Is Kawann Short holding out?

[Mr. Scot]

5 hours ago, CPantherKing said:

Steve Smith, Jordan Gross per Steve Smith debacle, Brandon LaFell, Captain Munnerlyn, Josh Norman, Gary Barnidge, DeAngelo Williams, Jon Beason, and Greg Hardy.

Replaced them with Corey Brown, Nate Chandler, Kelvin Benjamin, Antoine Cason, James Bradberry, Brandon Williams, Cameron Artis Payne, AJ Klein, and Kony Ealy.

With the exception of Kelvin Benjamin, they are all dramatic downgrades and outright failures. There is no arguing that this has degraded the talent on the team with the list above. The Panthers have been carried by veterans since 2013, and every year that declines. Now, the Panthers are carried by a handful of veterans. Those veterans are among the best in the NFL and made that known last season, but how thin can Gettleman make the veteran core of the team that has been carrying the Panthers to victory before it breaks? This team could be so much better and unquestionably dominant with the talent they were set up with during the rebuild of 2011/2012. Instead, they have been held back from realizing their potential of being a dynasty and lost a few years of their window to building that dynasty. Instead they lean on fewer and fewer key players each season to carry them and make the rest of the league stronger with the talent they have developed and allowed to walk.

We just went to a Super Bowl, and probably beat the team you cheer for in the process.

This stuff is why everyone on here thinks you're a complete dumbass.

[The NFL Shield At Midfield]

26 minutes ago, Nick_81 said:

• Smitty played here for 13 fuging years.  That's not developing talent and letting them walk.  
• Your theory on Gross is nothing but pure speculation on your part, and pretty stupid, considering Kalil is his best friend, so if anyone would influence him to retire, or stay, it would be Kalil.  
• LaFell is average at best, no loss at all.  
• Munnerlyn wasn't wanted here, or they would have at least made some kind of offer.  
• Barnidge is average, no loss.  Christ, the guy had one good year at 30 years old, and six shitty ones prior...
• D-Will was here 9 years, same situation as Smitty, and both of those as examples is beyond stupid.  
• Beason?  ROFL, I can't believe you're serious.  The guy hasn't played a full season since 2010.  He was a boss for 4 years, then couldn't keep from getting injured, and we still kept him on the roster until 2013.  
• Finally, the fuging gold in this post is Greg fuging Hardy, wow.  You truly have to be off your rocker to even consider that.

All the other bullshit you're spewing is just a waste of time.  You're so fuging delusional...

he called AJ klein, a guy who filled in admirably for the best mike linebacker in the league and is probably going to be a rich man soon, a "dramatic downgrade" and/or "outright failure"

cameron artis payne, a late round rookie who is like fourth on the depth chart behind two pro bowlers/all pros in stewart and tolbert and a veteran in fozzy, is a "dramatic downgrade" and/or "outright failure".  he's also acting like he replaced williams or something which is utterly inane.  stewart replaced williams as the starter.  let's not even consider the cap implications of having kept deangelo around.

kony ealy who just put up one of the greatest super bowl performances for a defensive player ever is a "dramatic downgrade" and/or "outright failure" even though he's put up better career numbers than hardy had at that point in his career and he seems to be on the right track.  let's not even consider that hardy isn't even on a team right now.

freaking brandon lafell and captain munnerlyn lmao who is this tool kidding?  munnerlyn is one of the better nickel corners in the league and lafell is... well, we all know who he is.

we'd be cap strapped again if we had kept all these guys.  if these dummies ran the team we'd have just gotten done paying steve smith $23 million since 2014 at the end of this coming season.  so what then, are we relying on marty hurney to just murder the draft like three years in a row so that when we have a string of retirements there are new franchise cornerstones ready to step in?  that's just laughable.  from 2009-2012 he drafted like three gold nuggets surrounded by a bunch of marginal garbage.  i only bring that up because cpantherking here is one of the few posters on this board nutty enough to have actually asserted that hurney would be doing a better job than gettleman right now.

actually i disagree with your last bullet point.  i think the real gold is his assertion that the 2011/2012 rebuild left the foundation for a dynasty.  charles godfrey, james anderson, and jon beason making zillions of dollars was the foundation of a dynasty.  terrell mcclain and sione fua in the middle of our line was the foundation of a dynasty.  amini silatolu and old-ass travelle wharton with byron bell at right tackle (otah busted out for good in 2012, remember) was the foundation of a dynasty.  jordan gross being in his mid-30s was the foundation of a dynasty.

you could maybe make a case for shooting our wad trying to win a super bowl in like 2014, maybe.  but the foundation of a dynasty?  what a clown.

 

[Mr. Scot]

3 minutes ago, The NFL Shield At Midfield said:

he called AJ klein, a guy who filled in admirably for the best mike linebacker in the league and is probably going to be a rich man soon, a "dramatic downgrade" and/or "outright failure"

cameron artis payne, a late round rookie who is like fourth on the depth chart behind two pro bowlers/all pros in stewart and tolbert and a veteran in fozzy, is a "dramatic downgrade" and/or "outright failure".  he's also acting like he replaced williams or something which is utterly inane.  stewart replaced williams as the starter.  let's not even consider the cap implications of having kept deangelo around.

kony ealy who just put up one of the greatest super bowl performances for a defensive player ever is a "dramatic downgrade" and/or "outright failure" even though he's put up better career numbers than hardy had at that point in his career and he seems to be on the right track.

freaking brandon lafell and captain munnerlyn lmao who is this tool kidding?  munnerlyn is one of the better nickel corners in the league and lafell is... well, we all know who he is.

actually i disagree with your last bullet point.  i think the real gold is his assertion that the 2011/2012 rebuild left the foundation for a dynasty.  charles godfrey, james anderson, and jon beason making zillions of dollars was the foundation of a dynasty.  terrell mcclain and sione fua in the middle of our line was the foundation of a dynasty.  amini silatolu and old-ass travelle wharton with byron bell at right tackle (otah busted out for good in 2012, remember) was the foundation of a dynasty.  jordan gross being in his mid-30s was the foundation of a dynasty.

you could maybe make a case for shooting our wad trying to win a super bowl in like 2014, maybe.  but the foundation of a dynasty?  what a clown.

Yep. Guy is just as stupid as Fat Ass Alice, and probably just as big a loser in his so-called life.

[CWORS]

He's skipping OTA's but he isn't on social media screaming about feeding his family or that he wants to be the highest paid DT in the league...sound a little familiar?!?! Holding out of OTA's isn't new. I feel DG wanted to get RK locked up first, I think the KK signing will be official in the next couple of days

[Nick_81]

18 minutes ago, The NFL Shield At Midfield said:

actually i disagree with your last bullet point.  i think the real gold is his assertion that the 2011/2012 rebuild left the foundation for a dynasty.  charles godfrey, james anderson, and jon beason making zillions of dollars was the foundation of a dynasty.  terrell mcclain and sione fua in the middle of our line was the foundation of a dynasty.  amini silatolu and old-ass travelle wharton with byron bell at right tackle (otah busted out for good in 2012, remember) was the foundation of a dynasty.  jordan gross being in his mid-30s was the foundation of a dynasty.

Can't disagree with that.

[The NFL Shield At Midfield]

i mean if it makes you feel better, yeah, hurney probably would have paid lafell and munnerlyn whatever they wanted and kept beason around.  he would have never in a million years released steve smith and would have paid him the close to $10 million/per year he was going to get thanks to his 2012 restructure.  he would have never released charles johnson and let him test the market-at the absolute most he would have converted some of his salary to a signing bonus to make the final years of his deal even more cumbersome.  godfrey and james anderson would still be here collecting checks.  oh, and norman would have gotten his mega deal of course.

it'd be business as usual and your good old panthers ready to go their good old 7-9 or 8-8 would be just the way you like them.

[Malt Liquor]

David Gettleman is the reason why we are a winning franchise now, that's about to become a dynasty for years to come.

[Ricky Spanish]

KK is going to get PAID. There's no doubt about that. Gettleman is just trying to make sure he doesn't reset the market at the position like Hurney's dumbass did with Deangelo Williams. 

[Bartin]

7 hours ago, CPantherKing said:

$40 million guarantee; $13-14 million per year.

That's probably what Gettleman is offering and the "lowball" offer he rejected. Gonna take way more than that to sign him.

[Norway]

Don't know if this has been posted already, but this holdout could be the result of the drafting of Butler. Short see that his leverage is much better before Butler possibly has a great traning camp (or season). The way Short answered the questions regarding his contract in the beginning of OTAs, this seems like a bit of a surprise. From what I remember, this would also be DG first holdout to solve, and it would be interesting to see how it evolves if it drags out. I just hope that Short does not go over the edge with regard to DG, we all know what the result of that can be.

[Nick_81]

34 minutes ago, Norway said:

Don't know if this has been posted already, but this holdout could be the result of the drafting of Butler. Short see that his leverage is much better before Butler possibly has a great traning camp (or season). The way Short answered the questions regarding his contract in the beginning of OTAs, this seems like a bit of a surprise. From what I remember, this would also be DG first holdout to solve, and it would be interesting to see how it evolves if it drags out. I just hope that Short does not go over the edge with regard to DG, we all know what the result of that can be.

Gettleman will come a hell of a lot closer to what KK wants, than what Norman wanted, simply because it's a position that he values.  It's really not a big deal currently.  Only if it extends into training camp, would it be an issue.  It probably has nothing to do with Butler, but more so that KK has to look out for himself in this situation.  If he were to get hurt at any of these practices, it could have a negative effect on his contract.  It's frustrating, but nothing new at all for execs like Gettleman, and the other GM's around the league.

[Ship]

"You'd love to have everybody here, but again, this is voluntary," Rivera said.

"The thing I appreciate - for the most part, everybody has told me what's been going on - with the exception of one person."

 via black and blue review

Short's not doing himself any favors with the team and if Butler starts fast there will be a preference going forward.

[csx]

If working for an extension why not prove you are dedicated? I don't understand the advice these guys get.

[Nick_81]

13 minutes ago, csx said:

If working for an extension why not prove you are dedicated? I don't understand the advice these guys get.

If he gets hurt during this voluntary stuff, it could negatively affect his contract.  It sucks, but he still has to look out for himself.