We couldn't afford Jonathan Stewart

[frash.exe]

Because they are not being used correctly?

Because if you don't secure and pressure from the interior of the line, the defense we run will suffer immensely?

What's your secondary point?

Hell, besides bitching what is your original point?

nope

With all the talent we invested we should be able to compensate for the lack of pressure by the front four, and there's no excuse for fox that they couldn't generate pressure since we were content with the guys we had after the Jenkins trade. I mean it was basically our choice to start Lewis next to kemo last year and they didn't dominate, they didn't generate a whole lot of pressure

cryptic synopsis on qbing in the first round doesn't mean poo to me either. I'm trying to get you to be specific and you're not doing it. You're being passive aggressive like every other rube who comes in and makes stupid excuses for fox.

[jpniner]

is Glenn Dorsey still a possible trade option for the Chiefs?

[frash.exe]

Hay guyz I created my own opinion summary on why my blatant misconception about first round qbs is true but I'm not going to explain the criteria I used or the parameters I went by I'm just going to show you the results, which only consist of a lonely percentage figure and nothing else

[bleys]

We could have actually traded back from 13th to the Eagles spot. got an extra pick or 2, while also getting depth for the 2nd and 4th we gave away to get Otah... while not mortgaging the future and still having great picks for a RB in the '08 draft..

that part would be hindsight, but even at the least, it didn't take much of a fortune teller to see ahead that Otah at 13th and a solid RB in the 2nd would have been easy to gain. While keeping that 2nd and 4th...

But if the Eagles were willing to deal, not knowing what would have happened and taking educated guesses on what teams needs are, that would be a bet worth taking any day. Gain picks and solid players.. Hindsight yes, but not unrealistic by any means at all..

Really disagree with those saying this is the benefit of hindsight as if the possibilities were totally unrealistic... but rather having confidence in your decisions, instead of throwing in all your chips to ensure the same level of progress..

Edit: and we can move forward... Never talk about bad decisions the FO has made. But like someone mentioned before, this is why Fox/Hurney may not be here next year.. So to ignore all of this is wrong as well...

I keep wanting to say this, although I hate that I am, but these decisions are what separate great teams like the Patriots from the Panthers... So I do find it relevant to discuss, since Belicheck isn't leaving any time soon.. Yes, given those are 2 extremes in teams, so replace that successful team with any other, isntead of contradicting it with "Not everyone can be the patriots".. There is no reason we cannot be successful though. And for a team that builds through the draft, this is a relevant topic.

[Sloth]

Flacco at the time was a guy that moved to a small school because he couldn't beat out the amazing Tyler Palko at Pittsburg. He wasn't dominant at Delaware, but was good. His entire claim to a first round grade was his physical attributes. He was the Vernon Gholston of QBs. He went to a team with a great defense and seems to be succeeding, which is great. As much as I want a change in FO, no way in Hell do I blame anyone for not taking that gamble at the time, with the information they actually had, you know, available to them.

I'm not even going to touch Aaron Rodgers, from a fan perspective. All I remember from fans was laughing at how far he fell, then more laughing at how long he sat on the bench in GB. I can't recall one person on any Panthers board canvassing for him. He was pretty much a running joke at the time. He too turned out pretty good. Good for him. Now we're stupid because we didn't grab him.

There's a lot of revisionist poo going on with Williams as well. When we drafted Stewart, he hadn't proved anything other than being a little better than Foster. He was brought down easily, danced too much and apparently wasn't taking practice/conditioning very seriously. Please trust me, if Williams had arrived as a rookie looking like he does now, and with the work ethic he has now, he WOULD have started and been featured more. We probably would have waited a few rounds to grab his backup.

Our first next year netted us Brown and Goodson. Goodson has shown flashes but has struggled some with ball security and Brown has been mostly quiet in a year when it was known he would need to bulk up some to play DE in a 4-3. We can't franchise Peppers again, so.. we drafted a young DE who had a tremendous previous college season and give him a year to redshirt, learn the playbook and condition himself. Until then, he comes in on pretty obvious passing downs. Goodson's problem can be coached and he has a TON of natural ability, provided he takes to coaching.

Or, you can take the obvious position that neither will amount to anything, ever, 2 games into their rookie seasons.

[PhillyB]

this is awfully damn easy to say a year and a half after it happened. where was this thread in 2008 when Double Trouble was tearing up the turf and making Fox and Hurney look like geniuses? No offense meant to the OP on this, but I think it's kind of lame to take swipes at the front office for moves that almost certainly made our '08 campaign what it was. No Stewart/Otah = 9-7

[Delhommey]

Let's take a look at an fuller list of QB's we "missed" in the first or second round in Fox's tenure:

02 - Harrington and Ramsey passed over for Peppers

03 - Boller and Grossman passed over for Gross

04 - No real prospects here. Losman was the closest at 22. We got Gamble instead

05 - Rodgers and Campbell passed over for Davis.

06 - Clemens and T Jackson passed over for Williams

07 - Quinn and Kolb passed up for Beason (and Kalil)

08 - Flacco and Brohm (2nd) passed up for Stewart and Otah

Of these 13 QB's only 3 started fulltime this year.

So Fox and Hurney gets 9 key starters instead of taking a 76% chance we get a guy who doesn't even start.

Man what a bunch of idiots.

From my post in Jan.

I can go over the numbers there if needs be.

Also I can review the numbers of a 50% bust rate on the 1st rounders listed in Raging Bull's post as well. It's, um, not really hard.

But in the end, it all comes down to what Kurb said then:

listen here delhommy we had a very bad game and i am very upset something drastic must be done or i shall remain unconsoleable!!!1

[megadeth078]

If you ask me, or anyone for that matter, the brown trade was a way bigger fug up than the '08 draft.

[frash.exe]

From my post in Jan.

I can go over the numbers there if needs be.

Also I can review the numbers of a 50% bust rate on the 1st rounders listed in Raging Bull's post as well. It's, um, not really hard.

But in the end, it all comes down to what Kurb said then:

Lol you padded your own opinion and included second rounders and you actually have the balls to think tarvaris Jackson and Clemens were first round caliber. Lol Kevin Kolb too, who most of the football world thought was nothing more than a second rounder at best. Even brohm's stock droppied significantly before the draft. Your summary is biased and sucks quite frankly.

Only qbs can bust, right?

[Delhommey]

So, let's use your numbers then with the 50% bust rate with the jury still out on 25% more.

[King Taharqa]

There's a lot of revisionist poo going on with Williams as well. When we drafted (Williams), he hadn't proved anything other than being a little better than Foster. He was brought down easily, danced too much and apparently wasn't taking practice/conditioning very seriously. Please trust me, if Williams had arrived as a rookie looking like he does now, and with the work ethic he has now, he WOULD have started and been featured more. We probably would have waited a few rounds to grab his backup.

Ive noticed this too. No one wants to admit, but in 2006, Williams was NOT a better option than Foster. People act like Williams hasnt improved GREATLY since he's been here. Which I think is a joke. I totally agree he danced too much, went down on first contact, and was not the consistent big play maker he has now become. The 2008 DeAngelo Williams was waaaay better than he was in 06. Now I'll give people in 07 DeAngelo could've started earlier than he did that year, but that 06 year, nope.

[frash.exe]

So, let's use your numbers then with the 50% bust rate with the jury still out on 25% more.

I wouldn't think jason's closer to busting than having a productive career since campbell did a good job protecting the ball last year and I don't know if you're following Cleveland but they are letting every defensive lineman get to Quinn. So in other words for delhomme sycophants it's the lines fault for his 5 turnovers against Philly but the fact that the browns oline can't pass protect means that it's all brady's fault he only threw 2 picks in two games

[Delhommey]

[frash.exe]

Out of 5 backs taken in the first round of the 2008 NFL draft only two are starters lol.