Quick Rival Thread: Why DeSean Jackson's Potential Is Capped By Playing With Jameis Winston

[top dawg]

Even Next Gen Stats questions whether the pairing will work, but they aren't giving a definitive "No!"

http://www.nfl.com/videos/tampa-bay-buccaneers/0ap3000000793428/Next-Gen-Stats-Winston-Jackson-destined-to-fail

I know I'm not wagering against it. The way that the rookies play will have something to say as to whether or not D-Jax can do his thing. I suspect that last season Winston was limited by Evans' inability to get clear and actually make YAC. They really didn't have the receiving corps to maximize Winston's skill set. Russell Shepard wasn't really helping to take the pressure off (and that's why even despite his ST skills, he was allowed to walk).

If running without pads is any kind of indication, then Godwin is going to be better than advertised.

https://thepewterplank.com/2017/06/10/buccaneers-chris-godwin-otas/

And @Saca312, you should well know that Godwin just may be the real deal as one of the analysts that you "swear by" gave Godwin many props during draft season. Throw in the addition of another promising and tantalizing option that can certainly get down field in O.J.  Howard, and it's a bit of a stretch to be prematurely downplaying D-Jax and Winston, and Tampa Bay's offense in general during July.

[Saca312]

Just now, top dawg said:

 

And @Saca312, you should well know that Godwin just may be the real deal as one of the analysts that you "swear by" gave Godwin many props during draft season. Throw in the addition of another promising and tantalizing option that can certainly get down field in O.J.  Howard, and it's a bit of a stretch to be prematurely downplaying D-Jax and Winston, and Tampa Bay's offense in general during July.

I'm downplaying D-Jax's impact. It won't be as great as it could've been in Washington unless Jameis fixes his downfield accuracy. Not saying he won't have an impact, it's just his potential is capped by playing with Jameis.

Not downplaying their offense as a whole. It's better than last season, but hold on that "impossible to stop" talk unless Jameis proves me wrong.

And OJ Howard's not going to be doing much his rookie season. He was way too overhyped to begin with. That's a story for another time.

[KB_fan]

1 hour ago, Johnny Rockets said:

Sorry, but I don't see how you can say a team that finished last is "miles ahead of their division" especially when one of those teams went to the SB. Optimism is fine but it's a tough, competitive conference. Should be an interesting battle this year. 

Truth.  I think the NFC South could be the most interesting / most competitive division.  We've got the best QBs (as in all 4 teams have legit franchise QBs) and at least 3 of the 4 teams (perhaps not the Saints) have the weapons to be a contender if they can put things together and stay healthy.  Looking at schedules, etc., I can make a case for all 4 teams to go 10-6 or 9-7.  When I did a season prediction earlier this summer, I think I finally ended up predicting the Panthers at 10-6, Falcons & Bucs tied at 9-7 and New Orleans at 7-9.  But we could easily have a hot 3 way race for the division title.

I *hope* I'm wrong and that Panthers blow away the division as in 2015, but I think it will be a pretty tight race.

[theDIRTYcode2]

I know this is lazy but is y'alls schedule like ours where we play 5 of our 6 division games to end the season?

As far as Desean, Koetter will use him on a lot of inside slot slants, and screens. Evans isn't as fast as Julio but dude has great hands. If Jameis takes a step in his 3rd year, they will be tough. Tampas defense doesn't impress me as much as others though. Plus I'm in the "Tampa is gonna have to show me" stage, everyone seems to pick them to take the next step.

[top dawg]

30 minutes ago, Saca312 said:

I'm downplaying D-Jax's impact. It won't be as great as it could've been in Washington unless Jameis fixes his downfield accuracy. Not saying he won't have an impact, it's just his potential is capped by playing with Jameis.

Not downplaying their offense as a whole. It's better than last season, but hold on that "impossible to stop" talk unless Jameis proves me wrong.

And OJ Howard's not going to be doing much his rookie season. He was way too overhyped to begin with. That's a story for another time.

Well, I think Winston's accuracy was greatly affected by his receiving corps. Much like Cam, he wants to push the ball down-field, but his receiving corps last year was basically too slow and unskilled to allow that to happen. Personally, I don't think they'll be "impossible to stop" for us, because we'll have the defense, including the secondary, to neutralize whatever they throw at us (D-Jax included). Could be homer talk, but I expect our defense to be top two or three in the league. That being said, I still think that the Bucs will begin to feast on lesser defenses during mid October.

[LinvilleGorge]

2 hours ago, Hotsauce said:

I'm really curious why DJax has been somewhat of a journeyman for his career. I get he is a dynamic playmaker (or at least was once), why wouldn't teams find a way to keep him? Just my .02 without doing any research on him

Supposed gang ties played a role in his parting of ways with the Eagles.

[Saca312]

2 minutes ago, theDIRTYcode2 said:

I know this is lazy but is y'alls schedule like ours where we play 5 of our 6 division games to end the season?

Nope. Ours is evenly distributed as far as when we're facing divisional opponents, and we have very favorable timing when it comes to matchups and when they occur.

For our offense, we have the easiest schedule in the league in terms of going against defenses in poor pass protection, but defensively we're going against some of the league's toughest offenses.

Overall, we're in the middle, but breaking it down shows our offense and defenses are at two extremes:

The Panthers offense has a super easy schedule. It's not even funny.

• Passing -  The Panthers go against the 24th hardest schedule against pass rush defenses (17th in 2016), 30th hardest in pass defense efficiency (6th in 2016), and 32nd hardest in yards per pass allowed (21st in 2016). 
• Rushing - The Panthers go against the 32nd hardest schedule against run defenses(28th in 2016) and 29th hardest in RB pass efficiency (25th in 2016). 
• Red Zone Efficiency - The Panthers go against the 31st hardest red zone defenses (29th in 2016), and 20th hardest against 3rd down conversion prevention defenses (19th in 2016).

Defensively, it's a lot tougher in comparison to our offense, but not significantly different from last year. 

• Passing - The Panthers go against the 2nd hardest schedule against pass efficient offenses (7th in 2016), 2nd hardest in Yards Per Pass Attempt (3rd in 2016), but do get to go against slightly easier pass protecting offenses (6th hardest in 2017; 4th in 2016).
• Rushing - The Panthers go against the 1st hardest schedule against rushing efficientoffenses (21st in 2016), 1st hardest against RB pass efficient offenses (1st in 2016), but remain at 32nd hardest going against explosive rushing offenses (same as 2016). 
• Red Zone Efficiency -  The Panthers defense go against the 1st hardest schedule against red-zone offenses (3rd in 2016), and the 2nd hardest against 3rd down converting offenses (5th in 2016).

[top dawg]

17 minutes ago, KB_fan said:

Truth.  I think the NFC South could be the most interesting / most competitive division.  We've got the best QBs (as in all 4 teams have legit franchise QBs) and at least 3 of the 4 teams (perhaps not the Saints) have the weapons to be a contender if they can put things together and stay healthy.  Looking at schedules, etc., I can make a case for all 4 teams to go 10-6 or 9-7.  When I did a season prediction earlier this summer, I think I finally ended up predicting the Panthers at 10-6, Falcons & Bucs tied at 9-7 and New Orleans at 7-9.  But we could easily have a hot 3 way race for the division title.

I *hope* I'm wrong and that Panthers blow away the division as in 2015, but I think it will be a pretty tight race.

Defense is going to be a big part of the equation, and I just believe we have the best one in the division, with the potential to be the best in the conference. I guess I'll find out in September. The main thing that worries me is the pass rush, but that's because of the Huddle whispers about us being too old. I think CJ and Pep will surprise.

[Saca312]

5 minutes ago, top dawg said:

Defense is going to be a big part of the equation, and I just believe we have the best one in the division, with the potential to be the best in the conference. I guess I'll find out in September. The main thing that worries me is the pass rush, but that's because of the Huddle whispers about us being too old. I think CJ and Pep will surprise.

To be honest our defense was older in 2015 if I'm not mistaken. I'm not too worried at all.

[theDIRTYcode2]

@Saca312 Yeah us and the Saints really skew those numbers to both extremes. The 2 best offenses, coupled with 2 of the worst defenses.

We got the week 4 bye this year, which I hate, especially with all our division games being at the end of the year. We could have a 2 game lead going into November and then ish the bed, which is the very Atlanta thing to do.

[top dawg]

7 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

Supposed gang ties played a role in his parting of ways with the Eagles.

Overblown and never substantiated!

D-Jax left in part because of Chip Kelly's hubris and miscalculations. Sure, Jackson's diva-like persona was always an issue for some, but not wanting to overpay for his services and the injury risk that comes along with them have always been at the heart of contractual matters with D-Jax.

[top dawg]

3 minutes ago, Saca312 said:

To be honest our defense was older in 2015 if I'm not mistaken. I'm not too worried at all.

I'm referring to our pass rushers.

[LinvilleGorge]

5 minutes ago, top dawg said:

Overblown and never substantiated!

D-Jax left in part because of Chip Kelly's hubris and miscalculations. Sure, Jackson's diva-like persona was always an issue for some, but not wanting to overpay for his services and the injury risk that comes along with them have always been at the heart of contractual matters with D-Jax.

There was a LOT of smoke for there to be no fire. Dude has flashed known gang signs during NFL games. 

[GoobyPls]

50 minutes ago, Saca312 said:

Some facts that immediately disprove that statement:

Jameis Winston was accurate on 30.51 percent of his deep passes last year, only five quarterbacks were worse than him. Winston’s percent of deep throws wasn’t that high either. He threw 11.22 percent of his passes further than 20 yards downfield, 14th in the league, instead focusing most of his passes into the 11-20 range, where he ranked first in the league with 33.06 percent of his passes going there.

Again who were his deep threats? Sheppard and Humphries. In 2014 Cam's deep ball accuracy was atrocious and according to PFF Cam wasn't even a top 15 deep passer last year. You can pick and choose stats to death.

I'm willing to bet barring injury Jackson has another stellar year