take it or leave it.

And yes, the OP had a perfect point but somehow it became all about Cam, as usual.

That said, there is zero fire with this time, IMHO. I blame the Charlotte culture (hi, JR). It's a sleepy, conservative city that puts Southern Hospitality before anything else. I haven't been to a game in years down there but for seven years I went to every game and come on ... they PRAY before kick off. Only one other team in pro sports does that (also a Southern city). This organization needs some attitude. And fast.

[Ricky Spanish]

The thing I have noticed is that there doesn't seem to be a player on offense that holds everyone accountable and isn't afraid to get on someone's case to attempt to light a fire under their asses. You see Luke do it. You see TD do it. If someone isn't doing their job, they let them know, and then on the sidelines they go more in depth on it further. On offense I could be wrong, but I don't see that. I honestly think Olsen is that guy for our offense. I remember the game on MNF where Norman didn't fall on a fumble and you saw Olsen scream in frustration. Cam always talks about how Olsen knows everything that everyone should be doing and is the first to point out any mistakes in the huddle. I think he's that guy on offense, and without him, there's no one holding anyone accountable for their fug ups. Cam's a nice guy, I never see him get angry at his teammates even when you can tell he's annoyed with the crap he's dealing with. But he isn't Manning or Brady or Rodgers who get on people's cases for running the wrong routes. He takes the blame even when it's not his fault, and I personally think that's not the best course of action.

When you run the wrong route for Rodgers or Brady, they stare you down, motion the route you were supposed to run, bring you in and explain it. When KB goes off into la-la land and runs the wrong route, Cam sighs and rolls on to the next play. 

Granted I don't know if they talk about this stuff in the film room, I'm sure they do, but there is something to holding guys accountable in the moment. The defense has that in spades. The offense, not so much from my observations. 

[Still Brooklyn]

1 hour ago, TheRed said:

How many white quarterbacks in the NFL are accused of lacking leadership, giving half effort, and only caring about money while simultaneously carrying their offense?

I'll take a stab ...

Eli Manning (NYG fans want his ass gone gone gone, now now now. They're sick of him.)

Jay Cutler (Everyone on the planet can't stand him and for good reason. Why you still in the NFL, bro?)

Philip Rivers (Yeah, how about throwing another INT, you trash talking redneck.)

Big Ben (Rape anyone lately?)

Andrew Luck (Was supposed to be the "it" QB ... and has failed on all levels.)

Joe Flacco (Uh ... what happened to you?)

All of those guys get heat from their local media. All. But you don't follow it. All of them can play great, but can also fail and get called out for it. But you're not on those team's boards. You want to know why Cam gets "criticism"? Because he's also an entertainer. When you put yourself out there like that, you're going to get some backlash. Lord, can you imagine if Eli had his own clothing brand and tried to run the city? What if Cutler was on a reality show with his wife? What if Rivers had his own shoe line? What if Big Ben did a dance after every TD (we all hated Rodgers' belt dance)? What if Luck starred in a rap video? What if Flacco etc etc etc ...

They'd be called out on it. Simple as that, man. But they keep their heads down for the most part.

 

 

[xav8tor]

41 minutes ago, Still Brooklyn said:

Duh, welcome to the Huddle! Where you have me, a man who is bitter while logical; TheRed, who is a Cam homer and cries racism at anything directed poorly towards his beloved idol; AceBoogie, who idolizes Cam, and then a handful of trolls, armchair QBs, one or two racists (true), and SanJay or whatever who everyone should put on ignore.

Take it or leave it.

And yes, the OP had a perfect point but somehow it became all about Cam, as usual.

That said, there is zero fire with this time, IMHO. I blame the Charlotte culture (hi, JR). It's a sleepy, conservative city that puts Southern Hospitality before anything else. I haven't been to a game in years down there but for seven years I went to every game and come on ... they PRAY before kick off. Only one other team in pro sports does that (also a Southern city). This organization needs some attitude. And fast.

Well, I guess we can add in "regionalism" or whatever you want to call it, to the rampant discriminatory opinions here. I was born and raised in Charlotte, but am well travelled, having been on four continents, and counting commuting, lived in three countries. As a former airline pilot, I've spent a decent amount of time in more cities than I can count (without looking at my logbooks). I'm not saying this to boast, but to put my opinion into a frame of reference. Ignoring individuality (always dangerous), I know what people are generally like in many, many, many places, and what to expect from them.

While CLT may, long ago, have been somewhat like the broad brush generalization you painted, and perhaps, descriptive of certain attributes of JR's (who is NOT a Charlottean), to characterize Charlotte, or it's current population, or for that matter, its natives, is pardon the phrase (Southern Gentleman here), just plain ignorant. I won't cite the stats on how big of a large city/SMSA CLT is, but it's way up there, much larger than a number of significantly smaller cities (who think they are "bigger") that look down upon this "sleepy, conservative town."  CLT is now anything but. In some respects, I wish it was like that, not too conservative, but sleepy can be a good thing. I'd have to check the Urban Institute's latest figures, but am fairly certain that NE and MW transplants are now the majority here.

You are correct in stating that the Panthers need some "attitude," and fast. However, attributing current Panther woes to us locals' "culture," gentle manners, being slow or sleepy, etc., et al, and so on, is indicative of a terribly uninformed, and bigoted, attitude. 

TLDR: Everybody down hereuh ain't no dumbass boy.

[Still Brooklyn]

I lived in Charlotte for 18 years, just so you know. I stand by my statement.

[xav8tor]

4 minutes ago, Still Brooklyn said:

I lived in Charlotte for 18 years, just so you know. I stand by my statement.

Well damn then. Please tell me where that place is, because it sure as hell isn't up at the Lake or anywhere in SE CLT, until you get on the other side of Matthews and Mint Hill maybe.

[Still Brooklyn]

I lived in Myers Park, Uptown, off Monroe Rd, off South Blvd, and by UNCC.

Yes, Charlotte is a city. It's pretty. It's a banking hub. But it's also very timid. Okay, maybe in West Charlotte you have some life ... and in NoDa and Elizabeth you have some arts and culture. But come on, man. Compared to other cities, Charlotte just can't keep up. It'd be like someone saying Raleigh is as good as Charlotte. Charlotteans would laugh at that. Well ... same same. SF, LA, Chicago, NY, Seattle, Philly, DC, Miami, Houston ... those are cities with a vibe. Charlotte has what? Exactly.

[TheRed]

38 minutes ago, Still Brooklyn said:

I'll take a stab ...

Eli Manning (NYG fans want his ass gone gone gone, now now now. They're sick of him.)

Jay Cutler (Everyone on the planet can't stand him and for good reason. Why you still in the NFL, bro?)

Philip Rivers (Yeah, how about throwing another INT, you trash talking redneck.)

Big Ben (Rape anyone lately?)

Andrew Luck (Was supposed to be the "it" QB ... and has failed on all levels.)

Joe Flacco (Uh ... what happened to you?)

All of those guys get heat from their local media. All. But you don't follow it. All of them can play great, but can also fail and get called out for it. But you're not on those team's boards. You want to know why Cam gets "criticism"? Because he's also an entertainer. When you put yourself out there like that, you're going to get some backlash. Lord, can you imagine if Eli had his own clothing brand and tried to run the city? What if Cutler was on a reality show with his wife? What if Rivers had his own shoe line? What if Big Ben did a dance after every TD (we all hated Rodgers' belt dance)? What if Luck starred in a rap video? What if Flacco etc etc etc ...

They'd be called out on it. Simple as that, man. But they keep their heads down for the most part.

 

 

You aren't detailing the way they are perceived by the public and the media which ultimately shapes the narrative behind the criticisms, you're just detailing your own opinion of them.

All the QB's you've listed have faced criticism, but from a different angle. You're confusing criticism stemming from frustration with a losing team versus a guy who is criticized for every little minute detail down to not only how he celebrates or hands a football to a fan, but even down to his body language and demeanor behind a podium and on the field.

Not to mention all of the white QB's you mentioned were all but anointed as the next best thing before they even heard their name called in the draft. Whereas Cam was not only not even considered the unanimous top pick, he wasn't even considered the top QB in the class, or even the second best. Imagine Cam pulling an Eli on draft day and outright refusing to play for a team.

It's also worth mentioning that though men like Peyton Manning and Ben R have actually committed sexual assault, they are still considered generally wholesome figures and have the hall of fame credentials all but completely locked up.

I don't want to delve too deep into this, but discussing the difference in dynamics that shape the perceptions between black QB's and white QB's is anything but cut and dry as you suggest.

[ickmule]

OP is spot on, there is zero leadership on the offense now that Olsen and Kalil are out.  

[xav8tor]

16 minutes ago, Still Brooklyn said:

Charlotte has what? Exactly.

Way too many transplants from Brooklyn that want it to be exactly like Brooklyn.