5 Quarterbacks in 15 years...

[Happy Panther]

Buerlien 1999 8-8 26th rated defense

Delhomme 2003 11-5 10th rated Defense

Collins 1996 12-4 2nd best defense

Buelein was easily the best QB just comparing best years. Lots of TDs few INTS best passer rating. Put him in today at his peak and we are a totally different team.

Delhomme has two good seasons and has been here the longest. 3 playoff appearances too. Spoken of as a great leader

Collins had the one great year

[Cyberjag]

Dude, nobody is saying anything bad about Jake. We are all saying that we just want the coaching staff to consider drafting a QB before the 4th round or so. I don't know if Jake is your cousin or brother or uncle or what but please relax on the whole Jake thing. If he plays great this weekend then thats awesome, I think most of us are expecting that he plays pretty decent. So stop with all the Jake lovin stuff. Try another thread or something because its getting you no where on this one.

Just to get back on topic...

The problem with this whole premise is the underlying assumption that there's been someone worth a damn who we should have spent a draft pick on. I'm sure that several of you out there just know that if we had taken Kevin Kolb or someone like that we could have developed him into an all-pro, but that's not really convincing. I've looked over the missed opportunities at length, and the only QB out there that we really missed the boat on under Fox and Hurney was Aaron Rodgers. And we weren't the only one.

Over the past few years, the only quarterbacks who have been any good (meaning an improvement on Jake) have been taken early in the first. Next year that should change--the class is deep and talented. But as terrible as our draft choices past the second round were up until a couple years ago (thank you Don Gregory!), getting a bunch of disappointing projects who couldn't stick would be just as disappointing in it's own way as drafting Eric Shelton was.

So look at the draft picks, and then look at our team again, in the context of when we were drafting and what we needed. In 2004 Jake was the king, he brought us to the Super Bowl, and the secondary needed more talent. In 2005 he put up great numbers, the problem was running back and linebackers. In 2006 he was coming off the pro bowl but running back was a dire need. In 2007 we needed depth at Quarterback (Weinke showed us that late in 2006) and Linebacker, so we went out and got David Carr (yeah I know, but hindsight is always 20/20 and even Zod predicted he would eventually beat out Jake). In 2008 Jake was coming back from injury, but the FA class was poor and we had more pressing needs on the line. And in this past year who should we have taken instead of Brown--particularly given our anemic pass rush?

I honestly think that given the nature of next years' class we'll take a quarterback early. At this point everyone knows that even if Jake has anything left it won't be for much longer, and we need to develop his replacement. Fox certainly isn't the type of coach who wants to start a rookie, which means that we better get the next guy in soon. This is the first time under Fox and Hurney that we've been in this situation, and they'll respond by doing the unexpected--drafting the position the fans want.

[CatMan72]

Interesting post, anyone ever hear the story of how close we were to getting Peyton Manning? Apparently we were a fax away... then the Colts changed their mind and dedicded not to trade the pick that Polian says we would have used on Manning.

[Sam Mills Fan]

the best qb who never did anythng was .but he is no jake.he hasn't played in a superbowl,he doesn't have the best postseason yard per play as a qb..he also has never beenranked 10th in qb rankings in wins losses in same time frame as his qb peers

I hope you're not trying to slam Steve Beuerlein here. The reason we never made it to the postseason in his two full years as a starter here was NOT because of him. It was because we had a bottom 5 defense and absolutely no running game in 1999 and 2000.

If we had had the Steve Beuerlein of 1999 or 2000 on the team last year, then we would have a Lombardi Trophy sitting in Bank of America Stadium right now.

[Sam Mills Fan]

Steve owns Jake in every important passing category. Steve also never had the weapons (including the '03, '05, and '08 (for the most part) defense and '03, '05 (for the most part), and '08 o-line) like Jake has had. Jake had the best offense around him in his career last season and he still managed to have the highest number of bad games he's ever had. Steve had to deal with a bad o-line, RBs that couldnt stay healthy, and a average at best defense his whole time here. He's never had a top 5 receiver or RB ever.

INT/TD Ratio

Beuerlein: 1.72

Delhomme: Excluding 07: 1.5

Completion Percentage

Beuerlein: 59.6

Delhomme: Excluding 07: 59.6

QB Rating

Beuerlein: 87.9

Delhomme: Excluding 07: 84.7

Games Played

Beuerlein: 51

Delhomme: Excluding 07: 76

The Completion Percentage is the same, but Steve did this all in 25 less games.

If you want these states where the games played is closer, this is what I did in 2007...

INT/TD Ratio

Beuerlein: 1.72

Delhomme: Before '07: 1.53

Completion Percentage

Beuerlein: 59.6

Delhomme: Before '07: 59.5

QB Rating

Beuerlein: 87.9

Delhomme: Before '07: 84.65

Games Played

Beuerlein: 51

Delhomme: Before '07: 61

Steve still is better.

I don't disagree that Beuerlein was better, but let's not forget that he got to play with Moose when he was in his beastly form in 1999. If memory serves me correctly, he was the best receiver in the NFL that year.

[Sam Mills Fan]

Beuerlein was one tough sumbitch. He'd get the crap knocked out of him, get up and complete another pass.

He didn't have a lot of help, but he did have Wesley Walls. He could play some tight end.

Oh yeah, forgot about Wesley Walls. So, at least in the passing game, Beuerlein was blessed with weapons even better than what Delhomme has had of late. When you compare Moose/Jeffers/Ismail(I think Rocket was still on the team at least in 1999)/Walls to #89/Old Moose/Jarrett or Moore/King or Barnidge or Rosario or whoever our tight end is, you can see that Beuerlein's weapons had the edge even with Jake getting to play with the most explosive player we've ever had here.

But....Beuerlein's offensive line was trash, his running game was trash, the defense he had to work with was trash. Jake has had at least a good offensive line every year, strong running backs, and a mostly great defense year in and year out.

[Sam Mills Fan]

Interesting post, anyone ever hear the story of how close we were to getting Peyton Manning? Apparently we were a fax away... then the Colts changed their mind and dedicded not to trade the pick that Polian says we would have used on Manning.

I find that very hard to believe. Manning was drafted #1 overall in 1998. Collins was only three years into his career and was still on his rookie contract and the 1998 meltdown hadn't happened yet. While it would have been awesome if that had happened, it wouldn't have made any sense to do so.

[cptx]

I find that very hard to believe. Manning was drafted #1 overall in 1998. Collins was only three years into his career and was still on his rookie contract and the 1998 meltdown hadn't happened yet. While it would have been awesome if that had happened, it wouldn't have made any sense to do so.

i remember reading about it in the newspaper, so there is at least some truth to it.

[Sandy Claws]

Check out these Beuerlein stats:

Steve Beuerlein of 1999 and 2000...now THAT was a quarterback.

Correction

That was a QB in a West Coast Offense.

[Sam Mills Fan]

Take a look at QBs around the league in WCOs. They don't put up the kind of numbers that Beuerlein put up.

[ammofan]

Take a look at QBs around the league in WCOs. They don't put up the kind of numbers that Beuerlein put up.

very true sir! steve was a beast.....btw I saw him at qdoba with his parents not 2 long ago haha!

[Cyberjag]

I find that very hard to believe. Manning was drafted #1 overall in 1998. Collins was only three years into his career and was still on his rookie contract and the 1998 meltdown hadn't happened yet. While it would have been awesome if that had happened, it wouldn't have made any sense to do so.

It's true. At the time there was even a question about whether Ryan Leaf or Peyton Manning should be taken number one. Manning was only able to win one "Big Game" in his college career, and was injured late as a senior. Polian wanted to be the President and GM of the Panthers, as McCormick was retiring (you know that statue outside?). Richardson gave the President title to his son Mark, which sent Polian on a job search. So instead of engineering the trade with the Colts, Polian went to work for them as their president and GM.

Capers was given Coach and GM responsibilities and failed miserably at the latter, which led to his ouster in the former. If you want to play what-if, the best one IMHO is that we gave Polian what he wanted, got Manning, and kept Capers and his defense.

[Sandy Claws]

Take a look at QBs around the league in WCOs. They don't put up the kind of numbers that Beuerlein put up.

Take a look at what Beuerlein was able to do when he wasn't in a WCO. His numbers weren't close to those while in a WCO. No need to try to compare him to other QBs.

[Cyberjag]

This whole Beuerlein vs. Delhomme argument is silly. Statistically, BOTH of them are better than Troy Aikman.

Define what makes one QB better than another and then you can maybe present an argument. As far as I'm concerned, we win a lot more with Jake under center than we did with Beuerlein, and that's the only stat anyone really cares about.