Which DE is worth a shot in this years draft

[WOW!!]

14 minutes ago, gmonjimbo said:

Im not an expert and I don't know if this was answered but the arm length of a DE or OT is important because of the point of attack or engagement. If an OT can get their arms on you before you get into a bull rush or swim move then it stymies your ability to get to the QB.

 

 

Oh to counter not having Ideal length..

Barnett has "kung fu" master type hand fighting skill..

That show me player worked at something to counter balance god giving gifts others might have..

[LinvilleGorge]

Just now, CPF4LIFE said:

Gentlemen has said repeatedly he values game tape over measurables everytime. When they bring these guys in for private workouts it's gonna come down to who's impresses the most. Look at it that way. 

Yet how many times have we listened to him rave about a prospect's measurables after drafting him? KB, Funchess, Ealy, and Butler come to mind immediately. I don't think he puts too much value into the actual drills, but he pays a lot of attention to that measuring tape.

[WOW!!]

Just now, LinvilleGorge said:

Yet how many times have we listened to him rave about a prospect's measurables after drafting him? KB, Funchess, Ealy, and Butler come to mind immediately. I don't think he puts too much value into the actual drills, but he pays a lot of attention to that measuring tape.

He also drafted Shaq thoe as well..

[LinvilleGorge]

3 minutes ago, WOW!! said:

He also drafted Shaq thoe as well..

Gettleman seems to value speed over size at OLB. Size in the trenches, at WR, and at outside CB.

[gmonjimbo]

1 hour ago, WOW!! said:

 

Perfect example.

Give me Luke Kuchely over Aaron Curry any day..

The thing with Luke is that his athleticism confirmed what scouts saw on tape. A 3 down sideline to sideline LB with crazy closing speed and instincts. Luke did not come into the combine and run a 4.9. Derek Barnett was very productive in college but he ran a 4.8 at 259 pounds, so the concern will his game translate. I think there are several prospects better than Barnett that could be available  at 8 but I could be wrong. 

[gmonjimbo]

8 minutes ago, WOW!! said:

Oh to counter not having Ideal length..

Barnett has "kung fu" master type hand fighting skill..

That show me player worked at something to counter balance god giving gifts others might have..

I like Barnett and I think he is a first round pick but not top 10. I will go to draft breakdown and look at more of his games 

[SeoulPanther]

2 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

Way worse in what ways? The knocks on his measurables are his height and his arm length. Ideally, you'd like to see both an inch or two longer.

I see Thomas' measurables as less of a concern than Barnett's because his arms are longer, he's heavier (based on the apples to apples numbers we have available right now) and he's faster and more athletic (again, based on those same apples to apples numbers).

Height and weight compared to some other DE's, -hence him being described by many media as a tweener rightly or wrongly. Obviously you disagree that he should be grouped with Barnett in measurables though it seems similar in ball park terms to me, but compared to other prototypical DE's the same criticism can be levelled at Thomas. It's the double standard I don't get you're saying the arms, the tenth of a second and the 10 LBS are important comparing him to Barnett but not compared to say Taco?

His speed and athleticism are better than most DE's though nowhere near Garrett's, but that doesn't stop him being described in his NFL.com profile as " Considered a "tweener" by scouts, who believe he could struggle to keep enough weight on his frame to play along interior. Length is below average as five-technique. Plays with inconsistent pad level. Needs to get bigger and stronger through his lower body. Tends to play taller as play rolls along and can get washed out of plays by strong down blocks. Hands are quick but need more consistent pop behind them. Overall play strength can be improved. "Big and strong" across from him causes some issues. Gets engulfed at times. Snap-count guesser with seven offsides penalties in 2016. "                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          Like you with Barnett I have no issue with him as a selection at #8, I just think you're overstating his attributes and their significance. interesting chat though. Thanks for your insight. I'm off to bed its 3.30 here in Seoul.

[LinvilleGorge]

1 minute ago, gmonjimbo said:

The thing with Luke is that his athleticism confirmed what scouts saw on tape. A 3 down sideline to sideline LB with crazy closing speed and instincts. Luke did not come into the combine and run a 4.9. Derek Barnett was very productive in college but he ran a 4.8 at 259 pounds, so the concern will his game translate. I think there are several prospects better than Barnett that could be available  at 8 but I could be wrong. 

Yep, compare them.

http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/luke-kuechly?id=2533056

http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/aaron-curry?id=79842

Both tested as excellent athletes. Both were trifecta guys. Excellent measurables, excellent athleticism, and excellent production. It's why it was such a shock that Curry was a complete bust.

[davos]

I know this has happened in the past with other players---I could totally see our guys watching tape on Fournette against Arkansas will be like who is this #48? Deatrich Wise Jr.  

I see him translating very smoothly to the NFL and would totally take a chance on Wise.  Has a really good feel for the game and is an obvious Base 4-3.  Same can be said for Basham who I believe we've already met with outside of the combine.  

We've got to capitalize on the DE talent this year, it's a drool worthy class.  Keep the names of Basham and Wise in your minds.  That could be happening Round 2 or 3.  

 

[WOW!!]

3 minutes ago, gmonjimbo said:

The thing with Luke is that his athleticism confirmed what scouts saw on tape. A 3 down sideline to sideline LB with crazy closing speed and instincts. Luke did not come into the combine and run a 4.9. Derek Barnett was very productive in college but he ran a 4.8 at 259 pounds, so the concern will his game translate. I think there are several prospects better than Barnett that could be available  at 8 but I could be wrong. 

Again underware olympics don't matter other than the medical checks and Pysh eval's..

Plain and simple. 

He has the best or 2nd best tape for a DE in this draft..

But again at this point i don't care .. at this point i'm repeating myself over and over for no reason.  If we can get him at a later picks because he isn't the prototype great.. 

Plus he'll have a chip in his shoulder .#winning

[gmonjimbo]

7 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

Yep, compare them.

http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/luke-kuechly?id=2533056

http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/aaron-curry?id=79842

Both tested as excellent athletes. Both were trifecta guys. Excellent measurables, excellent athleticism, and excellent production. It's why it was such a shock that Curry was a complete bust.

Yep I remember analyst saying he was the safest pick in the draft 

[gmonjimbo]

http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/everson-griffen?id=496790

Solomon Thomas has similar measurements to Everson Griffen 6'3 275 ran 4.63 

[Swaggasaurus]

57 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

DeMarcus Ware was a college DE who went #11 overall to play 3-4 OLB. Aldon Smith went #7. It's not at all uncommon.

 

Again, they rushed from the edge, Thomas did not. Those players make sense because they rush outside while keeping contain. The comparisons to 4-3 DE and 3-4 OLB are much more similar than 4-3DE vs 3-4DE. The roles and responsibilities could not be more different .

[LinvilleGorge]

7 minutes ago, Swaggasaurus said:

Again, they rushed from the edge, Thomas did not. Those players make sense because they rush outside while keeping contain. The comparisons to 4-3 DE and 3-4 OLB are much more similar than 4-3DE vs 3-4DE. The roles and responsibilities could not be more different .

My main point was that it's far less about what you've done and far more about what you're projected to be able to do. Hell, you have former college QBs playing WR.  Lots of former OTs kicking inside to OG. CBs going to S and on and on.

People questioned Thomas' ability to rush the edge because they hadn't seen him do it a lot. Then at the Combine he showed the athletic ability to do it.