Broncos fan: "You need pie".

[PleaseGetReal]

3 minutes ago, PhillyB said:

He's making good points and I can't frame a better argument than "walk in a lake assbag".

Fixed your post for you.  You're welcome.

[PhillyB]

lol shut up nerd

[The Lobo]

47 minutes ago, PleaseGetReal said:

I already said the ball bounced our way.  A bunch of the incompletions were caused by good defensive play, knocking the ball out, pressuring Cam into a bad throw, etc. but there were a lot of unforced errors.  Good throws that were delivered to the receiver, who inexplicably dropped it before contact.  Tolbert had a really bad one in the flat if I remember correctly.  You mentioned Ginn's drop, and you're right, if that bounces any other way Ward doesn't intercept.

I have no trouble conceding that the Broncos got some breaks in the game.  I just object when people claim the entire victory was "handed to them", by either the refs, the Panthers, the NFL, the mafia, etc.  The Broncos played hard, came with an outstanding gameplan, and executed some outstanding play on defense.  They did it against an opponent against whom few gave them even a chance.  I resent people diminishing their achievement to satisfy their own sour grapes.  I appreciate the rational fans like you, and agree, the sequel should be good.  

They're not completely different, though.  Your starting offense is almost identical, our starting defense is almost identical.  You say it's not the same, but they lost 2 backups and two of their most replaceable starters.  While I recognize that there are questions at QB, what you're not recognizing is the QB position doesn't have the same importance on this Denver team as it does for everyone else.  Whether it's Sanchez or Siemian, their job will be to hand the ball off, take safe passes, exploit opportunities when they arrive, and most importantly punt the ball away rather than risk a turnover.  No one in the organization is going to expect them to lead thee team to victory, they will be expected to stay out of the defense's way.  If the offense can take care of the ball better than last year, a pretty low bar honestly, the defense will be even better than last season.  

No doubt about it they played hard and they won outright. I feel the Panthers were better that year, just on that night, it was Denvers night and Carolina picked the worst night ever to be off their game. I applaud you for coming on here and debating everyone. I think the outcome will be different this time though. I have a serious question, why isn't Talib suspended for some games? Plaxico shot himself and went to jail and was suspended (if I'm not mistaken he had the gun illegally). I think Talib had a permit for his gun or whatever, but wasn't he in a night club when he shot himself. I don't think you are allowed to conceal carry in a club (alcohol reasons) so wouldn't that be breaking player conduct policies or whatever? I'm just curious.

[caatfan]

54 minutes ago, PleaseGetReal said:

 I just object when people claim the entire victory was "handed to them", by either the refs, the Panthers, the NFL, the mafia, etc.

Yeah, that's BS. It was the mafia alone. 

 

[PleaseGetReal]

24 minutes ago, 15 said:

Like I said earlier in this thread and have seen seen a few other fans mention on here: any knowledgeable bronco fan that I discuss the superbowl with know that they did not get the panthers at full strength and were lucky enough to have the ball bounce their way several times in that game while literally nothing went our way in return. Any other bronco fan that casually follows the team will say stuff like "lol von raped cam - cam didn't dive on the ball - lol finally played a real team" and those are going to be the ones that will be saying "we won the game that mattered" when we steam roll denver on the 8th and can finally get back to focusing on relevant football teams on our path to finally bringing a Lombardi home. 

I acknowledge the Panthers weren't at full strength.  They were missing Benjamin and Stewart got hurt early.  But it's part of the game, and having the depth to cover injuries is part of the game too.  The Broncos were missing 4 defensive starters in Super Bowl 48 against the Seahawks, but you have to win or lose with the guys you have.  

I've said twice in this thread that the Broncos got some bounces, and you're not going to find anything in my posts about "Von raping Cam" or Cam not diving on the ball.  The pass rush was a team effort and waaaaaaay too much was made of Cam not diving on the ball.  It's too easy to look in slow motion and generate faulty analysis of what he was thinking when truthfully he had a moment to make a snap decision about how to recover the ball.  While the playoff wins over Seattle and Arizona were impressive, you do have to concede that the Broncos were the best team the Panthers faced all season, and that, through no fault of their own, the regular season didn't provide much in the way of real competition.

Of course I want the Broncos to win the next game and get off to a running start, but you have to realize that of the two games, the Super Bowl was absolutely the game that mattered, and I wouldn't trade that victory for a win next month.  I don't think there's anything wrong with being honest about that. 

[Bj-Monster23]

40 minutes ago, PleaseGetReal said:

I already said the ball bounced our way.  A bunch of the incompletions were caused by good defensive play, knocking the ball out, pressuring Cam into a bad throw, etc. but there were a lot of unforced errors.  Good throws that were delivered to the receiver, who inexplicably dropped it before contact.  Tolbert had a really bad one in the flat if I remember correctly.  You mentioned Ginn's drop, and you're right, if that bounces any other way Ward doesn't intercept.

I have no trouble conceding that the Broncos got some breaks in the game.  I just object when people claim the entire victory was "handed to them", by either the refs, the Panthers, the NFL, the mafia, etc.  The Broncos played hard, came with an outstanding gameplan, and executed some outstanding play on defense.  They did it against an opponent against whom few gave them even a chance.  I resent people diminishing their achievement to satisfy their own sour grapes.  I appreciate the rational fans like you, and agree, the sequel should be good.  

They're not completely different, though.  Your starting offense is almost identical, our starting defense is almost identical.  You say it's not the same, but they lost 2 backups and two of their most replaceable starters.  While I recognize that there are questions at QB, what you're not recognizing is the QB position doesn't have the same importance on this Denver team as it does for everyone else.  Whether it's Sanchez or Siemian, their job will be to hand the ball off, take safe passes, exploit opportunities when they arrive, and most importantly punt the ball away rather than risk a turnover.  No one in the organization is going to expect them to lead thee team to victory, they will be expected to stay out of the defense's way.  If the offense can take care of the ball better than last year, a pretty low bar honestly, the defense will be even better than last season.  

What do you mean the QB position doesn't have the same importance for your team? Let's not be naive. Like I said, you guys have a very good defense, but if you're assuming because you have a good defense not having to have a good QB is not important or will not benefit you this season than you are sadly mistaken. Every team needs good QB play why? Because having a good QB wins you games in the NFL to get you to the playoffs. But having a really good defense wins you championships in the NFL. Just my opinion, but i'm not sure if Sanchez or Siemian will keep your team in contention this season. I just see them making mistakes that Peyton or Brock wouldn't make. I also think you don't see the value in what Malik Jackson and Danny Trevathan had on your team. Those two were really good players in your scheme especially Jackson getting that pressure with Wolfe on the opposite side. If anything he had just as much of an effect to help Ware and Miller.

[PleaseGetReal]

11 minutes ago, The Lobo said:

No doubt about it they played hard and they won outright. I feel the Panthers were better that year, just on that night, it was Denvers night and Carolina picked the worst night ever to be off their game. I applaud you for coming on here and debating everyone. I think the outcome will be different this time though. I have a serious question, why isn't Talib suspended for some games? Plaxico shot himself and went to jail and was suspended (if I'm not mistaken he had the gun illegally). I think Talib had a permit for his gun or whatever, but wasn't he in a night club when he shot himself. I don't think you are allowed to conceal carry in a club (alcohol reasons) so wouldn't that be breaking player conduct policies or whatever? I'm just curious.

I acknowledge the outcome could very well be different.  I just don't believe a Carolina victory is a foregone conclusion.  

The Talib situation is still murky.  You have a lot of fans with a little information and that's a bad combo.  The truth is, his future is uncertain.  According to the Dallas police, they don't know who shot Talib.  They haven't ruled out self-inflicted, but they also haven't ruled out an assailant.  Talib claims he was at a park when it happened but that he was too intoxicated to remember what happened.  There were two other shooting victims at a similar time at a nightclub.  The police have been looking for evidence that he was actually at the club and not the park but so far the investigation hasn't yielded anything.  

If he was at the club and carrying a gun then it was a crime and he will almost certainly be suspended.  If he was at the park and shot himself while drunk, I'm not sure about Texas law, but I think he could be open to suspension.  If he was at the park and got shot by someone else, I don't think he would receive any discipline.  If the Dallas Police don't find anything that concludes he was at the night club or that he fired a gun, I'm not sure how the NFL could proceed with suspension.  Don't get me wrong, the whole thing is shady as hell, but there are too many questions about what actually happened, and I don't believe we'll ever know what actually happened.  As an aside, while I love Talib's play some of the time, I absolutely despise his thug behavior, most notably the eye poke last season and the disgusting facemask in the Super Bowl.  No place for that in football, and I wish I could get good Talib without his outbursts.

[top dawg]

We're going to kick their ass!

[PleaseGetReal]

15 minutes ago, Bj-Monster23 said:

What do you mean the QB position doesn't have the same importance for your team? Let's not be naive. Like I said, you guys have a very good defense, but if you're assuming because you have a good defense not having to have a good QB is not important or will not benefit you this season than you are sadly mistaken. Every team needs good QB play why? Because having a good QB wins you games in the NFL to get you to the playoffs. But having a really good defense wins you championships in the NFL. Just my opinion, but i'm not sure if Sanchez or Siemian will keep your team in contention this season. I just see them making mistakes that Peyton or Brock wouldn't make. I also think you don't see the value in what Malik Jackson and Danny Trevathan had on your team. Those two were really good players in your scheme especially Jackson getting that pressure with Wolfe on the opposite side. If anything he had just as much of an effect to help Ware and Miller.

I mean the Broncos secured HFA and went on to win the Super Bowl while leading the league in interceptions.   I don't have the stats in front of me, but their 3rd down conversion percentage was embarrassing.  Turning the ball over and not maintaining ball control forces the defense to defend short fields and to be on the field for too long.  The Broncos last season had their defense on the field more than half the time.  Despite those handicaps, they set an NFL record with 11 wins by 7 or fewer points.  I'm not assuming that having a good defense means QB isn't as important, I'm concluding that fact based on a season's worth of evidence.  Believe me, I would love to have a Cam Newton or Aaron Rodgers guiding the offense, and they will certainly lose some games because of bad offense.  It's just not necessary for their style of football, and everyone loses some games.  You can say Sanchez or Siemian will make mistakes Peyton or Brock wouldn't, but again, they don't need to be great.  They just need to not lead the league in interceptions to be an improvement. 

I definitely see value in Malik Jackson and Danny Trevathan.  I just rank 5 members of the secondary, both edge rushers, and Derek Wolfe ahead of both of them.  I don't think losing the 8th and 9th best guys on the defense is catastrophic, and I think some people are inflating their value to create the story of the Broncos defense impoding in FA, which really just didn't happen.

[The Lobo]

15 minutes ago, PleaseGetReal said:

I acknowledge the outcome could very well be different.  I just don't believe a Carolina victory is a foregone conclusion.  

The Talib situation is still murky.  You have a lot of fans with a little information and that's a bad combo.  The truth is, his future is uncertain.  According to the Dallas police, they don't know who shot Talib.  They haven't ruled out self-inflicted, but they also haven't ruled out an assailant.  Talib claims he was at a park when it happened but that he was too intoxicated to remember what happened.  There were two other shooting victims at a similar time at a nightclub.  The police have been looking for evidence that he was actually at the club and not the park but so far the investigation hasn't yielded anything.  

If he was at the club and carrying a gun then it was a crime and he will almost certainly be suspended.  If he was at the park and shot himself while drunk, I'm not sure about Texas law, but I think he could be open to suspension.  If he was at the park and got shot by someone else, I don't think he would receive any discipline.  If the Dallas Police don't find anything that concludes he was at the night club or that he fired a gun, I'm not sure how the NFL could proceed with suspension.  Don't get me wrong, the whole thing is shady as hell, but there are too many questions about what actually happened, and I don't believe we'll ever know what actually happened.  As an aside, while I love Talib's play some of the time, I absolutely despise his thug behavior, most notably the eye poke last season and the disgusting facemask in the Super Bowl.  No place for that in football, and I wish I could get good Talib without his outbursts.

Thanks for the info. I'm not calling for his head I was just curious. I think on this site, we know a thing or two about questionable situations (*cough cough* hardy). Again, good luck the 8th and good luck on here!

[PleaseGetReal]

14 minutes ago, 15 said:

I agreed with you up until you said the Bronco's were the best team we faced all season. They absolutely were not. The best defense? Yeah probably, or at least the best executed game plan. If you think the Bronco's had the best team from offense to defense to special teams, you are crazy. 

Apologies.  I spent most of the season identifying the Broncos team by the defense.  I would literally spend my time during their offensive "drives" hoping they wouldn't screw up too much.  I certainly don't think the Broncos offense was among the best.  I did think the special teams did a fantastic job in the Super Bowl of punting away from Ginn and removing Carolina punt returns as a weapon.  But no, I was specifically referring to the defense exclusively, although I recognize that my phrasing certainly didn't make that apparent.

[Moorgan]

1 hour ago, 15 said:

I agreed with you up until you said the Bronco's were the best team we faced all season. They absolutely were not. The best defense? Yeah probably, or at least the best executed game plan. If you think the Bronco's had the best team from offense to defense to special teams, you are crazy.

The NFL playoffs are a lot like March Madness. It's win or you go home, and there are major upsets like a #15 seed beating a #2 seed. Not saying the Bronco's were equivalent to a #15 seed, but the Panthers are the better all around football team and being unprepared, cocky, and having any momentum taken right out of their hands resulted in a major upset. I can guarantee you our players and coaches won't let that happen again and that's why I put some big money on the game last month when I was in Vegas.

I understand that you won the big game, you have before and I am assuming you were around to enjoy those too. You need to understand that as a franchise as young as the Panthers that have been heartbroken in their only two trips to the superbowl, revenge games like the upcoming one against Denver and previous ones like against the Seahawks and Cards - are the type of games that help us get over those heartbreaking losses on the path to finally bringing a championship to Charlotte.

While you may laugh off the double digit ass whooping the Panthers are going to lay on the Bronco's and whatever future high school color commentator you guys have playing QB, it will heal the wounds and allow us to focus on getting a superbowl of our own. 

Pie.

[Bj-Monster23]

3 hours ago, PleaseGetReal said:

I mean the Broncos secured HFA and went on to win the Super Bowl while leading the league in interceptions.   I don't have the stats in front of me, but their 3rd down conversion percentage was embarrassing.  Turning the ball over and not maintaining ball control forces the defense to defend short fields and to be on the field for too long.  The Broncos last season had their defense on the field more than half the time.  Despite those handicaps, they set an NFL record with 11 wins by 7 or fewer points.  I'm not assuming that having a good defense means QB isn't as important, I'm concluding that fact based on a season's worth of evidence.  Believe me, I would love to have a Cam Newton or Aaron Rodgers guiding the offense, and they will certainly lose some games because of bad offense.  It's just not necessary for their style of football, and everyone loses some games.  You can say Sanchez or Siemian will make mistakes Peyton or Brock wouldn't, but again, they don't need to be great.  They just need to not lead the league in interceptions to be an improvement. 

I definitely see value in Malik Jackson and Danny Trevathan.  I just rank 5 members of the secondary, both edge rushers, and Derek Wolfe ahead of both of them.  I don't think losing the 8th and 9th best guys on the defense is catastrophic, and I think some people are inflating their value to create the story of the Broncos defense impoding in FA, which really just didn't happen.

Understandable. Let's just meet back here in January and see how everything plays out. I do believe you guys will field another very good defense this season. I also know you guys have a very good run game. Best case scenario I think you guys go 10-6 and make the wildcard for the playoffs and worse case scenario I think you guys go 6-10. Nobody knows the future which is the biggest reason why they play these games. Time will tell if you guys truly have that defense to carry you back to top especially with getting everyone in the NFL best shot.

[mc52beast]

On August 17, 2016 at 0:37 PM, Ivan The Awesome said:

Yeah but will they be able to beat us without the same refs and inexperience from the panthers?

You mean in-experience like starting two rookie corners?