KK wants 17 million a year?

[thefuzz]

I hope that we can keep him, and I hope that he stays motivated.

 

That said, you can't overspend for a DT, and if he really wants that amount, he will likely play under the tag this season, and start over again after the season looking for the big contract.

[Kakarot]

2 hours ago, Anybodyhome said:

Not really. 

Top 5 DT salaries in 2016:

Suh (Miami): $19.06M

Cox: (Philly): $17.1M

Dareus (Buffalo): $16.09M

McCoy (Tampa Bay): $15.87M

Jackson (Jax): $14.25M

If this number holds up, the franchise tag for a DT will be around $16.5M in 2017. If KK wants $17M, just go ahead and pay him since he'd be getting about that regardless and use the tag somewhere else or not at all. 

 

Agree with this.

[d-dave]

Man, the market is so insane.

I guess the best question is the value.  KK is what, 27?  How many years will he play at an all pro level?  $17m/year is All Pro level IMO.  He was great two years ago.  He was solid this season.  Is he a cornerstone player?  

I'm curious what his free agent value is at this point.  I am willing to bet that KK does get a good deal from us.  This is the exact kind of home grown talent Gettleman doesn't want to let go.  Norman was an aberration, and shouldn't be the expectation.

[Nails]

2 hours ago, Anybodyhome said:

Not really. 

Top 5 DT salaries in 2016:

Suh (Miami): $19.06M

Cox: (Philly): $17.1M

Dareus (Buffalo): $16.09M

McCoy (Tampa Bay): $15.87M

Jackson (Jax): $14.25M

If this number holds up, the franchise tag for a DT will be around $16.5M in 2017. If KK wants $17M, just go ahead and pay him since he'd be getting about that regardless and use the tag somewhere else or not at all. 

 

Good post but helps prove a point.  KK is not as good or consistent as those guys and who in hades wants to emulate those teams?!  Not I.

[Anybodyhome]

8 minutes ago, Nails said:

Good post but helps prove a point.  KK is not as good or consistent as those guys and who in hades wants to emulate those teams?!  Not I.

I don't have access to PFF grades, but from a pure statistical perspective, Short had a better season than 4 of the top 5 paid guys on that list. Only Suh had a better year using basic stats. 

If someone could stack up PFF grades and show where Short ranks among the players on that salary list, I'd be curious to know. 

Also, keep in mind the franchise tag is only used by 25-30% of the teams in the league, and the trend has been lower since the lockout. You see teams using the tag when they are in cap hell and don't have the depth to lose a key player, and it quite often results in an off year for the player. It is quite rare that you see a player get tagged and they have a great season. 

[Guest Lasus83]

Man, the market is so insane.

I guess the best question is the value.  KK is what, 27?  How many years will he play at an all pro level?  $17m/year is All Pro level IMO.  He was great two years ago.  He was solid this season.  Is he a cornerstone player?  

I'm curious what his free agent value is at this point.  I am willing to bet that KK does get a good deal from us.  This is the exact kind of home grown talent Gettleman doesn't want to let go.  Norman was an aberration, and shouldn't be the expectation.

KK will be 28 for the start of the 17 season. 29 by the end of the tag... if he is tagged

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[Nails]

14 minutes ago, Anybodyhome said:

I don't have access to PFF grades, but from a pure statistical perspective, Short had a better season than 4 of the top 5 paid guys on that list. Only Suh had a better year using basic stats. 

If someone could stack up PFF grades and show where Short ranks among the players on that salary list, I'd be curious to know. 

Also, keep in mind the franchise tag is only used by 25-30% of the teams in the league, and the trend has been lower since the lockout. You see teams using the tag when they are in cap hell and don't have the depth to lose a key player, and it quite often results in an off year for the player. It is quite rare that you see a player get tagged and they have a great season. 

Exactly why I'm a tag and trade or let him go fan.  

[SetfreexX]

He is getting tagged, we re-sign Addison, and Johnson. Draft a DE on day 2. The year after that Star, and Vernon are the starting duo. 

I don't see us losing another FT'ed player after the fall out last year. 

[pantherphan96]

tag him 2x and let some other team pay $17 million/year for a 30y/o DT

[AU-panther]

1 hour ago, pantherphan96 said:

tag him 2x and let some other team pay $17 million/year for a 30y/o DT

If you are willing to tag him twice you mind as well give him a long term deal.  The second tag is more expensive then the first. 

Depending on the structure a 5yr/$80-$90 deal could have the same 2 year cost as if you tagged him twice.  Only difference is you still have under contract for years 3-5 if you want.  That is one reason that you very rarely see double tags.

 

[The Lone Panther]

Tag him, if he plays like he did 2015, then the higher ups may be able to work something out.  If not, then bye bye

[CatMan72]

It says "expected to ask" but doesn't say what that expectation is based on... so we don't know if this is what KK or his agent is asking for or just pure speculation. 

If he wants 17-19 mil I would tag him and give Butler one more year to develop. 

[pantherphan96]

4 hours ago, AU-panther said:

If you are willing to tag him twice you mind as well give him a long term deal.  The second tag is more expensive then the first. 

Depending on the structure a 5yr/$80-$90 deal could have the same 2 year cost as if you tagged him twice.  Only difference is you still have under contract for years 3-5 if you want.  That is one reason that you very rarely see double tags.

1st year tag would be around $13.651 million/year (last year's number, maybe a little higher) and the second year would be 120% of that so just under 16,500,000.

basically you would get 2 years for $30,000,000 so around 15/year, right around where Gettleman was willing to offer him last year.

then you can let him get paid a 5 year 80-90 million deal by some other team who will spend for a 30 year old DT. we can sign Star long term for cheaper and Butler will be groomed as a replacement.

[Cpt slay a ho]

Tagging him is the best logical option, gives butler another year to develop, hopefully healthy, and we don't get put into a situation relying too heavily on a second year player


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