It is Coach's Film Tuesday! Saints game observations...

[CatMan72]

1 hour ago, Bartin said:

It's just a great play. CJ has seen that TE motion 1000 times and every time before now the TE is going out for a pass route into the endzone. His normal job is to chase down Brees if it's a play action fake to the RB and Brees bootlegs to the right side which he is setting up to do. It's one of those great plays that only works once and it was executed perfectly. Nothing to really get upset about on that one. You just tip your hat to Payton and move on.

Not upset and understand it was a bit of a trick play, but any way to slice it the guy with the ball ran right past CJ who was in perfect position (to his credit) to make a play. 

It happens, not an indictment of CJ in any way.  

[CatMan72]

21 minutes ago, sean705 said:

This is a prime example of Shula dialing up the homerun shot. I've watched this play on loop on NFL Game pass now 30+ times. 

If I knew how to create GIFs I'd put in some but I don't so I'll do my best to explain. 

Start of the play, Olsen motions out so we have 4 wide. Philly (I think) Far outside left, KB inside him in the slot, Olsen in the right slot, Funchess wide Right. 

The Saints are initially line up to mask cover two nickle, but shift to cover one ater the snap. 

Both KB and Olsen come off running out routes, while TG and Funchess look to be running 10 yard stop or comeback routes. Stewart is on a delayed middle release.

This is a play we've used before, as Olsen's shallow out a double move route, as is Philly's stop route. 

Olsen is actually running a corner route, but 33 is all over him and doesn't release him to the corner. This has worked for us before as Funchess, like in this play, tends to draw double coverage as he does here.It's meant to free up Olsen down the right sideline 

Once Cam sees this, he looks the now one high safety over to the Olsen Funchess side waiting for Olsen to come free (which dosen't happen), and is next read is going to be Philly in the stop and go, right as the pressure gets to him is when Philly gains a step on his man, and if he had a second longer, it could have been a TD. However that sent happen, Cam has already checked off Philly and is looking to KB then to Stewart who are both well covered, And the 4 rushers are able to twist there way in and make the sack before Cam can make any decision. 

This is indeed a textbook coverage sack, the debate is if we should have been dialing up a homerun shot on third and 8 when we were inside the 50. These long developing plays are what kill us in these situation in my opinion. 

The other debate is if our situational playcalling has become too predictable (I fear this is the case). Could point to many more examples where opponents seem to know exactly what is coming based on personnel and formations. In this example, 33 sticks with Olsen because he knows that where we're trying to go with the ball on this play. 

[sean705]

3 minutes ago, CatMan72 said:

The other debate is if our situational playcalling has become too predictable (I fear this is the case). Could point to many more examples where opponents seem to know exactly what is coming based on personnel and formations. In this example, 33 sticks with Olsen because he knows that where we're trying to go with the ball on this play. 

Agree 100%

My question after re-watching the play was, seeing the personnel on the field, why we tried to dial up a deep pass. KB and Funchess were obvious decoys (they literally stop and sit down in coverage to try and draw attention). Granted it was early in the game, but we were already playing from behind, we needed points on the board. You're on the road in a loud environment with the crowd already getting loud. If Cam tried to audible out of the call, the odds are someone will miss the call, so I don't disagree with Cam not calling the audible there. But, if we go for a more conservative pass play and succeed in getting 6-7 yards, we at least have a shot of dialing the crowd back a bit with a FG. Instead, we call a play that has a higher than average probability of a sack, especially since they had (what looked to me to be) their nickle package on the field. A sack in that situation killed the drive any our momentum, now we had to rely on the defense to stop Brees again.  

[CatMan72]

1 minute ago, sean705 said:

Agree 100%

My question after re-watching the play was, seeing the personnel on the field, why we tried to dial up a deep pass. KB and Funchess were obvious decoys (they literally stop and sit down in coverage to try and draw attention). Granted it was early in the game, but we were already playing from behind, we needed points on the board. You're on the road in a loud environment with the crowd already getting loud. If Cam tried to audible out of the call, the odds are someone will miss the call, so I don't disagree with Cam not calling the audible there. But, if we go for a more conservative pass play and succeed in getting 6-7 yards, we at least have a shot of dialing the crowd back a bit with a FG. Instead, we call a play that has a higher than average probability of a sack, especially since they had (what looked to me to be) their nickle package on the field. A sack in that situation killed the drive any our momentum, now we had to rely on the defense to stop Brees again.  

Good question, I think we ask Cam to be his own check-down based on his athleticism. This allows us to keep one more guy back to protect or send him out on a deeper route (or protect with a delayed route) in this example. Defenses have figured this out and are daring Cam to run because they know he's inclined to stand in the pocket and wait for something to come open. Breakdowns in our standard pass pro on the offensive line with replacements like Remmers at LT and Williams at RT have only compounded the problem. 

[sean705]

2 minutes ago, CatMan72 said:

Good question, I think we ask Cam to be his own check-down based on his athleticism. This allows us to keep one more guy back to protect or send him out on a deeper route (or protect with a delayed route) in this example. Defenses have figured this out and are daring Cam to run because they know he's inclined to stand in the pocket and wait for something to come open. Breakdowns in our standard pass pro on the offensive line with replacements like Remmers at LT and Williams at RT have only compounded the problem. 

That and the Saints I'm sure knew Cam wasn't going to be running anywhere near as much coming off the concussion protocol this week. It's not hard to guess that Cam probably had a "no run" directive (Which explains his comment in the post game), and without that threat, long developing plays like that don't work. I can sit here and criticize in hindsight, but I would think that our coaches may have but in a bit of thought on that too in their gameplan. 

[CatMan72]

2 minutes ago, sean705 said:

That and the Saints I'm sure knew Cam wasn't going to be running anywhere near as much coming off the concussion protocol this week. It's not hard to guess that Cam probably had a "no run" directive (Which explains his comment in the post game), and without that threat, long developing plays like that don't work. I can sit here and criticize in hindsight, but I would think that our coaches may have but in a bit of thought on that too in their gameplan. 

Hopefully we self scout during the bye and realize we need to run some shorter routes and give Cam more quick options to get rid of the ball. Need to change our tendencies big time. 

[Neylus]

It would be nice to see a breakdown of the Lewis 60 yard punt return. 

[sean705]

12 minutes ago, Neylus said:

It would be nice to see a breakdown of the Lewis 60 yard punt return. 

Based on the releases of all the punt team players, it looks like Lee was going to try and punt that to the sideline, however, he put it closer to the hash. Teddy Williams undercut the returner by 3 yards and was out of position to turn him back the the sideline. After that , he just had to make a move on the two gunners coming in from the left and find a seam. 

[Untouchable]

9 hours ago, Jeremy Igo said:

Biggest take away from this game is how awful Zack Sanchez is. No business being on a NFL roster. 

Just a hunch but with the workout Wednesday and Johnson able to come back, I don't think he will be much longer. 

[stankowalski]

These threads make so much more sense than x player sucks.

[Darth Biscuit]

6 hours ago, stankowalski said:

These threads make so much more sense than x player sucks.

Agree 1000%... this thread is actually worth reading and not filled with "fire X" or "why did we keep Y"

[Nate Dogg]

Great, now we are gonna be running different tight ends on the field every time we run the ball. As if Shula's play calls weren't predictable enough already.

[SOJA]

8 hours ago, stankowalski said:

These threads make so much more sense than x player sucks.

player x sucks

x = 2016 Carolina Panthers, save for the GOAT Andy Lee