designing and building your own house

[PhillyB]

4 minutes ago, ARSEN said:

Philly is also a bartender which will not fly well with mortgage companies.  Hope Philly got some cash saved up cause it will be impossible to get a $800k loan on anything less than $150k a year income.

by the time i go to apply for the loan i'll have the entire loan value matched in assets, which can be liquidized at any point. i'll be professoring at a college by then (knock on wood) and my wife will be a practicing NP. i'm not as much worried about getting the loan itself as i am about a bank being willing to bankroll an unorthodox, effectively half-completed project. i don't know if it works that way.

[Ja Rhule]

46 minutes ago, PhillyB said:

by the time i go to apply for the loan i'll have the entire loan value matched in assets, which can be liquidized at any point. i'll be professoring at a college by then (knock on wood) and my wife will be a practicing NP. i'm not as much worried about getting the loan itself as i am about a bank being willing to bankroll an unorthodox, effectively half-completed project. i don't know if it works that way.

Banks will give you money if their risk is low.  

[thefuzz]

44 minutes ago, PhillyB said:

by the time i go to apply for the loan i'll have the entire loan value matched in assets, which can be liquidized at any point. i'll be professoring at a college by then (knock on wood) and my wife will be a practicing NP. i'm not as much worried about getting the loan itself as i am about a bank being willing to bankroll an unorthodox, effectively half-completed project. i don't know if it works that way.

That is going to be your issue.  On a C/P you will have to finish the house completely before they will allow final "draw".

Typically, you are going to need 2 full years at the new job before they will allow you to borrow that much money.  In addition, if you pull funds out of your rental properties via HELOC you are going to need to factor that in with your DTI on the new stuff.

What you are attempting is going to be a fun, hard, long process, and honestly, not one that I would want to tackle.  I'm in no way trying to talk you out of doing it, but there are so many hurdles along the way, that most give up, even after dumping tons of money into the project.

[Jase]

You actually get an economy of scale when designing a large house versus a small one.

I'll echo the sentiment of hiring a contractor and an architect concurrently. Architects are pie-in-the-sky creatures, wanting to make all of the client's dreams come true. You need a contractor to rein the architect in, as early in the process as possible. He can offer less costly alternatives that in many cases will benefit you as the owner.

[PhillyB]

54 minutes ago, Jase said:

You actually get an economy of scale when designing a large house versus a small one.

what do you mean by this

[thefuzz]

11 minutes ago, PhillyB said:

what do you mean by this

Price per square foot drops with size increases.

 

[PhillyB]

Just now, thefuzz said:

Price per square foot drops with size increases.

 

oh right. yeah that's an advantage, especially with how much of it'll be open space (half of it's just residential with no-frills bedrooms and a few bathrooms.) 

[Bronn]

I have to say, and I sincerely hope that I don't come off as an ass or judgmental when I say it, but I never pictured you shooting for 5k of living space for you and your family, much less 7-10k total space, despite my knowledge of your past musings about the commune idea.

If anything, and we are a family of 4 in a newer house that is @2,400 sq ft. that we own outright, I long for something WAY smaller.

If it were me, and this is exactly that (me giving advice to you as well as my future self), I would immediately reconsider your position on living space requirements moving forward.

Spend that extra money on more land. Instead of one huge, massive compound, focus on smaller, more intimate independent "pod" structures, or areas in which you can isolate yourself when you need "you" time or in which the fam can be closer together in together time. Each of these would give you the ability to add on later if you saw the need arise, and give you the flexibility to customize it as you go.

It just seems like you're setting yourself up for everyone to be potentially thousands of square feet apart at a given moment, or have thousands of unused square feet at at any given moment, and I just don't think that either one of those sounds like home.

Not only that, from a philosophical/quasi-new age standpoint, but think about the operational costs of such an undertaking.

It also sounds like a hell of a lot of stress on you and your family.

If you decide to continue down this path, and I don't know anything about your personal finances, family, or anything other than what you've offered up over the years, I STRONGLY suggest you do it in some way that wouldn't financially burden your beneficiaries, should anything happen to you. I know that sounds doom and gloom as hell, but I have to be a realist, man.

I will be honest with you right now... I am kind of legitimately bummed out after reading this thread, and I hope I am misunderstanding something.
 

 

[Bronn]

Whatever path you choose from here, I would throw in these ideas...

On your foundation (thank you for saying you don't want a slab!), I would look at property and sites that had a little bit of a slope and either do a partial basement foundation or a typical crawlspace with the access on the low side of the slope. Our home, I can stand underneath the foundation in the back, and it has come in quite handy when I've done retro detail projects (such as running various jacks, setting up in-wall surround sound, etc.) and maintenance on things like our main floor HVAC unit and water heater.

On structures themselves. Don't get fancy on the shapes. Yeah, it'll look unique and neat as hell to have angled walls and intrusions and protrusions, but all that is superficial. Be as square and rectangular as possible. If you can do the whole structure in a big rectangle footprint, do it. It'll save you money on design, materials, and maintenance, and it will save you time and headaches in future renovations.

Land is the important space. You can turn outside space into inside space, food space, play space, etc. in the future. Get an adequate roof over your head first, and then worry about the rest.

Go as green as possible to begin with. I think I have told you this in past threads. Be as off the grid as possible.

Home is where the heart is, but I know you like to travel too. Use the extra money you save from being smart throughout the process to put towards your travel budget and the family's future resources.

[Anybodyhome]

I found this place in Pakistan you can use as a starting point.... Belonged to some guy named Osama or something like that.

[Doyle]

I have to agree with Bronn here.  I wouldn't push all my chips in on something like this.  A property this size is a full time job in itself in upkeep alone.  Someone once told me to never be house rich but cash poor. 

[PhillyB]

42 minutes ago, Bronn said:

I have to say, and I sincerely hope that I don't come off as an ass or judgmental when I say it, but I never pictured you shooting for 5k of living space for you and your family, much less 7-10k total space, despite my knowledge of your past musings about the commune idea.

If anything, and we are a family of 4 in a newer house that is @2,400 sq ft. that we own outright, I long for something WAY smaller.

If it were me, and this is exactly that (me giving advice to you as well as my future self), I would immediately reconsider your position on living space requirements moving forward.

Spend that extra money on more land. Instead of one huge, massive compound, focus on smaller, more intimate independent "pod" structures, or areas in which you can isolate yourself when you need "you" time or in which the fam can be closer together in together time. Each of these would give you the ability to add on later if you saw the need arise, and give you the flexibility to customize it as you go.

It just seems like you're setting yourself up for everyone to be potentially thousands of square feet apart at a given moment, or have thousands of unused square feet at at any given moment, and I just don't think that either one of those sounds like home.

Not only that, from a philosophical/quasi-new age standpoint, but think about the operational costs of such an undertaking.

It also sounds like a hell of a lot of stress on you and your family.

If you decide to continue down this path, and I don't know anything about your personal finances, family, or anything other than what you've offered up over the years, I STRONGLY suggest you do it in some way that wouldn't financially burden your beneficiaries, should anything happen to you. I know that sounds doom and gloom as hell, but I have to be a realist, man.

I will be honest with you right now... I am kind of legitimately bummed out after reading this thread, and I hope I am misunderstanding something.
 

 

this house is meant to be the central structure of a multifunctional property. before building it i will purchase a piece of land and develop a section of it experimentally, with 5-8 small cabin-style houses, or A-frames, which we'll move into immediately as i begin developing the rest of the property. at that point we'll be able to also begin inviting people onto the property to stay for free if they like; i've got a couple people in mind who've been on board with this thing the whole way, as well as, we're hoping, political refugees so we can contribute to a solution.

the large house has a very specific purpose. i've been deeply inspired by experiences at a boys' home in cambodia where young orphans were drawn off the street and then housed, clothed, given an education, etc. and by the time they hit their 20s they're all quadrilingual, high school honors students, studying at universities overseas, and generally emerging as social leaders in an area that desperately needs them. this has been a fundamental cog of the commune idea from the very start: build a network and start bringing in young kids who are probably destined for a life of dragging down society, and not only subtract from that problem but contribute to the solution by molding highly-educated, motivated, creative, intelligent, empathetic young men and women who will then turn around and add to the solution.

much of my conceptual inspiration has come from reading about mary leakey's kickass upbringing of her children in the paleoarchaeological fields in remote tanzania. for a long time i have dreamed about developing a structure that can basically function as a massive extracurricular facility filled with every manner of educational/creative outlet, and the model of the house includes, among other things, an observatory, libraries, an art studio, a music room, computer room, photography studio, art gallery, miniature museum in the antiquarian tradition, martial arts studio, gymnasium, rough sports facilities, and a number of experimental interactive learning elements to be incorporated through various spaces of the house. it's a large house, yes, but it's a house without luxury. it's functional and nothing more. the master bedroom will be about the size of the one i've got now. no fancy anything (though i admit i'm going from broke on the library/salon, which is for inspiration more than anything, and still uses the space quite well.)

in short, it's a multipurpose property meant to empower, enrich, and employ the lives of a burgeoning number of other people and serve as an economic and educational platform from which aspiring contributors to society can realize their dreams and collaborate to fix this fuged up world.

[Bronn]

2 minutes ago, PhillyB said:

this house is meant to be the central structure of a multifunctional property. before building it i will purchase a piece of land and develop a section of it experimentally, with 5-8 small cabin-style houses, or A-frames, which we'll move into immediately as i begin developing the rest of the property. at that point we'll be able to also begin inviting people onto the property to stay for free if they like; i've got a couple people in mind who've been on board with this thing the whole way, as well as, we're hoping, political refugees so we can contribute to a solution.

the large house has a very specific purpose. i've been deeply inspired by experiences at a boys' home in cambodia where young orphans were drawn off the street and then housed, clothed, given an education, etc. and by the time they hit their 20s they're all quadrilingual, high school honors students, studying at universities overseas, and generally emerging as social leaders in an area that desperately needs them. this has been a fundamental cog of the commune idea from the very start: build a network and start bringing in young kids who are probably destined for a life of dragging down society, and not only subtract from that problem but contribute to the solution by molding highly-educated, motivated, creative, intelligent, empathetic young men and women who will then turn around and add to the solution.

much of my conceptual inspiration has come from reading about mary leakey's kickass upbringing of her children in the paleoarchaeological fields in remote tanzania. for a long time i have dreamed about developing a structure that can basically function as a massive extracurricular facility filled with every manner of educational/creative outlet, and the model of the house includes, among other things, an observatory, libraries, an art studio, a music room, computer room, photography studio, art gallery, miniature museum in the antiquarian tradition, martial arts studio, gymnasium, rough sports facilities, and a number of experimental interactive learning elements to be incorporated through various spaces of the house. it's a large house, yes, but it's a house without luxury. it's functional and nothing more. the master bedroom will be about the size of the one i've got now. no fancy anything (though i admit i'm going from broke on the library/salon, which is for inspiration more than anything, and still uses the space quite well.)

in short, it's a multipurpose property meant to empower, enrich, and employ the lives of a burgeoning number of other people and serve as an economic and educational platform from which aspiring contributors to society can realize their dreams and collaborate to fix this fuged up world.

This makes me feel better, actually.

I would now offer that you might want to put together a marketing strategy for this and seek out grants, donations, and other sources of funding as an educational institution that just happens to have on-site accommodations. It wouldn't be much different from a typical church parsonage concept, as much as that makes me cringe, other than you're not peddling religion to earn your room and board.

It is definitely sounding like a full time job for you, so I hope you are planning for that as well.

I would absolutely line everything up to seek out independent funds instead of bank loans for as much as you can.

Good on you, bro. It sounds like you are planning well at this point. I would still keep the footprint as ecologically and tangibly small as possible, while incorporating all the avenues of ideological and personal advancement you want to include.

[PhillyB]

10 minutes ago, Bronn said:

This makes me feel better, actually.

I would now offer that you might want to put together a marketing strategy for this and seek out grants, donations, and other sources of funding as an educational institution that just happens to have on-site accommodations. It wouldn't be much different from a typical church parsonage concept, as much as that makes me cringe, other than you're not peddling religion to earn your room and board.

It is definitely sounding like a full time job for you, so I hope you are planning for that as well.

I would absolutely line everything up to seek out independent funds instead of bank loans for as much as you can.

Good on you, bro. It sounds like you are planning well at this point. I would still keep the footprint as ecologically and tangibly small as possible, while incorporating all the avenues of ideological and personal advancement you want to include.

actually it's funny you bring the church thing up. as i began a gradual pull away from organized religion and then a sudden, bandaid-style ripping away from the church as a whole, i began pondering how on earth to recreate the amazing, wonderful things inspired by church communities without the things that make church ...well, church. how do you get a massive community of people in one place, with some sort of consensus-defined mission, and using that as your pole around which to gather and also have a constant, tight-knit social and economic group that's in continual communion with one another?

for secularists it's bars, panthers games, maybe country clubs if you're rich, frats if you're in college, etc. but trying to sustain that is incredibly difficult and if you look at the state of modern suburban america it's socially disaffected, disconnected, and disparately scattered. how do you take the obvious advantage that belonging to a church offers and divorce it from the religious precepts that make it a thing to begin with?

in that sense this whole idea is deeply experimental. i want to see how well i can use it as a platform to cull something similar community-wise, and having a multifunctional property is probably the best way to make it happen. from having a bar in the basement to watch panthers games to having educational material for other people to bring their kids to access if they want to being able to host events i think it's generally going to be an awesome and positive thing for greensboro, guilford county, and the state if this thing can produce enough good poo that keeps on producing good poo.

i'm very, very hesitant to take any kind of grants or donations. gofundme type stuff grosses me out... i can work my ass off and pay for it myself, and i'd rather

edit: oh and it'll be green as hell. i want it to be as self-sustainable as possible, which will mean solar and wind technology integrated into the grid as efficiently as possible, and a water collection tank as well, and gardens and poo