Second half scoring... what happened?

[nctarheel0619]

36 minutes ago, TheRed said:

I see what he did there too, touche @CRA

[csx]

I wish people would stop trying to simplify the situation down to 1 single issue. What else is there in the universe that is explained by a single cause?

[nctarheel0619]

Just now, csx said:

I wish people would stop trying to simplify the situation down to 1 single issue. What else is there in the universe that is explained by a single cause?

A terrible 2016 off season sure does help.  

[DaveThePanther2008]

1 hour ago, Jeremy Igo said:

Scoring in the second half is way down this year. Huge contributor to the 3-6 record. 

 

Theories as to why the second half presents more problems for the offense?

Defenses adjust to what we are doing and Shula goes brain dead.

[Johnny Rockets]

1 hour ago, Jeremy Igo said:

Scoring in the second half is way down this year. Huge contributor to the 3-6 record. 

 

Theories as to why the second half presents more problems for the offense?

Unless you are seeing something I am not, 1.4 pts difference from last year even after getting shut out by the Chiefs this past week is not really "way down". Up until this past game, 2nd half scoring was more than last year when they were top 5 in the league. So they can and have scored 2nd half points, but have struggled to do it consistently or recently.

Also curious to what the turnover ratio is in the 2nd half this year vs. last year which I have a feeling plays a part in it. 

[CRA]

21 minutes ago, stbugs said:

Again completely missing the point. We had no business passing at that point. Why pass when you can run and either get a first down or kick a chip shot FG? Go up by 17 to start the 4th quarter. Alex Smith has never thrown for 3 TDs in a quarter. He's only once in his career thrown for more than 3TDs in a game. They've got 3 points in 3 quarters. A FG there ends the game and Cam doesn't feel any pressure to throw a pick 6, heck we probably just run anyway.

Calling two pass plays with deep drops is inexcusable. There is zero reason to risk not getting the FG. Only Shula would call two passes allowing us to lose 20 yards and punt when we started at their 20, having a 37 yard FG attempt. Even after the first sack, you try and get 3rd and 18 when you are trying to run out the clock and you still have a 45 yard attempt?

I don't blame the OL for calling a deep drop pass on 3rd and 18, might as well just tell the D pin your ears back we're going to try and throw it 20 yards. So stupid and basically ended our season.


Sent from my iPhone using CarolinaHuddle

Now John Fox would thrive if inserted into the KC game in the 4th.

actually as a Panther and Clemson fan I could of used a little Fox Football in both those games at the end 

[TheRed]

41 minutes ago, stbugs said:

I know we like to blame the run game but I also blame the play calling. Look at KC, what plays hurt us the most protecting the lead? The multiple sacks when we had 1st and 10 on the KC 20 to knock us out of FG range or the runs that converted a 4th down to get us to the 20. Amazing that even after the first sack, we still had a 45 yard FG and we pass again and get a 12 yard sack. Somehow with our play calling we turn a chip shot FG to go up 17 going into the 4th into 3 plays and a loss of 20 yards followed by a punt so that KC gets the ball where we had the 1st down. Then the pick 6.

We didn't lose the game due to run blocking. We lost due to horrific coaching decisions to give the game away. If you score 17 in the first half and your defense gives up 9, how do you lose? This season has just been hard to watch knowing we should be 2 games up on the Falcons and 3 on the Saints with home games remaining against both even with all the injuries.

Oh, but Gettleman had to go into rebuild mode and not sign 5 pro bowl tackles so here we are.


Sent from my iPhone using CarolinaHuddle

Oh I completely agree there have been obvious coaching, and player gaffes.

Not sure if that last bit about Gettleman is directed at me. But we definitely could have at the very least done a better job of improving our OL depth this offseason so we aren't stuck starting guys like Remmers at Cam's blindside. Nobody has said anything about magically signing 5 pro bowlers. If you want to give Gettleman a pass, that's up to you, but our offseason was a failure, that isn't debateable.

[Jangler]

51 minutes ago, PhillyB said:

ron's response to the ebbs and flows of the game isn't instinctive. some coaches are fish in the water, ron is a baby sea turtle stuck in a plastic beer can ring floundering and hoping to catch the current at the right time.

 

[gakonline]

1 hour ago, Jeremy Igo said:

I always thought the run game was more important at the start of the game. Wears defense out, sets up the pass. 

I totally agree. The issue is the panthers do the opposite. Pass and score points in the first half and run, run, run in the 2nd. Too many three and outs and putting the the defense in bad position. Teams come back and win. End of story. 

[TheRed]

13 minutes ago, stbugs said:

Not really, just my general annoyance with the this team is in rebuild mode/we have no talent/Gettleman destroyed the team in the offseason comments.

I'm not going to give him a pass, but the OL we started with this year is identical to the OL that was on the #1 scoring offense that made the SB. The only change there was that we actually added a legitimate backup C, which has helped with Kalil missing time. I am not saying this offseason was a disaster, because I personally think this team has way more talent and if the coaches could coach their way out of a paper bag, we'd be 2 games up on the Falcons. That also isn't debatable, but people here seem to want to just say Gettleman screwed the pooch. We gained Benjamin and lost Norman. That sure as poo shouldn't turn 17-2 into 3-6.

Let me ask a simple question. Do you really think the KC game showed that Gettleman was to blame or that our coaches really do have problemts?

Of course he didn't destroy the team. That's useless exaggeration.

This isn't a one game deal I'm talking about. This is a theme throughout our season so far.

You seem to be under some sort of impression that I'm somehow blaming Gettleman almost entirely for this, and that just isn't true. Ron Rivera has once again regressed in gameday situational awareness, Shula is Shula. There's blame to go around. So we can just move beyond that right now.  

Man I really really really hate this "it's the same OL that went 15-1 last season" argument.

Since SB50 our OL has been getting trounced thoroughly, and we've gotten our quarterback injured for our troubles. Nobody cares about what we accomplished last year anymore.

We gave up a 4th rounder for a punter, who we've already put on IR. We could have done more with this OL depth. We have to learn from this debacle all around.

[CRA]

22 minutes ago, gakonline said:

I totally agree. The issue is the panthers do the opposite. Pass and score points in the first half and run, run, run in the 2nd. Too many three and outs and putting the the defense in bad position. Teams come back and win. End of story. 

We actually don't go run, run, run in the 2nd half.  

2nd half vs KC we were more pass oriented than run oriented.  4 of 5 drives had more called passes than runs.  

[Darth Biscuit]

44 minutes ago, Johnny Rockets said:

Unless you are seeing something I am not, 1.4 pts difference from last year even after getting shut out by the Chiefs this past week is not really "way down". Up until this past game, 2nd half scoring was more than last year when they were top 5 in the league. So they can and have scored 2nd half points, but have struggled to do it consistently or recently.

Also curious to what the turnover ratio is in the 2nd half this year vs. last year which I have a feeling plays a part in it. 

Well, well, well... look who makes an appearance.  :p

 

 

It's not one thing, there's no single thing that you can blame this on.  We have many of the same issues this season that we had last season, but last season we had more experienced vets on D to rely on and if I had to look at one overarching issue, it's coaching.  Lack of conditioning, lack of discipline (both with assignments, execution and penalties) and possibly more importantly, lack of in-game adjustments to the other team are all critical in the NFL and can all be laid at the feet of the coaching staff.

[GoobyPls]

27 minutes ago, stbugs said:

Not really, just my general annoyance with the this team is in rebuild mode/we have no talent/Gettleman destroyed the team in the offseason comments.

I'm not going to give him a pass, but the OL we started with this year is identical to the OL that was on the #1 scoring offense that made the SB.The only change there was that we actually added a legitimate backup C, which has helped with Kalil missing time. I am not saying this offseason was a disaster, because I personally think this team has way more talent and if the coaches could coach their way out of a paper bag, we'd be 2 games up on the Falcons. That also isn't debatable, but people here seem to want to just say Gettleman screwed the pooch. We gained Benjamin and lost Norman. That sure as poo shouldn't turn 17-2 into 3-6.

Let me ask a simple question. Do you really think the KC game showed that Gettleman was to blame or that our coaches really do have problemts?

People keep using this argument, but it just doesn't hold up. Last year we were bottom 10 in sacks per pass attempts, that right there was a major red flag. Greg Cosell even pointed out how we ran more max protection than any other team in the league, why is that? Cause our pass protection was never really that good. We had to masquerade it with leaving extra blockers, luckily Cam was able to make do with 3 receiving options most of the time. 

 

There were a ton suitable OT this past offseason, we passed on all of them.

[CRA]

1 minute ago, GoobyPls said:

People keep using this argument, but it just doesn't hold up. Last year we were bottom 10 in sacks per pass attempts, that right there was a major red flag. Greg Cosell even pointed out how we ran more max protection than any other team in the league, why is that? Cause our pass protection was never really that good. We had to masquerade it with leaving extra blockers, luckily Cam was able to make do with 3 receiving options most of the time. 

 

There were a ton suitable OT this past offseason, we passed on all of them.

We not only ran more max protection than everyone in the NFL but teams allowed it. Until Wade Phillips laughed at all our opponents for how they dealt with max protect.  Now teams are like..thanks Wade for telling us a basic approach to deal with it.