The Score (LOL): 5 teams that are likely already regretting their big-name FA signing

[thefuzz]

14 minutes ago, top dawg said:

The contract is bad, and I am not the only one that thinks so. His career production was not commensurate with what he will actually be getting paid. It's as simple as that! 

You don't think so, but so what? Others do. And now you wan to sit back and beat a dead horse. Give it up! Sometimes agreeing to disagree is the wisest option.

I'm bored with this discussion.

You started the discussion by brining in a stupid article written by someone who doesn't understand NFL contracts.  In other words...someone who wants clicks, like most of the garbage out there today.

I'm not trying to argue with you are anyone else, I'm just trying to educate panthers fans who don't quite understand contracts and the salary cap.

It's not very smart to run around talking about an "over the top" contract, when it really isn't.  It was very similar to what Whitworth got, and almost exactly what Minny was offering Kalil.

 

AGAIN, I'm not a huge fan, but you are just refusing to look at the contracts and the verbiage.

[Cat]

1 hour ago, thefuzz said:

Go back and look at which tackles were available when we pulled the lever.

It's not very pretty.

I did. There some tackles that we could have gotten. Also I wasn't just talking tackles,  I said his inability to bring in offensive  talent  period.

[thefuzz]

9 minutes ago, Cat said:

I did. There some tackles that we could have gotten. Also I wasn't just talking tackles,  I said his inability to bring in offensive  talent  period.

Name them.  And you were referencing tackles when you said this:  Also, LOL...no good OTs in the draft for the last 5 years! sure ok. 

 

 

Also, if you don't think that Trai, Oher, Norwell, KB, CMC, Samuel, Ginn, etc...were talentless, then we can't have this discussion.

[falconidae]

5 hours ago, thefuzz said:

You started the discussion by brining in a stupid article written by someone who doesn't understand NFL contracts.  In other words...someone who wants clicks, like most of the garbage out there today.

I'm not trying to argue with you are anyone else, I'm just trying to educate panthers fans who don't quite understand contracts and the salary cap.

It's not very smart to run around talking about an "over the top" contract, when it really isn't.  It was very similar to what Whitworth got, and almost exactly what Minny was offering Kalil.

 

AGAIN, I'm not a huge fan, but you are just refusing to look at the contracts and the verbiage.

Spotrac has a 7.2 mil out after 2018. Think that's  misleading, because there's a 10 mil option bonus that comes into play in 2018-look at the notes section in spotrac. It either gets prorated over the rest of the contract or becomes guaranteed  salary in 2018. They are surely going to prorate it  if they keep him, so that means that cutting him in 2019 will cost another 7.5 mi. Spotrac doesn't have it in its calculations yet because it hasn't happened, but it looks like the cap hit to release him in 2019 would be 14.7 mil.

Once the option bonus kicks in, you either have Kalil with an 11 mil salary for 2018 or a lot more dead money afterwards. Think they set it up that way so that's it's effectively a one year deal, if he fails badly. If they cut him after this season, it's a 9.6 mil cap hit, which they'll spread over two years.

I'm by no means a cap expert, and they can probably re-do the numbers, but it looks like Spotrac is off.

[rmoneyg35]

Kalil had one bad game and one decent game. I say wait before making a final decision. We needed a left tackle and got the best we could in FA.

 

if he doesn't do well then we can cut him after the season and not be on the line for the rest of his contract thanks to the way Gettleman worked out his contract.

 

Kalil has to adjust working not only with a new group of offensive lineman but also a new QB who didn't participate in training camp and very little in preseason.

[grimesgoat]

38 minutes ago, falconidae said:

Spotrac has a 7.2 mil out after 2018. Think that's  misleading, because there's a 10 mil option bonus that comes into play in 2018-look at the notes section in spotrac. It either gets prorated over the rest of the contract or becomes guaranteed  salary in 2018. They are surely going to prorate it  if they keep him, so that means that cutting him in 2019 will cost another 7.5 mi. Spotrac doesn't have it in its calculations yet because it hasn't happened, but it looks like the cap hit to release him in 2019 would be 14.7 mil.

Once the option bonus kicks in, you either have Kalil with an 11 mil salary for 2018 or a lot more dead money afterwards. Think they set it up that way so that's it's effectively a one year deal, if he fails badly. If they cut him after this season, it's a 9.6 mil cap hit, which they'll spread over two years.

I'm by no means a cap expert, and they can probably re-do the numbers, but it looks like Spotrac if off.

I noticed it looked a little strange as well.  It might have something to do whether he's a pre-June1 cut or a post-June 1 cut.

Over-the-cap has dead money of 4.9m for a post June 1 cut regardless of what year he is cut.  Weird.

[top dawg]

1 hour ago, thefuzz said:

You started the discussion by brining in a stupid article written by someone who doesn't understand NFL contracts.  In other words...someone who wants clicks, like most of the garbage out there today.

I'm not trying to argue with you are anyone else, I'm just trying to educate panthers fans who don't quite understand contracts and the salary cap.

It's not very smart to run around talking about an "over the top" contract, when it really isn't.  It was very similar to what Whitworth got, and almost exactly what Minny was offering Kalil.

 

AGAIN, I'm not a huge fan, but you are just refusing to look at the contracts and the verbiage.

Is Matt Kalil being paid $13,000,000 for his work this season? 

[Xavier]

Andrew Whitworth would have been great, but let's stop perpetuating the myth he was the only suitable tackle on the market.

Gettleman had a multitude of good options this offseason, and chose the worth tackle, and paid him the most.

A lot of people on here wanted

Russell Okung

Riley Reiff

Kelvin Beachum

and many other tackles far superior to Kalil;  Beachum signed for pennies

Okung, Beachum, and Reiff have all performed extremely well in the first few weeks if you look at their PFF grades

 

#Jets Kelvin Beachum allowed one pressure on 32 pass snaps according to @PFF ... earned 79.0 overall grade ranked No. 14 among tackles #nyj

https://twitter.com/KristianRDyer/status/909810503664488449

 

https://twitter.com/Imthatdude619/status/910688473106890752

 

#Chargers Pass blocking grades via PFF Okung 80.2 Pulley 54.5 Slauson 62.3 Wiggins 79.2 Barksdale 36.7

 

[Xavier]

Biggest myths Gettleman cult followers propogate to deny the reality he failed at his #1 duty - protecting his franchise QB (unfortunately, as a result of Gettleman, Cam will have a very shortened career, and CTE symptoms the rest of his life;  in fact, Cam's prime may be already over after having suffered so many concussions as a direct result of having the worst tackles of any QB in the nfl the past half decade).

I think some of Cam's drop off in play isn't just the shoulder surgery, but brain damage/early symptoms of CTE.   Let's also not forget he forced Jordan Gross into an early retirement.

 

Myth #1 - There are no good tackles to be found in the past half decade, so who can blame Gettleman?  I just listed off Okung, Beachum, Reiff, Whitworth all from just last off season who would have been huge upgrades and cost less than Kalil.  We could have traded a 6th round pick to move up a few spots in the 2nd round to draft Cam Robinson, who is starting for the Jaguars and performing very well for a rookie.

Cam Robinson was only taken a few spots ahead of Curtis Samuel.  If you want to talk about 2016 or 2015, there were other great options at tackle we can discuss, and when people say we couldn't 'afford it', they may want to remember we paid Gano and Andy Lee a combined 8.5 million dollars last year (because kickers and punters are more important than upgrading left tackle)

 

Myth #2 - Kalil's contract is 'flexible', and we can just cut him after a few years with no consequences.  This isn't actually true, and those who actually understand the salary cap realize we'll carry a 10 million dollar dead cap hit if we cut him in the next 3 years.  In addition, there are consequences for Cam Newton continuing to be hit in the head and suffering more concussions over the next 2 years in which we're 'experimenting with Kailil'.

 

Face it, Gettleman was handed a transcendent alltime talent at QB in Cam Newton, and made terrible decisions that greatly reduced not only the length of his career, but also his ability to succeed in the present (as well as after he retires, as I'm sure he will have pretty severe CTE).

 

 

[Krovvy]

10 hours ago, pantherclaw said:

How did we miss put on that left tackle?!?!?

You didn't state left tackle.

[*FreeFua*]

On 2017-09-20 at 11:28 AM, thefuzz said:

he can be cut as early as this season, and if designated as a June 1 would count 4.5M against the cap in 18 and 19.  

Really?

Where do you see this? Not doubting you, just want to take a look

[Saca312]

2 hours ago, Xavier said:

Andrew Whitworth would have been great, but let's stop perpetuating the myth he was the only suitable tackle on the market.

Gettleman had a multitude of good options this offseason, and chose the worth tackle, and paid him the most.

A lot of people on here wanted

Russell Okung

Riley Reiff

Kelvin Beachum

and many other tackles far superior to Kalil;  Beachum signed for pennies

Okung, Beachum, and Reiff have all performed extremely well in the first few weeks if you look at their PFF grades

 

#Jets Kelvin Beachum allowed one pressure on 32 pass snaps according to @PFF ... earned 79.0 overall grade ranked No. 14 among tackles #nyj

https://twitter.com/KristianRDyer/status/909810503664488449

 

https://twitter.com/Imthatdude619/status/910688473106890752

 

#Chargers Pass blocking grades via PFF Okung 80.2 Pulley 54.5 Slauson 62.3 Wiggins 79.2 Barksdale 36.7

 

If you look at Matt Kalil's grade for week 1 he was one of the better tackles lmao. IIRC he was around the 80s.

I take PFF grades for o-linemen with a grain of salt.

EDIT: 76.1

 

[Kevin Greene]

Rams playing now, ck out Whitworth their LT. Also ck out what a new OC has done to their pitiful offense from last year.

[top dawg]

1 hour ago, Kevin Greene said:

Rams playing now, ck out Whitworth their LT. Also ck out what a new OC has done to their pitiful offense from last year.

Makes all the difference in the world.