Pundits "Stabbed in the back"

[panthers55]

4 minutes ago, Anybodyhome said:

 

The minute he signs the tag, he gives up his entire bargaining position because the team doesn't have to negotiate squat until the end of the following season.

Winner winner, Chicken Dinner. 

[Sasquatch]

12 minutes ago, Anybodyhome said:

 

The minute he signs the tag, he gives up his entire bargaining position because the team doesn't have to negotiate squat until the end of the following season.

So his desire to be a Panther was out-weighed by his desire to be paid. If he had followed the process and started discussion with another team, he could have established an accurate market and provided an opportunity for the panthers to negotiate some form of compensation. He priced himself so high that even a compromise was beyond acceptable for the team. So they cut him loose allowing him to chase the dollar rather than force him to sit or play on what he saw as an unacceptable deal. That doesn't make the team the bad guys.

[CRA]

1 hour ago, iamhubby1 said:

 

Botched the tag? How? Are you of the mind that Gman had a responsibility to communicate with Josh? If so, why wasn't Josh more involved. If I wanted to stay with a team. I would sure be involved.

 

 

Botched the tag as in removed it.  Didn't rent Josh for a year while he rebuilt our secondary and kept us in the hunt again in 2016.

that is Gettlemen's job.  Put bodies on the field so we can win.  He could of put a better team on the field to win in 2016.  We have Cam and Luke in their prime and TD is in the twighlight of elite play....wasted season in a window to be great 

[iamhubby1]

41 minutes ago, panthers55 said:

Apparently you weren't reading my.posts. I predicted big problems on the secondary and a bunch of early struggling.  I did predict 10-6 thinking the offense would save us early but even I didn't realize how bad we would be on defense. I blame the reports from training camp talking about how good the rookies were doing. That was either extreme optimism or proof our receivers aren't very good so the rookies looked better than they did when the games actually started.

If I, a mere fan saw it, don't tell me Gettleman and Rivera didn't.

 

And once again, you missed what I said. I said "Most fans" thought we were going to at least be competitive. You got in such a hurry to tell me you were right, you forgot to understand what I was saying.

 

Just because you foresaw the downfall, does not mean that most of us didn't as well. Pat yourself on the back all you want. It still doesn't change the FACT that most folks may have thought we would struggle, but they did not think it would wind up this badly. I mean, you pat yourself on the back for thinking exactly what most of us were thinking. There were going to be struggles.

 

Wasn't the average record in the prediction thread about 9-7, or 10-6? So yeah, most folks saw a struggle coming, just not to the extent it did. So when things fell apart? Yeah, most fans are going to start pointing fingers. And everyone knows fans don't need facts to point fingers.

 

And you sir, are no mere fan.

[uncfan888]

The defense isn't the main reason for our record.  It's our offense's inability to score in the second half and sustain drives.  Can't expect the defense to be on the field the entire second half every game and not give up points 

[CRA]

Just now, uncfan888 said:

The defense isn't the main reason for our record.  It's our offense's inability to score in the second half and sustain drives.  Can't expect the defense to be on the field the entire second half every game and not give up points 

D is a bigger reason than the O.  We invest on D and play style that dictates the heavily invested D make certain plays when up...

stop Oak late, stop Tampa late, stop NO late, etc.

we don't invest in the O yet expect them to put up 30 to win each game. 

[panthers55]

2 minutes ago, iamhubby1 said:

 

And once again, you missed what I said. I said "Most fans" thought we were going to at least be competitive. 

 

Just because you foresaw the downfall, does not mean that most of us didn't as well. 

And you sir, are no mere fan.

So we both agree that most of us saw that a 15-1 team was going to struggle needlessly over what would have been 2 or 3 million a year. And that we compounded the problem by not bringing in veterans to replace him or Tillman or Harper.  How is this okay for a Superbowl team to fall do far do fast and our defense have made a precipitous decline.

[iamhubby1]

8 minutes ago, CRA said:

Botched the tag as in removed it.  Didn't rent Josh for a year while he rebuilt our secondary and kept us in the hunt again in 2016.

that is Gettlemen's job.  Put bodies on the field so we can win.  He could of put a better team on the field to win in 2016.  We have Cam and Luke in their prime and TD is in the twighlight of elite play....wasted season in a window to be great 

 

Josh wanted a long term deal, and was offered one by the Panthers. Gman wanted Josh, and even offered him a long term deal. When it became clear that Josh was not going to sign a long term deal, Gman rescinded the tag. Why rent a guy who will be gone anyway? Do you trust him to play hard? Do you trust him to not be a distraction?

 

The ONLY money we had last year was going to go to Josh. Once that fell through, there was no one out there worth picking up. Hard to build a team when there is no talent to be found.

 

As I have said before. This is one of those situations that has no middle ground. No one is going to change anyone else's mind. So I am done.

 

By the by, we did try to use the Josh money on KK. But that didn't go well either. So we did try to spend the money. And that money will go to good use this off-season. I tell ya what.

[CRA]

5 minutes ago, iamhubby1 said:

 

Josh wanted a long term deal, and was offered one by the Panthers. Gman wanted Josh, and even offered him a long term deal. When it became clear that Josh was not going to sign a long term deal, Gman rescinded the tag. Why rent a guy who will be gone anyway? Do you trust him to play hard? Do you trust him to not be a distraction?

 

The ONLY money we had last year was going to go to Josh. Once that fell through, there was no one out there worth picking up. Hard to build a team when there is no talent to be found.

 

As I have said before. This is one of those situations that has no middle ground. No one is going to change anyone else's mind. So I am done.

 

By the by, we did try to use the Josh money on KK. But that didn't go well either. So we did try to spend the money. And that money will go to good use this off-season. I tell ya what.

You rent a guy because winning is your job.  He still wanted to be here we had no secondary.   Keeps us competitive in 2016 and allows you to use him as a bridge to rebuild.  Plus, maybe he has good year instead of a MVP caliber/All Pro year and a long term deal this offseason get talked about under different circumstances.

what Gettlemen did just doesn't happen...yet your defense is he had no choice and totally make sense 

[iamhubby1]

6 minutes ago, panthers55 said:

So we both agree that most of us saw that a 15-1 team was going to struggle needlessly over what would have been 2 or 3 million a year. And that we compounded the problem by not bringing in veterans to replace him or Tillman or Harper.  How is this okay for a Superbowl team to fall do far do fast and our defense have made a precipitous decline.

 

Nope. 

 

Now, this all only makes sense if you truly believe that Gman, and Ron during their end of the year evaluations. Where they were coming off a SB, and bringing back 20-22 starters. With some kids you hope will take the next step. And did not think that this year was going to be successful?

 

At the end of last year, almost everyone thought we could be good. Even with the loss of Allen, Tillman, and nobody wanting Harper. So losing Josh, plus this horrible season, has folks up in arms. Even though most thought we were still going to be competitive.

 

You can't have is both ways.

 

 

[iamhubby1]

1 hour ago, CRA said:

You rent a guy because winning is your job.  He still wanted to be here we had no secondary.   Keeps us competitive in 2016 and allows you to use him as a bridge to rebuild.  Plus, maybe he has good year instead of a MVP caliber/All Pro year and a long term deal this offseason get talked about under different circumstances.

what Gettlemen did just doesn't happen...yet your defense is he had no choice and totally make sense 

 

I give up. You are twisting my words. Confusing the topic to your slant, and throw in some meaningless points. Hard to lose a debate that way.

 

First. I am pretty sure Josh would have made us better this year, pretty hard to debate that fact. However, we were discussing the rescinding of the tag, not what impact Josh has/had. It's a nice point, don't get me wrong. It just has no bearing on our debate.

 

Second. I never said Gman had no choice. I am not even sure where that came from. I am sure you wouldn't try to put words in my mouth to bolster your opinion.

 

Like I have said. There is no middle ground on this subject. Back and white, with no grey.

 

I have had my fill. I am sorry, but I am done with this.

[iamhubby1]

2 hours ago, CRA said:

D is a bigger reason than the O.  We invest on D and play style that dictates the heavily invested D make certain plays when up...

stop Oak late, stop Tampa late, stop NO late, etc.

we don't invest in the O yet expect them to put up 30 to win each game. 

 

We had the #1 Offense, and were getting KB back. EVERYONE thought our O was going to beast.

 

Even at the beginning of the year folks thought our Defense was going to be OK. We thought the front 7 could help ease the young CBs growing pains.

 

Most everyone thought we would push close to 10 wins, and at least make the Playoffs.

 

Funny how things work out.

[tiger7_88]

3 hours ago, iamhubby1 said:

 

I give up. You are twisting my words. Confusing the topic to your slant, and throw in some meaningless points. Hard to lose a debate that way.

 

First. I am pretty sure Josh would have made us better this year, pretty hard to debate that fact. However, we were discussing the rescinding of the tag, not what impact Josh has/had. It's a nice point, don't get me wrong. It just has no bearing on our debate.

 

Second. I never said Gman had no choice. I am not even sure where that came from. I am sure you wouldn't try to put words in my mouth to bolster your opinion.

 

Like I have said. There is no middle ground on this subject. Back and white, with no grey.

 

I have had my fill. I am sorry, but I am done with this.

You have been beating your head up against a brick wall.

Want to know why?

Because none of this has to do with Norman or rookie cornerbacks or Tre Boston.

99.99% of it has to do with one thing and one thing only...

Steve Smith Sr.

Yes, they are STILL that butthurt after all these years.

[Fox007]

I do think that Gman has to rethink his ideas about how to run things and how to handle things AND how he thinks of himself.

I honestly think Mr. Gettle does see himself as a GodFather/Goodfella who just whacks mofos without them knowing and without him caring.

He's gotta get over that poo man...he's a smart football guy to argue otherwise is just retarded...he needs to up his interpersonal relationship game and personnel management in regards to who we currently have no who we are getting next.

I thought very highly of him and he did do well at first....this offseason has been a disaster and there are some smoke signals hinting at a fire that could be a major problem if it isn't snuffed out.