The burden on Cam Newton

[gmonjimbo]

11 minutes ago, iamhubby1 said:

 

      Bull. The iggles won, because we gave them too many short fields for points. Cox doesn't hit Cam's arm, or Stewy doesn't drop an easy one. Who knows. But those points, pretty much cost us the game.

I stand by my statement, Eagles were better team yesterday. Doesn't mean Panthers can't beat them later in the year. They dominated our offensive line and got 2tds off turnovers. We had at least 6 drops and got 0 points from the Peppers FF.

[Boxhead85]

4 hours ago, lightsout said:

Cam Newton threw or ran the football against the Eagles a total of 63 times out of 79 total offensive snaps. This is ~80% of all offensive snaps where we're asking ONE player to generate offense for this team.

Comparison from week 5 games. Numbers will be plays passing/running out of total offensive snaps and the percentage of that number (rounded to nearest).

Tom Brady: 42/66  64%
Jameis Winston: 49/68  72%
Aaron Rodgers: 33/58  57%
Dak Prescott: 40/72  56%
Russel Wilson: 42/66  64%
Alex Smith: 42/73  58%
Deshaun Watson: 34/57  60%


So, I picked out some "elite" QBs as well as QBs that are generally revered as good or effective. Now, this is but one game and Cam hasn't been relied on THIS heavily as an individual all season. However, Cam was asked to simply do too much tonight. And we STILL were in a position to win this game at two separate points late in the fourth quarter. As much as we are all down about the loss, that is encouraging. That being said, this cannot happen again. One man cannot be 80% of your offense unless that one man is scoring every drive, which is simply an unrealistic expectation. If Cam is having to be more than 65-70% of our offensive production and we're not blowing teams away, that is a problem. OL, RBs, Shula, Rivera. All need to step up and ensure that this does not happen again.

 

100% facts. We could have survived one turnover inside our own 20, but that second one was a backbreaker. Cam can only do so much.

[Silent Majority]

3 hours ago, GoobyPls said:

A lot people don’t grasp how hard it is for Cam to run and the next play he’s asked to stand in the pocket and dissect a defense. Cam was visibly exhausted going into halftime.

Please pin this quote to the top of the board.

[Burnout189]

2 hours ago, iamhubby1 said:

 

    Cam lays on the ground a bunch. Not every time mind you, but a whole lot. How many times have you seen him down on the ground. Only to pop up, smiling, and ready to go. That play may, or may not have hurt. But he was not down for long.

 

    And even if he was. We called time out, to let him get his bearings. He was playing possum.

Nah, I gotta say , it really looked like he was in pain while lying on the ground after that play. The camera zoomed in from the other side and you could see Cam wincing badly while lying there. 

[J.Cage]

56 minutes ago, jtm said:

No way Brady or Rogers lose that game if given, not one, but two chances to march down the field and win the game at the end.

Cam thru an int and an awful pass to CMC when it counted. 

Strange, bc both lost to us in that manner

[beastson]

58 minutes ago, jtm said:

Facts are facts. Folks on the huddle can’t objectively assess Cam or our team 99% of the time. Loss isn’t solely on Cam, but elite QBs march down the field and score when it counts. 

Last weekend, Rodgers lost his top receiver on the last drive and still got it done and no excuses. 

Wtf did you not see us win against NE? How about Cam despite multiple illegal hits to the head put us in position to win against Denver last season and Gano missed?

You can't compare those QB's like Rodgers and Brady to what Cam is asked to do. So you completely skipped what OP said about 80% of snaps? They run if they have to, other than that they sit in the pocket and throw

If you think what happened last night is an successful plan to win, I don't know what to say. Especially for a QB coming off shoulder surgery.

[mrknowitall]

58 minutes ago, iamhubby1 said:

 

    See, are you blaming Cam? The coaches? Or the Oline?

 

    Righteous or not. QBs can be rated on their ability to make come backs. Cam had two chances, and did not deliver on either. 

Obviously I’m not blaming Cam. But that’s the issue I have with your argument. The fact that I admit that Cam wasn’t perfect last night is all of a sudden reasoning for why Cam might be blamed? Cam SHOULD NOT have to be perfect for us to win a game. Cam completed 8 of his first 10 passes. PFF says that his receivers dropped six catchable passes (and if you know PFF, then you know that what they consider a catchable pass is a lot stricter than what a nfl receiver should consider a catchable pass). But if all six of those dropped passes had been caught, Cam would’ve finished the game having completed 65% of his passes and one less interception, instead of completing 53% of his passes. Cam was money throughout the game. We had a total of eighty yards on the ground and Cam accounted for 71 of those yards. He was 89% of our rushing game last night, and we still asked him to throw the ball 50 times. And once he got to 40+ throws, we decided, Cam, now that your body should be super tired, how about you throw the ball twenty + yards down the field for the rest of the game. 

Yes. QBs should have to be able to make comebacks. Yes. They are often times rated on this ability. But... if not mounting a comeback to win a game automatically puts Cam at fault, then what’s the point in mentioning it? By that theory, more than half the time any team loses a game it’s the QBs fault, because he failed to mount a game winning comeback.

[mrknowitall]

1 hour ago, jtm said:

People here acting like other qbs don’t carry their team on their back is laughable. Plus Panthers usually have elite defense so Cam doesn’t have to do a ton to win. 

No one's acting like no other QB carries their team. But of all the games to be like, “It’s Cam’s fault too,” how is this one of them. I’m not saying Cam didn’t have opportunities to win the game, but the idea that this is the one he’s got to win if he truly wants to be an MVP/elite qb is ridiculous. A game when the O-Line can’t create a pocket, and can’t create a hole in the run game. A game where Cam has thrown close to forty passes before we even enter the fourth quarter. A game where he accounts for practically all of our rushing game. If this is the game he has to win for us to be considered an MVP, then what’s the game that he DOESN’T have to win. 

CMC didn’t get his second rushing attempt of the game until the fourth quarter. Stewart ended the game with less rushing yards on the season than he started the game with. Down by four with three minutes to go at the Eagles forty yard line, we threw three consecutive passes twenty to thirty yards down the field. For the second consecutive game, we’ve had first and goal, and didn’t bring CMC (our most dynamic offensive player right now) into the game until third down. We had a chance to kick a 58 yard field goal to end the half, which would’ve had us in position to kick a field goal at the end of the game to take the lead, but we decided to throw a bomb with 5 sec left in the first half. 

If you read all that, and your first impulse is to blame Cam, because after three hours he wasn’t enough of an alien to make dime passes for the 47th through the 52nd throws of his night (he really threw over fifty-five passes when you consider the penalties - PI and holding), then you can’t have much respect for the physical toll a professional athlete goes through. 

[Dragoon11]

19 hours ago, lightsout said:

I'd say absolutely that one play made all the difference. He stayed on the ground for a bit after that dive, then seemed to realize that he was showing he was hurt and popped up. Then when we reviewed it, he jogged to the sideline and immediately started favoring that shoulder/arm/hand. Something happened to him that play, and some of his passes came out wonky after that play happened for the rest of the game, including the final incomplete to CMC. I'd say something happened where the ball just wasn't as comfortable in his hand and it effected his ability to throw as tightly as he had throughout the game to that point. Still did well from there though, just a throw here or there that didn't look entirely natural. Couple that with the times where his arm/hand/shoulder is being hit as he is throwing, it's understandable. 

I will say you were right. Two drives to win it, the first failed. Fine, defense bailed you out, got 2 minutes to drive the field and get the game winner. 3rd and 1, a stupid play call. 4th and 1, a stupid play call. Both cost us, simple as that. One of those, if not both, should have been runs with at least one being a Cam keeper. It's 1 yard. But oh well. Coulda, woulda, shoulda.

And if the coaches KNEW his arm was hurt, why the bombs to the end zone??.....Why not two, three step drops, quick out patterns, quick underneath routes. Why not dink and dunk them all the way to goal line.....Was plenty of time left. Our coaches are just not good at situational football. They've proven it time and time again.

[Dragoon11]

18 hours ago, JawnyBlaze said:

Not really. The first of said attempts he did everything he could. Somebody has to catch his passes after all. The second attempt, he made some plays but yes, had two bad passes. I think it was evident something was going on whether it’s his shoulder or his hand or what but both passes obviously slipped out of his hand weirdly. Cam did everything he could despite his teammates causing three interceptions, dropping just about half of his passes, and running into brick walls and falling down. No other MVP has had to carry a team like Cam is required to carry us. For the past five or six years Cam has been asked to pretty much be the entire offense. No other MVP has ever had to shoulder that burden. 

Could you imagine how much better this offense would be if just ONE of these guys could step up and become a big play play maker like Steve Smith was??.....That's really what is lacking on this team.  A guy that is a treat to score every time he touches the ball....Someone needs to emerge as a TRUE home run threat...Maybe that's wishful thinking, but there IS talent on this team.

[therealmjl]

SMH @iamhubby1 you are pissing me off in this thread

go pull for the Lions 

[Dragoon11]

18 hours ago, iamhubby1 said:

 

    I appreciate you backing Cam, but you could not be more wrong. Cox hit Cam's arm on that first throw, causing an INT. Then Stewy bobbled a catch, resulting in another INT. Both in the Red Zone. Both resulting in points. Neither of which could be truly attributed to Cam. But...

 

    Then, we had not one, but two, drives to win the game. Both of those failed.

 

    It is not Cam's fault we lost. But, he had two chances to win, with the whole nation watching. And he failed to deliver.

 

    That said. It sucks. We are 4-2. Cam is still a viable MVP candidate. We are still a very good team. Get over it.

I totally get what you're saying......But even Rivera said in press conference that coaches need to put players in a better position to win......The strategy on those two drive were as bad as I've ever seen. Just horrible play calling and I think Rivera realized it after the game.....Either way, we've lost to worse teams. NFL is a marathon, not a sprint. Panthers still have plenty of time to PRAY that Shula can figure out the game of football.

[Dragoon11]

18 hours ago, jtm said:

Facts are facts. Folks on the huddle can’t objectively assess Cam or our team 99% of the time. Loss isn’t solely on Cam, but elite QBs march down the field and score when it counts. 

Last weekend, Rodgers lost his top receiver on the last drive and still got it done and no excuses. 

With 1:09 seconds on clock....Went to same receiver, same play two times in a row. Was a thing of beauty......Good thing he has coaches that know how to exploit a ROOKIE Dallas Cowboys DB.......Not arguing for or against, I see both sides to this. But there's no denying our coaching is abysmal at times.

[JawnyBlaze]

18 minutes ago, Dragoon11 said:

Could you imagine how much better this offense would be if just ONE of these guys could step up and become a big play play maker like Steve Smith was??.....That's really what is lacking on this team.  A guy that is a treat to score every time he touches the ball....Someone needs to emerge as a TRUE home run threat...Maybe that's wishful thinking, but there IS talent on this team.

Yea. A prime Smitty on this team and I don’t see how we’re beatable. Sure the oline would still be suspect, but a WR that can get open does wonders for an oline.