Extensions This Offseason?

[t96]

Who do you think we should/will extend this off season?

 

Most obvious choice is KK and I'm pretty damn sure this will happen before the season starts. Probably after the draft though.

Oher, Ginn and Coleman all got 2 year deals last off season and outplayed their contracts and look like the could stay here for a few more years at least so they are candidates for extension in my opinion.

Norwell and Philly will both be in the last year of their deals but will be restricted free agents so neither are very urgent, but I think we should and will extend both this offseason. Norwell and Turner are the future and I definitely believe Philly is in our long term plans at receiver. He likely won't be competing as a starter going forward but will always be great depth and possibly even more.

Star, Addison and Klein will all be UFAs after next year and should all be kept if possible, however that may not be. Star isn't as big of a priority as KK since we have his 5th year option which we will probably exercise this offseason. I believe he should be extended but we have time. A crucial piece to our d-line that struggled last year (mainly on the ends, but our DT depth is nonexistent right now with Love not re-signed yet). I think we should extend Addison as well. He's been a great pass rush specialist and part of the rotation. Think we can afford him. Klein is about as good a player behind Luke as a team could wish for but I think it's very possible he's looking to be a starter and to be paid like one, neither of which can happen here. Doubt we end up keeping him because of those reasons and could see him being a trade piece.

Obviously Josh is on the franchise tag (albeit not signed yet) and, from all reports, is unlikely to get an extension unless one side budges--also unlikely. It would be great to extend him but doubt it happens which is fine as well. Still only has a year and a half of starter experience (not counting rookie year forced into starting role and played poorly) and we may see what we can do at CB in the draft to see if we could possibly replace him if we don't want to pay what he wants. As a huge fan of his (and podcast listener) I want him back as much as anyone, but looking at it from DG's perspective, it may be better to let him walk after this year and continue to build through the draft and key free agent finds instead of paying him $14M+/year.

Remmers, if not signed away by another team for a 2nd round pick, will be a UFA after next year. Possible we negotiate a two year deal with him to have him locked up in case Williams can't replace him or we don't have other options. Not crucial now, but would be a good move in my opinion.

Colin Jones will be a UFA after this year. Had a smaller role on defense last season but was still a core special teamer and I think we'll extend him.

 

Of these options here's what I think will happen (to summarize):

Extend KK, Oher, Coleman, Norwell, Philly, Addison, and Colin Jones. Let Josh play out the tag and exercise Star's 5th year option. Could see Ginn and/or Remmers being extended but don't consider it super likely. Don't think Klein will be due to his probably starting desire, and LUKE.

[Riverboat Ron]

Extensions look trashy.

[CarolinaNCSU]

KK is priority number 1 to me for obvious reasons. Would then like to see a long-term deal for Josh, but not at the money he thinks he's worth.

Guys like Ginn, Oher, and Coleman, prove it again this year. Ginn is who he is and any extension for him would surely only be for a couple of years. I'd like to upgrade Oher, but that's easier said than done. For Coleman, nobody can expect the same number of INTs IMO and he'll likely regress towards the mean. Without him picking the ball off so much, will we still like the guy enough to give him a Mike Mitchell type contract? Doubtful. 

[Bartin]

KK without a doubt. Lock him in now before the market goes even higher. Cam and Luke are relative bargains right now compared to what we might have had to pay this year.

I'd give Kalil another 2-3 years. Lower his 2016 hit a bit and keep him here for his career.

Oher and Coleman I'd start talking to find out what they'd ask for and go from there.

Ginn I would wait on. He will be 31 at the end of his deal and we've got some good young WRs. No one is going to give him big money so we don't risk much at all by letting his deal expire. We can sign him back for pretty cheap if we want.

Klein you have to let go after 2016. Mayo takes his spot and we take the comp pick. Can't keep everyone and he deserves a shot at starting somewhere.

Assuming they like Williams as much as we think they do then you let Remmers go after 2016. Someone will pay him handsomely. Average OTs get paid in FA.

Colin Jones is whatever. Replacement level player and Marlowe may get his roster spot this year.

I'm torn on Josh. If we don't get a deal done this year then I guess tag again if he balls out or let go if he regresses.

[Ship]

I think Ginn, Coleman, and Oher all get a back up this year in the draft as insurance/to take over. if Coleman has another Pro Bowl worthy year I see us giving him a solid extension, same with Ginn if he fits well with Benji and Funch then he gets a couple more years. Finally, with Oher I imagine we're hoping to move on with a rookie we draft this year and he is the one who may not get a bigger deal if he stays solid at LT for us, mainly because if he revitalizes his career here I can see his market being pricey and we may not be interested in that (though he may be willing to stay for less).

 

KK should get extended for sure. I think Addison will be kept with a slight veteran price increase on his current deal unless guys like Miley, Cox, Webster, or Delaire show up big this year and we can replace him for cheap. Klein seems very likely to be a trade piece if he wants to start, because I just don't think it would happen here as soon as he wants and definitely not at the Mike, can't tell when we would trade him though-- maybe in the draft or maybe during the season. I don't imagine we do anything with Star this offseason.

 

I think we tender Philly and Norwell next year. Norwell could get a 1st round tender and is the one most likely to get a real deal. I can see Philly wanting to remain a starter and us not agreeing and not wanting to pay him starter money, forcing him to look elsewhere. I think we put him at like a 3rd round tender and see if we can get a pick, if not we just keep him and maybe he comes around on a 2-3 year deal.

 

I really don't see Josh budging on a deal with us right now. Maybe next offseason if he has a lesser season or something makes him more willing to deal. However, after CJ coming back, I'm not sure, maybe we get it done with Josh or he drops his price. Colin Jones seems easy enough to keep on a ST player deal for another year or two. I think if Remmers gets replaced by Williams this year he leaves for another team he can start on. Someone will pay him as a starter, if not I think we give him a chance to come back as our back-up or maybe he pans out as our future center, but I think he's gonna want to start and thinks that he has proven it, which he kinda has.

[bigdog10]

I think the team has a ton of leverage with Ginn since this is essentially the only place where he has actually looked like a competent receiver and the fact that he has come out and said he just chased a check to Arizona. 

 

I would imagine you could extend him with a very team friendly deal, however, I'd wait until next offseason to do it. 

[t96]

1 hour ago, Bartin said:

I'd give Kalil another 2-3 years. Lower his 2016 hit a bit and keep him here for his career.

2016 is a big cap hit, but one we can handle easily. '17 and '18 are voidable by the team and are both extremely low cap hits so no way we void him and he'll be under contract for those two years on a steal.

[Bartin]

12 hours ago, thomas96 said:

2016 is a big cap hit, but one we can handle easily. '17 and '18 are voidable by the team and are both extremely low cap hits so no way we void him and he'll be under contract for those two years on a steal.

Not how that works. Those two years automatically void. Voidable or "dummy" years are just a mechanism for further spreading out signing bonus/restructure proration that Gettleman used to create as much cap room as possible while we were in cap jail and then take the cap hit later when we have room to do so. Stewart has them as well and it's what happened with Harper and Cotchery.

 

[Bartin]

Here's a good explanation of how voidable years work.

http://overthecap.com/explaining-free-agent-and-contract-terms/

 

 

Quote

 

Voidable Contracts

Teams sometimes use void years in a contract for the purpose of salary cap relief. Generally a team want’s to sign a player for a two or three year period but does not have the cap space to execute the contract. Because the NFL allows you to prorate up to five years, teams add “dummy” years to a contract so they can prorate the bonus over a long term. You don’t have to do anything to earn the void. All you have to do is still be on the roster, generally 5 days after the Super Bowl, to have the remaining years of the contract terminate.

Once the contract voids any future prorated money from those dummy years accelerates onto the 2016 salary cap. The player becomes a UFA and just like any other player will have to wait until March 9 to sign with a new team. Usually if a contract voids the player does not sign a new contract with his old team (a team would not allow that future money to accelerate if they really wanted to keep him) but every now and then they do. This was the case with Doug Free and the Cowboys.

As an example of how the void works the 49ers signed wide receiver Anquan Boldin two years ago to a two year, $12 million contract that included a $4.5 million signing bonus. Had this been a normal two year contract Boldin’s 2014 and 2015 cap charge would have been $3.7 and $8.3 million respectively.  That was too high for the 49ers so they include three dummy years to prorate that bonus money over 5 rather than 2 years. The new cap hits were a more affordable $2.4 and $6.9 million.

If not extended before February 12 at 4PM, those dummy years from Boldin’s contract will all vanish and the 49ers will take a $2.72 million cap charge in 2016 for Boldin. Boldin will then be a UFA. The 49ers basically deferred cap charges to the 2016 league year in this contract and they likely knew the day they signed it that there was a very high probability of carrying the $2.7 million in dead money for Boldin.

 

 

[Khyber53]

14 hours ago, thomas96 said:

Who do you think we should/will extend this off season?

...

Of these options here's what I think will happen (to summarize):

Extend KK, Oher, Coleman, Norwell, Philly, Addison, and Colin Jones. Let Josh play out the tag and exercise Star's 5th year option. Could see Ginn and/or Remmers being extended but don't consider it super likely. Don't think Klein will be due to his probably starting desire, and LUKE.

I like your reasoning, can't disagree with you. I do think that KK and Star are equally important and I think Gettleman will work this year to extend both guys and lock down the core of the DL. Those two work so well together that I'd worry that neither would be as good paired up with someone else.

Addison needs to be extended as well. He's been a high motor player and his never-give-up attitude in the Superb Owl is something coaches would kill for. 

Klein, I hate to say it is going to go and I really wish him the best. Had he been on almost any other team in the league, he'd be the starting MLB and a star. He's going to get some serious money from a team that knows how to evaluate talent. I'd expect to see him in New York (either team) or with the Bears. Smart guy, great player, just in the shadow of a future Hall of Famer. 

Norman's franchise tag year is probably money well spent. And a one year commitment is probably a good idea, too. If he performs as well, then we got what we paid for and he will go to some team that will vastly overpay for him. If he doesn't keep up the high level of play, then we're not on the hook for a big money contract and we might get him to stay for a more team friendly amount. 

 

[shaqattaq]

16 hours ago, bigdog10 said:

I think the team has a ton of leverage with Ginn since this is essentially the only place where he has actually looked like a competent receiver and the fact that he has come out and said he just chased a check to Arizona. 

 

I would imagine you could extend him with a very team friendly deal, however, I'd wait until next offseason to do it. 

Agreed, we don't want to talk extension with him coming of a season being our #1 receiver. I expect him in much more of a situational role in 2016. I really like Ginn, but he's only a mediocre receiver, and turning 30 this year. 

[t96]

6 hours ago, Bartin said:

Not how that works. Those two years automatically void. Voidable or "dummy" years are just a mechanism for further spreading out signing bonus/restructure proration that Gettleman used to create as much cap room as possible while we were in cap jail and then take the cap hit later when we have room to do so. Stewart has them as well and it's what happened with Harper and Cotchery.

 

Right, I got mixed up. There are contracts with voidable years that don't automatically void but Kalil's will. So yes I think an extension for him is possible as well, however I could also see us looking at C in the draft or even putting Remmers there and going with Williams at RT.

[t96]

4 hours ago, shaqattaq said:

Agreed, we don't want to talk extension with him coming of a season being our #1 receiver. I expect him in much more of a situational role in 2016. I really like Ginn, but he's only a mediocre receiver, and turning 30 this year. 

He's provided stability in our return game and is really our best home-run threat on offense and was crucial to what we did last year. Even with KB back and him in a situational role, he'll still be crucial to our offense's success. Cost is of course a factor, but he really didn't have such a huge year considering he was forced into the starting role and hasn't had success elsewhere. Don't think it'd cost any more now than it would after next year and unless we can get his replacement in the return game in the draft I think we'll still need him after next year.

[KB_fan]

1 minute ago, thebigcat said:

KK and Trai Turner are absolute necessity along with Norwell

Turner was drafted in 2014.  Not up for extension yet this season.