Quick Rival Thread: Why DeSean Jackson's Potential Is Capped By Playing With Jameis Winston

[Saca312]

DeSean Jackson is well known as the newcomer in Tampa expected to make a big impact. Pairing his speed and route-running expertise with Mike Evans makes for quite a scary threat. Couple that with Tampa's offensive philosophy of pushing the ball downfield, and it looks like a scary team on paper.

However, a certain analyst believes that his impact will be more limited in Tampa than when he was on the Redskins.

Take a complete read here. It's pretty good:

http://presnapreads.com/2017/07/13/the-direct-and-indirect-benefits-of-desean-jackson/

I'll be taking a few segments and adding my thoughts.

DeSean Jackson is well respected for his speed, but his route-running and adjusting to the ball are top-tier. He directly benefits QBs by getting himself open and finding a way to track and catch balls.

As Football Outsiders analyst Fahey explains:

Quote

This play against the Eagles is a perfect example of the direct benefit that comes from playing with Jackson. He uniquely elevates quarterbacks when they’re trying to push the ball downfield. Cousins completely misses this throw but Jackson has beaten the cornerback so badly that he has time to slow down and locate the ball. He should have been continuing down the middle of the field to track the ball there. Instead he is forced to turn towards the opposite sideline as the ball flutters over his head.

Jackson’s ball skills to locate and catch the ball, especially without going to the ground, are spectacular but he never gets that opportunity if he doesn’t beat the cornerback as badly as he does. The cornerback is too focused on trying to recover the ground he has lost to look for the ball or disrupt Jackson at the catch point.

He emphasizes his quality by staying on his feet against contact before trotting into the endzone.

DeSean Jackson has that ability to elevate his QB. Kirk Cousins has a lot of problems, but Jackson helped mask that.

However, his "indirect benefits are what make him special. In Washington, with the amount of offensive weapons & minds they had, Jackson's mere presence was just as deadly as what he does after the snap.

Quote

Jackson isn’t just a speed receiver. He’s not just a guy who runs 40 yards downfield in a straight line on every play. He is a more nuanced route runner than given credit for and he can make tougher receptions in tight coverage. His presence on the field didn’t limit Jay Gruden’s play calling in any way. It did limit the opponents’ play calling.

Only eight quarterbacks in the league threw a higher percent of their passes within five yards of the line of scrimmage than Kirk Cousins last year. 53.15 percent of his passes went to that range, six percent higher than the league average. The Washington offense is a quick throw one. It spreads the field with receivers so the quarterback can diagnose the play before the snap and get rid of the ball immediately after the snap. Against that kind of offense you want to squash the field. You want to be aggressive outside and take away the quick throws, force the quarterback to hold the ball when he doesn’t want to hold the ball.

...

According to Football Outsiders, Washington ranked 27th in the league in terms of how many stacked boxes they faced. This means that teams were constantly keeping two safeties deep against them, freeing up the space over the middle of the field and stressing the linebackers more in coverage on underneath routes. Jackson’s presence is a big reason for that. It’s the only way to prevent him from running wide open deep downfield every week.

When the defense is forced to keep multiple safeties back it does a couple of things. It means there are fewer coverages that the quarterback has to be concerned about but it also means the defense can’t be creative with its blitzing. Against Washington you can’t show single coverage to Jackson before having a defender come from a different area of the field to drop deeper than him, he’ll beat your defender to the spot and be gone by the time you do it. You also can’t just sit one defensive back 10 yards off the ball from the beginning of the play, he’ll beat them with his route running or even still with his straight-line speed.

All-out blitzes are completely off the table.

Take this play against the Chicago Bears in Week 16. The Bears attempt to disguise their all-out blitz with a corner coming off the edge and both safeties moving forward. The blitz pickup is excellent, giving Cousins time to see Jackson enter his break in his route. Jackson stayed disciplined with his stem, pushing towards the cornerback sitting off of him before breaking back infield. This prevented the cornerback from jumping his route.

Jackson’s speed is such that he can reach back for the ball and stop immediately as he catches it without the defender ever getting near him. From there he runs downfield for a 57-yard gain.

DeSean Jackson's presence alters defenses. Because the Redskins had an arsenal of weapons to use, and how Kirk Cousins is okayish at throwing deep, defenses were forced to account for Jackson and limit their defensive playcalls because of such.

Gruden utilized the tools on the Redskins, stretching the field and making defenses stay on the tips of their toes at every way.

However, it looks like it may be a lot different in Tampa. Jameis Winston is horrible at the deep ball, even though he throws that style so often. DeSean Jackson's impact may be limited due to such:

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Washington had a very talented offense last year and Gruden’s philosophy maximized Jackson’s impact by stretching the defense in every possible way. With Pierre Garcon, Jamison Crowder and Jordan Reed complementing Jackson, they had four receivers who could get open deep, get open underneath, create yards after the catch and adjust to inaccurate passes at the catch point.

In Tampa Bay, it’s much less likely that Jackson’s impact will be as significant.

Jameis Winston was accurate on 30.51 percent of his deep passes last year, only five quarterbacks were worse than him. Furthermore, remember Cousins’ percentage of passes thrown to five yards? 53.15 percent, ninth in the league if you don’t remember. Winston threw 33.84 percent of his passes within five yards of the line of scrimmage, only Cam Newton threw fewer passes to that level of the field. Peculiarly, Winston’s percent of deep throws wasn’t that high either. He threw 11.22 percent of his passes further than 20 yards downfield, 14th in the league, instead focusing most of his passes into the 11-20 range, where he ranked first in the league with 33.06 percent of his passes going there.

The four vert offense that Dirk Koetter relies on means Winston is pushing the ball downfield all the time. He’s asked to hit intermediate routes that are harder to hit and in turn harder to create yards after the catch from. 34.89 percent of Winston’s yards came after the catch, only Matt Barkley had a lower number.

Jackson opening up the field for his teammates isn’t going to matter if his teammates aren’t capable of or set up to take advantage of that space. Opposing defenses won’t face the same quandary that they faced when Jackson was in Washington.

That's the issue. Although Tampa's supporting cast looks good on paper, they won't be able to take advantage of the impact DeSean Jackson makes by being on the field. Defenses won't have to worry as much, knowing the rest of Tampa's offense isn't very good at YAC and is based on the vertical game.

In other words, defenses shouldn't have to worry too much about facing Tampa's offense. Although DeSean Jackson should improve it, don't expect them to be an unstoppable juggernaut. Unless Jameis Winston becomes more accurate in the deep game, and their offensive philosophy shifts to a more diverse, challenging scheme, do expect DeSean Jackson's role to be limited.

DeSean Jackson is special, but him being on Tampa does not allow him to maximize his benefits.

 

[UpstatePanther]

2 hours ago, Saca312 said:

Couple that with Tampa's offensive philosophy of pushing the ball downfield, and it looks like a scary team on paper.

in other words, Tampa will be the paper tiger they've been for 16 years now?

[The Huddler]

1 hour ago, UpstatePanther said:

in other words, Tampa will be the paper tiger they've been for 16 years now?

The big ugly tough looking pirate that you could  lightly push and he falls to the ground in a drunken rage and is too drunk to get up

[Hotsauce]

I'm really curious why DJax has been somewhat of a journeyman for his career. I get he is a dynamic playmaker (or at least was once), why wouldn't teams find a way to keep him? Just my .02 without doing any research on him

[GoobyPls]

I'm gonna bump this thread when he burns us a couple of times. 

Jamies struggled on his deep ball cause his fastest receiver is Mike Evans. That's like judging Cam deep ball when we had Avant and Cotchery starting.

[Johnny Rockets]

21 minutes ago, Hotsauce said:

I'm really curious why DJax has been somewhat of a journeyman for his career. I get he is a dynamic playmaker (or at least was once), why wouldn't teams find a way to keep him? Just my .02 without doing any research on him

Eagles - Chip Kelly ego; supposed off field activities. 

Redskins - D Jax was unrestricted free agent and wanted to play elsewhere. As fast as D Jax is, Cousins didn't throw him the deep ball much. I think I heard that he was targeting deep only 5 times last year and 4 times the year before. Also, $$$$$$.

[Jangler]

9 minutes ago, GoobyPls said:

I'm gonna bump this thread when he burns us a couple of times. 

Jamies struggled on his deep ball cause his fastest receiver is Mike Evans. That's like judging Cam deep ball when we had Avant and Cotchery starting.

of the teams in the division, TB is the real threat. (of course we have been saying that..) NO has Brees. Atl, has Ryan, who is a vegetable right now. Then TB...

The Panthers are miles ahead of the division, and yet the Bucs are hanging around.

[Johnny Rockets]

1 minute ago, Jangler said:

of the teams in the division, TB is the real threat. (of course we have been saying that..) NO has Brees. Atl, has Ryan, who is a vegetable right now. Then TB...

The Panthers are miles ahead of the division, and yet the Bucs are hanging around.

Sorry, but I don't see how you can say a team that finished last is "miles ahead of their division" especially when one of those teams went to the SB. Optimism is fine but it's a tough, competitive conference. Should be an interesting battle this year. 

[Jangler]

Talent wise, is what I'm saying,I guess.

 

it's an odd year, for sure. ;)

[jumpman910]

35 minutes ago, Hotsauce said:

I'm really curious why DJax has been somewhat of a journeyman for his career. I get he is a dynamic playmaker (or at least was once), why wouldn't teams find a way to keep him? Just my .02 without doing any research on him

Desean was and still is the type of guy who always asked for more money. IMO that started him be ousted in Philly. They paid him one after he complained then like a year and a half later he was already chirping about a new contract. But the Redskins was all about him getting his last big payday and we all know Tampa will pay you if they want you.

[Saca312]

30 minutes ago, GoobyPls said:

Jamies struggled on his deep ball cause his fastest receiver is Mike Evans. That's like judging Cam deep ball when we had Avant and Cotchery starting.

Oh lord. That doesn't mean you miss your WRs by seven hundred miles. See for yourself below:

We come back to Winston, this time discussing a major flaw of his, which is his accuracy. For as many things as he does right, Winston’s accuracy is downright horrible at times, often not being in the same area as the intended receiver. This is what stalled the Bucs offense at times in 2016, and if it’s not improved, it could continue to stall them this year.

There’s plenty of examples of Winston completely missing receivers, but for this article we’ll focus on two great examples. The first throw, above, is an atrocious miss. To overthrow a 6 ft 5 freak in Mike Evans is an achievement in of itself, and it’s something Winston has done way too much in his career. As productive as Evans has been, he would benefit much more from far more precise accuracy on downfield throws.

Anyway, you’ll notice that Winston’s release is a bit high on this throw. The mechanics on the release look unnatural, the footwork is sloppy, and it’s no surprise that the pass itself is wobbly. The entire process is uncomfortable to look at.

The 2nd throw, above, is as much of a disaster for different reasons. Winston’s inaccuracy left too many downfield plays on the field, and several touchdowns as well. He performed much better later on in the game, but this was a sign of how awful his accuracy can be. Outside the pocket, his mechanics look much more comfortable. Outside, while he’s able to step up in the pocket, his accuracy isn’t clear-cut.

While Winston’s aggressive style of play is a blessing, it can also be a curse. His ability to process reads as a result is madly inconsistent. The play above is more of a terrible decision than anything else. Winston misreads the coverage completely, firing an interception straight to the safety.

As good as Winston is outside of the pocket, he can also be too aggressive for his own good. I’m all for quarterbacks being aggressive, but there also has to be a perfect balance of aggression and awareness. This play illustrates the wrong way to do it. Winston does a great job of buying time, but the play is pretty much dead. He should’ve thrown the ball away to set up a field goal.

Instead, the pass is nearly picked (the defender didn’t have possession in bounds), almost costing the Buccaneers valuable points. Winston was very fortunate to escape with just an incomplete pass.

 

[shaqattaq]

1 hour ago, GoobyPls said:

I'm gonna bump this thread when he burns us a couple of times. 

Jamies struggled on his deep ball cause his fastest receiver is Mike Evans. That's like judging Cam deep ball when we had Avant and Cotchery starting.

DJax will definitely burn some teams this season (including us in all likelihood). I don't think that Saca was saying that he's not special, just that Winston and the Buc's offensive style won't maximize his effectiveness. Even still, they will get the ball into his hands, and he will make poo happen.

No comment on the long ball/Evans rationale, but Tampa did desperately need a influx of speed.

[GoobyPls]

45 minutes ago, Saca312 said:

Oh lord. That doesn't mean you miss your WRs by seven hundred miles. See for yourself below:

We come back to Winston, this time discussing a major flaw of his, which is his accuracy. For as many things as he does right, Winston’s accuracy is downright horrible at times, often not being in the same area as the intended receiver. This is what stalled the Bucs offense at times in 2016, and if it’s not improved, it could continue to stall them this year.

There’s plenty of examples of Winston completely missing receivers, but for this article we’ll focus on two great examples. The first throw, above, is an atrocious miss. To overthrow a 6 ft 5 freak in Mike Evans is an achievement in of itself, and it’s something Winston has done way too much in his career. As productive as Evans has been, he would benefit much more from far more precise accuracy on downfield throws.

Anyway, you’ll notice that Winston’s release is a bit high on this throw. The mechanics on the release look unnatural, the footwork is sloppy, and it’s no surprise that the pass itself is wobbly. The entire process is uncomfortable to look at.

The 2nd throw, above, is as much of a disaster for different reasons. Winston’s inaccuracy left too many downfield plays on the field, and several touchdowns as well. He performed much better later on in the game, but this was a sign of how awful his accuracy can be. Outside the pocket, his mechanics look much more comfortable. Outside, while he’s able to step up in the pocket, his accuracy isn’t clear-cut.

While Winston’s aggressive style of play is a blessing, it can also be a curse. His ability to process reads as a result is madly inconsistent. The play above is more of a terrible decision than anything else. Winston misreads the coverage completely, firing an interception straight to the safety.

As good as Winston is outside of the pocket, he can also be too aggressive for his own good. I’m all for quarterbacks being aggressive, but there also has to be a perfect balance of aggression and awareness. This play illustrates the wrong way to do it. Winston does a great job of buying time, but the play is pretty much dead. He should’ve thrown the ball away to set up a field goal.

Instead, the pass is nearly picked (the defender didn’t have possession in bounds), almost costing the Buccaneers valuable points. Winston was very fortunate to escape with just an incomplete pass.

 

I know Winston has accuracy problems, he also loves to lock onto Mike Evans to much, but your gifs mean nothing. They didn't show one deep pass. I can post GIF every QB in the NFL over throwing wide open receivers especially Cam.

 

All I know is Winston has the arm to make Desean a huge threat, Jackson with noodle arm Cousins just had back to back 1000 yard seasons. Just keep that in mind

[Saca312]

21 minutes ago, GoobyPls said:

All I know is Winston has the arm to make Desean a huge threat

Some facts that immediately disprove that statement:

Jameis Winston was accurate on 30.51 percent of his deep passes last year, only five quarterbacks were worse than him. Winston’s percent of deep throws wasn’t that high either. He threw 11.22 percent of his passes further than 20 yards downfield, 14th in the league, instead focusing most of his passes into the 11-20 range, where he ranked first in the league with 33.06 percent of his passes going there.