We have traded for Andy Lee from the Browns

[Mr. Scot]

Just now, CPF4LIFE said:

News flash......TEAMS TAKE STEPS BACK. All of the best organizations have there low points and end up picking high in the draft because they lose talent or guys careers are over. Please lets not act like this team didnt make the playoffs or a superbowl under Hurney. We were just never consistent. This team finally wins a superbowl, Hurney won't touch Gettleman . Gettleman has had a great start here in large part due to having cam and Luke 2 he guys HE DID NOT DRAFT and rivera he did not hire.  A building without a foundation will always crumble I will just leave it at that. 

Lastly, for comparison sake, who were the players already on this roster that compare to cam and Luke when Hurney took the job?

Before you glorify the winner of any race remember who had the head start and who didn't. Once again, just being realistic. 

Not at all "realistic".

Making the playoffs three times in eleven years is not "taking a step back".

[MCC]

Love it! The weakest position on a super bowl team just became a strength for a late 4th rounder. 

Our defense is going to love going on the field after one of the best punters in NFL history switches the field or pins the opponent inside their own 20.

[CPantherKing]

2 minutes ago, ctrcat said:

Primarily because the league took away our franchise player and $13+ million.  Secondarily because GMan had to clean up Hurney's mess and face the salary cap demon head on or kick the can down the road.

Did Hurney choose to sign DeCoud, Cason, Avant, Underwood? Did Hurney choose to invest in Bell as a starting LT and Chandler as the RT with a contract extension only to make a late season desperation move to find a sub par Remmers as a stop gap? Nope. That would be Gettleman. Just own the mistakes he made along with his wins. Be honest. 2014 was bad. Very bad. A win in the playoffs against a very beat up Cardinals team was just a consolation for winning an extremely awful division.

[CRA]

14 minutes ago, CPantherKing said:

We all know 2014 was a terrible season that resulted in a losing record. Primarily due to the personnel decisions made in the 2014 off season. How is that consistently winning? That is a good season followed by a bad season. Then another good season. Seems to be the status quo outside the 2009/2010 seasons Jerry Richardson hijacked for his battle with the players over the CBA.

If going to the playoffs as a result of being the best of the worst only to get whooped by the NFC Champion is what you take pride in, then you clearly do not realize the problems this front office has caused and continue to cause for the veterans on the team.

If Cam Newton was as healthy in 2014 as he was in 2015....2014 would have been a good year. 

[ctrcat]

3 minutes ago, CPantherKing said:

Did Hurney choose to sign DeCoud, Cason, Avant, Underwood? Did Hurney choose to invest in Bell as a starting LT and Chandler as the RT with a contract extension only to make a late season desperation move to find a sub par Remmers as a stop gap? Nope. That would be Gettleman. Just own the mistakes he made along with his wins. Be honest. 2014 was bad. Very bad. A win in the playoffs against a very beat up Cardinals team was just a consolation for winning an extremely awful division.

Was the bum ankle, busted ribs, and car accident Gettleman's fault too?

[Mr. Scot]

7 minutes ago, Xavier said:

 

This argument is often stated, but is so lacking in critical thinking.  Hurney got fired after Luke's rookie season, and after Cam's second in which he still a nascent, emergent talent, who had not flashed nearly the pocket passing ability he displayed last season.  Quarterbacks take time to develop obviously, as do rookies - so to say, "we were still losing with a 22 year old Cam Newton" is totally disingenuous.  We weren't even terrible, as we went from 1-15 to 6-10 with rookie Cam.

Look into Peyton Manning's rookie season:  here's a clue, the Colts went 3-13.  This isn't even a defense of Hurney, who I think deserved to get fired.  But to credit Gettleman's magnificent roster building skills for our turnaround last season, when in reality, it took an MVP performance from Cam Newton (that he was not capable of at 22 years old) to lift up a very mediocre offense into the best in the league, lacks any real credibility.

You can't have it both ways with Cam being the MVP, and Gettleman being the greatest GM ever.

Cam's numbers weren't as good as Brady or Carson Palmer, but I think we all recognized he deserved the MVP because he was playing with subpar talent?  Who is responsible for this subpart talent, despite the fact he has inherited a probowl running back, center, and tight end?

Did Cam have subpar talent last year or not?  Because if not, he probably doesn't deserve to be MVP.  Our roster is greatly overrated, and part of this is Hurney's fault for strapping us with bad contracts. 

Gettleman has been a terrific scout, as he was with the Giants.  He drafts very well, especially considering it's usually late.  I'd rather have him as GM than Hurney.  But he's not infallible, and has made a mistakes.  We can't just 'trust in Gettleman' when he is obviously doing dumb things because Cam Newton lifted us to 15-1 record last season. 

His record is more patchy than people are willing to admit, and he handled the summer of 2014 pretty terribly.  The Panthers turnaround has largely revolved around Cam improving as a player, and when he was off in 2014 due to injury, we went 7-8-1 even with 'the Godfather' in charge.

Creating an alt just to have somebody agree with your idiotic positions is really just pathetic, dude.

Oh, and FYI, the mods here have been known to ban people for creating alts.

[The NFL Shield At Midfield]

3 minutes ago, ctrcat said:

Was the bum ankle, busted ribs, and car accident Gettleman's fault too?

yeah

[Bartin]

Uhh wow...a 4th for a punter? It needed to be addressed but that is really steep and reeks of desperation to correct an offseason failure to properly address the position.

DG definitely made a mistake with the punter situation this offseason and honestly that's fine. No one is perfect and he's done more than enough to earn a screw up here and there but I do worry he doubled down on his mistake to make up for it. Even if he's great we overpaid but it would be excusable. We got screwed if he's simply an above average punter.

[Xavier]

Andy Lee was a pro bowl Punter half a decade ago.  He's 34 now, and while punters often age well, all the analytics point to him having dropped off significantly in recent years, especially when it comes to precision and placement.

So if it makes you feel better to say we traded for a 'pro bowl, alltime great punter', sure, tell yourself what you need.  But it was ridiculous to pay a 4th round pick and take on a guy with a huge cap hit when the Browns paid a mere 7th rounder for this same guy last year (and that was when there was more hope he would return to his old form).

If it was done in a vacuum, it wouldn't even be that huge of a deal, but it now hampers our ability to go out and fill needs on the offensive line or pass rush (not to even mention the secondary), because

1- we lost a 4th round pick we could have used for someone else

2- significant cap hit for a punter, especially with a GM as frugal as Gettleman

 

 

 

[CPF4LIFE]

1 minute ago, Mr. Scot said:

Not at all "realistic".

Making the playoffs three times in eleven years is not "taking a step back".

And one of those years it was due to the division Just sucking that bad. We got in with a losing record, I want to say we were that good but I can't shake luck not having something to do with that. The 12-4 year we was consistently one of the best teams all season just to lose the first playoff game to Colin Kaepernick so I say this...... I want to see this team to do more and they are perfectly capable of doing more. 

[the butch]

First move in Getts' tenure here that I disagree with.  Took long enough.

[Saca312]

5 minutes ago, CPantherKing said:

Did Hurney choose to sign DeCoud, Cason, Avant, Underwood? Did Hurney choose to invest in Bell as a starting LT and Chandler as the RT with a contract extension only to make a late season desperation move to find a sub par Remmers as a stop gap? Nope. That would be Gettleman. Just own the mistakes he made along with his wins. Be honest. 2014 was bad. Very bad. A win in the playoffs against a very beat up Cardinals team was just a consolation for winning an extremely awful division.

Did Gettleman choose to lead the team to Cap hell, causing huge contract concerns of overpaid costs for little value? Did Gettleman let his personal emotions get in the way of business and football? Nope. That would be Hurney. Just his own mistakes that would've lead to a very Saint-like organization today. Those Hurney contracts were bad. Very bad. Getting Cam and Luke in the top 10 of the draft was just a consolation for terribly managing the Panther's contracts.

[CPantherKing]

15 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

We already know you're too stupid to watch football.

Did you create an alt just so you could have someone who didn't call you a moron?

Believe it or not there are many other people who do not agree with your Gettleman is God club of bullies.

13 minutes ago, pantherclaw said:

I never considered Nortman as the long term solution. He was a stop gap, that was decent enough to tried to retain, but chose not to at the cost he was demanding. 

While they signed some FAs, I never considered them to be a part of the long term solution. 

The punting game is far to valuable, especially to a team that intends on contending for the Superbowl year in and year out. 

A future 4th rd pick for an all pro punter?  Sounds like long term fix to me.  

We should be greatful that our GM works so diligently.

Will it sound even better when the Panthers are paying him $4m, or is this just another draft pick thrown out the window like Norwood and Allen because the front office could not fix the issue in the offseason?

2 minutes ago, CRA said:

If Cam Newton was as healthy in 2014 as he was in 2015....2014 would have been a good year. 

Exactly my point. Thanks for the support and agreeing with me.

Just now, ctrcat said:

Was the bum ankle, busted ribs, and car accident Gettleman's fault too?

No. It just underlined a huge crutch that Gettleman has to rely on, and that the supporting cast he provides the foundation he was afforded is not good enough to step up when a key player is playing hurt.

[usmcpanthers]

Nortman was my adopt a panther..I had to keep up with his stats...he was slightly above avg. Punting has been a mess since he left. It had to get fixed now

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