We are built like the '72 fins....with a better QB

[panthers55]

1 hour ago, parker said:

Our run game isn't a grind it out game and I hate when I hear announcers call us a "run first" team.  We haven't been that team in a long time.  Most of Stewart's runs are 1-2 yard runs.  But Stewart, and Tolbert to an extent, aren't guys that go down easy on the first hit.  I think it takes a focus on the defensive side to keep those 1-2 to become 5-8 yard runs and that is how our running game influences the passing game.  That's what makes the play action work.

It is a run first offense. We don't get most of our yards running the ball like Minnesota but the run sets up everything we do. Plus we are one of the few teams that have run the ball more than we throw it. That is the definition of a run first team.

We are averaging 4 yards a carry and Stewart has by far the most carries so most can't be 1 or 2 yards since he isn't breaking off 60 or 70 yard runs. William's numbers were inflated by a couple huge runs a game but not Stewarts. 

I do agree that the run game is a primary part of our play action passing game.

[FootballMaestro]

12 minutes ago, KB_fan said:

I think the reason we continue to get called that is that we're the only team in the league that runs a higher % of plays than passing plays.

Rushing plays %

https://www.teamrankings.com/nfl/stat/rushing-play-pct

We're first at 51.7%.  Seattle next at 48.2%

This is also because (as I said earlier) the Panthers usually have leads/big leads, and are fine with mostly running then, such as on Thanksgiving. However, it's not like the run game mostly got them those leads to begin with. The Panthers just aren't a "pile it on" team, once they have a 2TD lead, regardless of how early.

This is why I feel it's deceiving to people who only look at stats and see more rushes at the end of a game.

 

[fjblair]

1 hour ago, parker said:

Our run game isn't a grind it out game and I hate when I hear announcers call us a "run first" team.  We haven't been that team in a long time.  Most of Stewart's runs are 1-2 yard runs.  But Stewart, and Tolbert to an extent, aren't guys that go down easy on the first hit.  I think it takes a focus on the defensive side to keep those 1-2 to become 5-8 yard runs and that is how our running game influences the passing game.  That's what makes the play action work.

WTF are you smoking man?

[CPantherKing]

I do not see the Dolphins comparison. Not many similarities outside of trying to go undefeated.

This team resembles the 1981 49ers.

A team that no one had any expectations for rising up to dominate the league. A revolutionary offensive system taking root after a few years of development. A system defenses had significant trouble reading and playing against.

Most importantly, two young leaders who were the best at their respective positions at the early stages of their careers. A young QB and young defensive leader who every teammate believed in every play of the game. Their teammates would follow their lead and TRUST that the system would succeed week in and week out. There was no doubt.

Having those two young leaders becoming the best at their respective positions was the key to a decade of dominance. It is rare to have the HC, QB, and defensive leader all early in their career dominating and leading with such confidence at their respective positions. Every Panther fan needs to enjoy it and respect it.

[TNPanther]

I think we compare most to the 2015 Panthers.

[Davidson Deac II]

3 hours ago, FootballMaestro said:

This doesn't change the fact:

1) The Panther running game hasn't really been much with out Cam (though we hope that's changing).

2) The Panther running game has been inconsistent this year (with out Cam), and Stewart in general.

3) That the passing game, and/or a balanced attack usually moves the ball up the field early in games.

4) Regardless of the philosophy, the passing games been working.

You take away "The Cam Effect", and/or his rushing yards, and how good really is this running game?

So in other words, you may have a philosophy, but if it's not working So what! Who cares?

I hope I don't come off as harsh. But the Panther run game has not been world beaters outside of "The Newton Effect" most of his Carolina career.

God bless them, they're running now. But it's not for a high per rush avg. Like I said earlier; it's to add balance or run out the clock. But the Panthers don't have a featured back, such as Adrian Peterson to rely on. That person on offense, is Cam Newton.

I disagree.  The run game has been extremely consistent.  We don't have the long runs that we have sometimes had in the past, and that has caused the ypc to be lower than most teams, but the grind it out and pound it style of offense we run has been working consistently for most of the season.  The opponents have been stacking up against us, but Stewart (and to a lesser degree Tolbert) have been pushing the pile and running harder than just about anyone.  In some ways, Stewart has become more like Marshawn Lynch with his ability to push defenders back or carry them for a couple of extra yards.  I wouldn't be surprised if Stewart was one of the league leaders irt fewest carries that lose yards, at least in relation to the number of carries he gets.

 

Also, if Stewart isn't a featured back, then I am not sure what the definition of the term is.  He is third in the league in attempts per game.   His number of carries have been consistently between 20-24 since the bye week, regardless of how close the game was.   In today's NFL, that is a featured back.  In truth, I wish they would feature him a little less as to save a little wear and tear on him. 

 

I do believe that one thing the coaching staff and the offense has done well though is adapt to the team we are playing and take advantage of their weaknesses or what they are giving us.  While I think our staff prefers long time consuming drives, we will do other things if the defense is vulnerable.  Take the Green Bay game for example.  We took advantage of their corners and beat them on several deep throws.

[Davidson Deac II]

2 hours ago, parker said:

Our run game isn't a grind it out game and I hate when I hear announcers call us a "run first" team.  We haven't been that team in a long time.  Most of Stewart's runs are 1-2 yard runs.  But Stewart, and Tolbert to an extent, aren't guys that go down easy on the first hit.  I think it takes a focus on the defensive side to keep those 1-2 to become 5-8 yard runs and that is how our running game influences the passing game.  That's what makes the play action work.

That is the definition of a grind it out style of running attack.  Stewart almost always pushes the pile, in some ways he has become an old style 3 yards and a cloud of dust type of runner that almost always gets three yards and has to be gang tackled to keep it from being more. 

[UKPanther94]

Stewarts the perfect RB for this offense, while he isn't the guy who'll reel off massive runs (that often), you very rarely see him stuffed at the line of scrimmage, a 1/2 yard run for a lot of RBs he manages to turn into 4 or 5, doesnt sound much but that can make all the difference in an offensive drive

[pantherclaw]

The 73 Dolphins were the better team. 

72 went undefeated due to a cupcake schedule.

[Jangler]

1 hour ago, CPantherKing said:

I do not see the Dolphins comparison. Not many similarities outside of trying to go undefeated.

This team resembles the 1981 49ers.

A team that no one had any expectations for rising up to dominate the league. A revolutionary offensive system taking root after a few years of development. A system defenses had significant trouble reading and playing against.

Most importantly, two young leaders who were the best at their respective positions at the early stages of their careers. A young QB and young defensive leader who every teammate believed in every play of the game. Their teammates would follow their lead and TRUST that the system would succeed week in and week out. There was no doubt.

Having those two young leaders becoming the best at their respective positions was the key to a decade of dominance. It is rare to have the HC, QB, and defensive leader all early in their career dominating and leading with such confidence at their respective positions. Every Panther fan needs to enjoy it and respect it.

Well, we're waiting!

[CPantherKing]

4 hours ago, parker said:

Our run game isn't a grind it out game and I hate when I hear announcers call us a "run first" team.  We haven't been that team in a long time.  Most of Stewart's runs are 1-2 yard runs.  But Stewart, and Tolbert to an extent, aren't guys that go down easy on the first hit.  I think it takes a focus on the defensive side to keep those 1-2 to become 5-8 yard runs and that is how our running game influences the passing game.  That's what makes the play action work.

This is correct. The Panthers are not a grind it out running offense.

If you take a close look the Panthers are actually running a hybrid west coast offense influenced by the run option.

On 1st and 2nd down the Panthers will mix in the run. On 3rd and 4th downs, Cam will use the run option or choose to pass the ball.

The Panthers have been in 3rd/4th and short 36 times this season. They have passed the ball 16 times. Cam has run with the ball 14 times (8 were called run plays). RBs carry the ball 6 times (17%). 

As for the Panthers first downs, they have passed for 60% of them. The RBs only account for 22% of all first downs.

To compare: Seahawks 32% / Vikings 36% / Rams 31% / Bucs 29% / Bills 29% / Cardinals 25%

The Panthers rank behind all of them. A traditional grind it out running team would be 30-40% first downs with their running backs.

The Panthers make you respect their running game, and then use deception with the play action/run option to carve a defense up with the short to intermediate passing game.

This offense looks a lot like the early days of the Bill Walsh led offenses in the early 80s pre Jerry Rice and the Mike Holmgren offenses of the mid to late 90s. The stat lines and play percentages are very similar. They just worked in the read option/QB power instead of the standard play action roll out.

[KB_fan]

9 minutes ago, CPantherKing said:

This is correct. The Panthers are not a grind it out running offense.

[...]

As for the Panthers first downs, they have passed for 60% of them. The RBs only account for 22% of all first downs.

To compare: Seahawks 32% / Vikings 36% / Rams 31% / Bucs 29% / Bills 29% / Cardinals 25%

 

Really interesting comment @CPantherKing

I note that you qualified the stat about Rushing 1st downs to single out the low % of 1st downs by our RBs.  You're right that's really low for a "rushing team."  But then there are the stats for Cam & first downs!

Cam leads the league by a huge margin in terms of QB rushing 1st downs

http://www.sportingcharts.com/nfl/stats/quarterback-rushing-first-downs-leaders/2015/

In fact HE LEADS ALL PLAYERS IN THE LEAGUE in terms of rushing 1st downs %:

http://www.sportingcharts.com/nfl/stats/player-rushing-first-down-percentage/2015/

(Three RBs have more 1st downs than Cam, but Cam, since he has fewer rush attempts, has a higher %)

[CPantherKing]

32 minutes ago, Jangler said:

Well, we're waiting!

[CPantherKing]

12 minutes ago, KB_fan said:

Really interesting comment @CPantherKing

I note that you qualified the stat about Rushing 1st downs to single out the low % of 1st downs by our RBs.  You're right that's really low for a "rushing team."  But then there are the stats for Cam & first downs!

Cam leads the league by a huge margin in terms of QB rushing 1st downs

http://www.sportingcharts.com/nfl/stats/quarterback-rushing-first-downs-leaders/2015/

In fact HE LEADS ALL PLAYERS IN THE LEAGUE in terms of rushing 1st downs:

http://www.sportingcharts.com/nfl/stats/player-rushing-first-down-percentage/2015/

 

Cam's runs are mainly off the pass plays.They only call designed running plays for Cam 3 to 5 times a game. Yes Cam is a large part of the running game, but he is not the main component of a "grind it out running game". Cam's running game is more like a west coast offense QB infused with a power option.