RIP Will Smith (former saints DE)

[thefuzz]

2 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

Yep, but the basic story hasn't really changed. Even if all the other stuff were completely true, it wouldn't change the fact that the guy's guilty of murder.

Florio (who was an attorney at one time) points out that if the hit and run thing is valid, it adds premeditation to the mix and bumps up the charge to first degree murder.

 

See my post below.  IF Smith did indeed threaten him, it may be a self defense case, a murder 1 or 2 case, or a manslaughter case.

 

I see this getting very strange before it's all said and done.

[Mr. Scot]

4 minutes ago, thefuzz said:

See my post below.  IF Smith did indeed threaten him, it may be a self defense case, a murder 1 or 2 case, or a manslaughter case.

I see this getting very strange before it's all said and done.

I seriously doubt a jury is going to buy the self-defense angle.

My first question would be "Why didn't you just pull out the gun and threaten him or tell him to leave you alone?" Especially given that even if Smith said he had a gun, there's no evidence that he actually produced one.

It would be pretty bad precedent if someone just suggesting that they might have a gun could be used as justification to shoot them dead.

Agree with you it's gonna get strange, though.

[chknwing]

24 minutes ago, thefuzz said:

See my post below.  IF Smith did indeed threaten him, it may be a self defense case, a murder 1 or 2 case, or a manslaughter case.

 

I see this getting very strange before it's all said and done.

since the guy tailed him from a previous hit and run incident, they could try and make it premeditated murder.

[thefuzz]

13 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

I seriously doubt a jury is going to buy the self-defense angle.

My first question would be "Why didn't you just pull out the gun and threaten him or tell him to leave you alone?" Especially given that even if Smith said he had a gun, there's no evidence that he actually produced one.

It would be pretty bad precedent if someone just suggesting that they might have a gun could be used as justification to shoot them dead.

Agree with you it's gonna get strange, though.

If they can put reasonable doubt into the jurors minds that it wasn't premeditated, and that he truly was scared for his life, murder 1 most likely won't stick, not saying he's innocent, but that's not the same as guilty in the courts.

I would assume that he will either stick with murder 2 or manslaughter and plea down the time.

[Mr. Scot]

Just now, thefuzz said:

If they can put reasonable doubt into the jurors minds that it wasn't premeditated, and that he truly was scared for his life, murder 1 most likely won't stick, not saying he's innocent, but that's not the same as guilty in the courts.

I would assume that he will either stick with murder 2 or manslaughter and plea down the time.

Depends.  Will Smith was a well loved figure.  That changes the dynamic on everything.

[NcPsa10]

39 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

I seriously doubt a jury is going to buy the self-defense angle.

My first question would be "Why didn't you just pull out the gun and threaten him or tell him to leave you alone?" Especially given that even if Smith said he had a gun, there's no evidence that he actually produced one.

It would be pretty bad precedent if someone just suggesting that they might have a gun could be used as justification to shoot them dead.

If you sense something is true by instinct, but not necessarily by fact, you can describe that sense as perceived. and if Mr,Smith indeed said he had a gun that in its self is a  perceived threat .

That means even if he Mr.Smith had no gun Mr.Hayes   does not have an obligation "to retreat" if faced with a real or perceived threat and "may stand his or her ground and meet force with force."

Its not that hard to understand I don't think , I for one if someone is coming at me to cause me harm and tells me he has a gun ,, umm yea well I'm not going to wait around and give someone a chance to make good on that threat ... gun seen or not , 

[thefuzz]

2 minutes ago, chknwing said:

since the guy tailed him from a previous hit and run incident, they could try and make it premeditated murder.

That would mean murder 1, and that's going to be awfully hard to prove.  Especially since he called 911, stayed at the scene, secured a witness, and turned over the murder weapon.

[Mr. Scot]

Just now, NcPsa10 said:

If you sense something is true by instinct, but not necessarily by fact, you can describe that sense as perceived. and if Mr,Smith indeed said he had a gun that in its self is a  perceived threat .

That means even if he Mr.Smith had no gun Mr.Hayes   does not have an obligation "to retreat" if faced with a real or perceived threat and "may stand his or her ground and meet force with force."

Its not that hard to understand I don't think , I for one if someone is coming at me to cause me harm and tells me he has a gun ,, umm yea well I'm not going to wait around and give someone a chance to make good on that threat ... gun seen or not , 

I get the nature of the argument.  I just don't see a jury buying it.

[thefuzz]

1 minute ago, Mr. Scot said:

Depends.  Will Smith was a well loved figure.  That changes the dynamic on everything.

Agree, but the toxicology report will mean something, and the stand your ground laws may be in Hayes' favor here.

I think at the end of the day murder 1 will be almost impossible.

He will get charged with a myriad of crimes, some of which he will be convicted of, but I don't think murder 1 will be one of them.

[The NFL Shield At Midfield]

well, um, chris999, uh yeah man about what happened a few days ago...

[Mr. Scot]

7 hours ago, hihosilver said:

If you pull out a gun, after someone else say they have a gun the purpose of pulling your gun on them is not just to scare them. Never pull a gun unless you are ready to use it. 

Still a preferred outcome to someone dying.

[Mr. Scot]

It's about to get nuts...

Loaded gun found inside Will Smith's vehicle

[SmokinwithWilly]

Guess he had a reason to feel threatened. Whether or not he had any reason to shoot him will come down to timing. It's going to be interesting that's for damn sure.

[NcPsa10]

Mr,Smith saying he had a gun and then a gun indeed was found  yea ,, And that my Friend is why his wife was shot as well , You tell a person you have a gun and you start walking/running back to you Suv/car  where that  gun could be . Yes you have the right to Stop any and ALL  aggressors at that time ... Still a lot will come out in this case I'm sure .