Scouting The Vikings

[Vikesfan]

Offense:
I'll keep the intro short. Our offenses isn't as bad as it looks. We are very bad in the redzone. Not sure what happens to Norv in the redzone but he gets ultra conservative and it leads to FGs. That's said... lets break them down.

QB - Not much of a grade I can give to Sam Bradford. He looked good on Sunday but he's brand new to the system. Can't proclaim anything by one game. He can lay and egg from here on out. He is a major question mark to me

RB - Ap is the gold standard for Rb this generation. He might play but most likely he's out for 2 weeks. Sucks because his impact will be miss. His stats look like he is having issues but in reality, our Oline is giving him 0 help. We are better off putting 5 trash cans out there on running plays they may get in the way of defenders more than our oline. 0.33 yards before contact is horrible. Teams are selling out to stop AP and we can't stop it. With him gone, I expect your team to help on Diggs put Luke on Rudolph and then send the rest at our weak line. Mckinnon is a stud and could start for a few teams in the league. He has bulked up since his rookie season and is surprisingly strong and agile. His dangerous out the back field. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TpJ_pB1hh9c

WR:
Diggs is a solid WR. There is a lot of hype on him because of his hands, route running and start stop abilities. However, last season teams decided to press him and he struggled. Not sure if teams are doing the same this year ( I have to go scout) but he has been tearing it up. I think teams are selling out on AP and backing out their CBs to protect the deep ball. No AP and Diggs might have to prove he can beat press.

CJ - JAG. Just a guy. OC and WR coach loves the guy. He has all the measurable. 6'2 4.4 fourty, great leaping but he is not the sum of his parts. Will catch the occasional pass. Put anyone you want on him. I'm not a fan.

Theilan - Was disrespected by Bengals in training camp. Pac-Man was upset when he had to cover him because they thought he was just some "white" WR and then he started eatting them up. Was an UDFA and has worked his way up to the 3rd WR. Watch any game and he makes our big time catches. He can ball but is really just a solid dependable guy. Plays special teams as well. 

Patterson - The enigma. With our last OC, CP looked like he was on his way to destroying the league. In comes Norv and CP gets benched and eventually only had 2 passes thrown his way all of last season. There is no player better with the ball in his hands in the league. At 6'3 he cuts and shifts like a guy that 5'9 but breaks tackles like his size would indicate. It's one of the reasons he is the best KR in the league since he has been here. Our average starting position this season is 10 yards further than the 2nd place team. Despite all of this, he sits on the bench. Norv says its because he can't be trusted to line up perfectly, at the right depth and run the right route. I think Norv is wasting a great talent. We don't throw him screens or pitches and we have used him mostly as a decoy or to run a predictable endaround. You guys might see more of him this week with Peterson out. 

Treadwell - Clean scratch for 2 weeks. Our coaches aren't afraid to scratch a top draft pick.

 

[fieryprophet]

17 minutes ago, Vikesfan said:

Watch the first video posted. You will see how we do it different than a lot of other teams. Zimmer is one of the progenitors of the scheme. I think you will see much that you haven't seen before. My biggest concern is the read option. Our DEs have struggle with diagnosing it quickly and it seems to be something you guys use a lot.

Zimmer is not one of the progenitors, it's a wrinkle that's been around in form or another for decades. One of the reasons you don't get on the field as a RB for the Panthers if you can't pass protect is because the RB will often have responsibility for A gap blitzers.

[rico6]

19 minutes ago, Vikesfan said:

Please don't get me wrong with the Barr talk. Luke is the standard hands down and as I said, I would trade Barr for him. He is dominant  at the things he is great at, coverage, runs support, pursuit, instincts, playmaking, hitting. Barr is no where the hitter Luke is. His run support is good but definitely a notch below Luke. Lastly, Barr has a harder times getting off blocks than Luke in my eyes. I just think when you add a guy that graded tops or close to it in pass rush but give him the ability to play the pass too, he is more versatile.  

Idk man, if Luke's main role was to blitz and 'sometimes' cover and play defensive QB his sack stats and etc would probably mirror Barr's. I'm not selling him short but literally taking Luke and making him a Pass Rush Specialist in this D would spell monumental destruction for the secondary as whole. Barr doesn't carry the burdens of a MLB; especially one as talented like Luke.

[Vikesfan]

41 minutes ago, Promethean Forerunner said:

The Vikings' weakness is in their OL. AP has looked average lately and that's due to poor blocking. Peterson had something like 19 yards rushing (20 after contact) with a 1.6 ypc. That's where we can control this game. If our boys finally step up then Bradford is gonna have PTSD from our last meeting. Their tackles are mediocre and their interior might be worse. I like our chances of Bradford throwing the ball against us 20-30x. Eventually Luke, Shaq and TD will pick him off, especially with him going to his security blankets in Diggs and Randolph. That said, if they decide to dink and dunk, it'll be a long game. Bradberry, Worley, Boston, Coleman and Benwikere are gonna have to tackle well.

Barr isn't on par with Luke just because he's an elite blitzer. Kuechly owns Barr in any other category which includes coverage, play recognition, sideline to sideline speed, tackling, etc. Luke does the work of two ILBs. 

Luke isn't better in coverage per PFF. I'll give it a rest though. I am on a Panthers board. What I am saying is blasphemy. So I will change it. Barr is a more versatile LB than Luke.  

[Vikesfan]

1 minute ago, fieryprophet said:

Zimmer is not one of the progenitors, it's a wrinkle that's been around in form or another for decades. One of the reasons you don't get on the field as a RB for the Panthers if you can't pass protect is because the RB will often have responsibility for A gap blitzers.

Everything has been around for decades. Nothing is new. However, the recent resurgence of the double A scheme can be traced back to the Bengals and Zimmer's schemes there. 

[fieryprophet]

Just now, Vikesfan said:

Luke isn't better in coverage per PFF. I'll give it a rest though. I am on a Panthers board. What I am saying is blasphemy. So I will change it. Barr is a more versatile LB than Luke.  

https://www.profootballfocus.com/pro-pffs-best-coverage-defender-award-luke-kuechly-no-1/

PFF themselves say he's the best coverage defender in the entire league, corners and safeties included. Barr doesn't even make their top 5. What are you talking about?

[Vikesfan]

2 minutes ago, rico6 said:

Idk man, if Luke's main role was to blitz and 'sometimes' cover and play defensive QB his sack stats and etc would probably mirror Barr's. I'm not selling him short but literally taking Luke and making him a Pass Rush Specialist in this D would spell monumental destruction for the secondary as whole. Barr doesn't carry the burdens of a MLB; especially one as talented like Luke.

On can argue that your DTs help to keep Luke really clean. Something that most MLBs do not have the luxury of. Side note, I really thought your stud DT would be Star but I loved Short too. When you guys drafted both, I threw my remote. Either way, I relent. Luke is the gold standard. 

[Vikesfan]

4 minutes ago, fieryprophet said:

Zimmer is not one of the progenitors, it's a wrinkle that's been around in form or another for decades. One of the reasons you don't get on the field as a RB for the Panthers if you can't pass protect is because the RB will often have responsibility for A gap blitzers.

This is the reason I expect to see more Tolbert than Fozzy this game. I wouldn't leave fozzy to block the 6'5 Barr. 

[Chief_Chokeaho]

1 minute ago, Vikesfan said:

On can argue that your DTs help to keep Luke really clean. Something that most MLBs do not have the luxury of. Side note, I really thought your stud DT would be Star but I loved Short too. When you guys drafted both, I threw my remote. Either way, I relent. Luke is the gold standard. 

Luke won DROTY and was a candidate for DPOTY his rookie season when we had arguably the worst defensive tackles in the league.

[t96]

1 hour ago, Vikesfan said:

I think I explained pretty well what I think he is a better overall but he is no where as dominant. 

There is no way anybody who's watched both players can say that Barr is "better overall."

[Vikesfan]

TE:
We have a solid collection of TEs. Rudolph is an Average TE stuck in an Elite TEs body. Holy hell. He frustrates me to no end. Every time you write him off as average, he makes one play to suck you back in. He has great hands and he is 6'6 with good speed for the position. He has been injured a lot in his career so maybe that's the issue but the guy should be a 800 yard 7 td TE but he has never cracked 500 yards on a season. Utterly frustrating. He has all the tools. 

Pruitt  - has been hurt the last 2 games. Very fast, very good route runner. Caught a lot of footballs at lower comp and took last year to get accustomed to the game. Not a weapon but will make a decent dive extended catch. 

Elison - Our runblocking TE. Injured his knee late last season and hasn't played yet to my eyes. 

Morgan - Mr. Mankato (award given by local press to guy that came out of nowhere and made the team in training camp in Mankato, MN). Came from SMU and was known only as a blocker. Showed decent skills in camp to the point we wanted Elison cut. We ended up keeping 4 TEs on roster. 

[fieryprophet]

8 minutes ago, Vikesfan said:

Everything has been around for decades. Nothing is new. However, the recent resurgence of the double A scheme can be traced back to the Bengals and Zimmer's schemes there. 

Try again. Jim Johnson, who both McDermott and Rivera are disciples of, was running it back in the 90s.

[Vikesfan]

6 minutes ago, thomas96 said:

There is no way anybody who's watched both players can say that Barr is "better overall."

1) I relented and said, fine. Barr is more versatile
2) PFF, who watches all games and provides analysis of players as a revenue has Barr ranked as the best in 2015. 

 
 

[CPantherKing]

Stefon Diggs and Mike Wallace against the Panthers secondary is worrisome.

Captain Munnerlyn will be waiting to make the Panthers pay.