"No debate" these QBs are better than Cam Newton

[mbarbour21]

if you can watch, you can count (hopefully). That's how those stats came about. So how would you judge QB protection? Please give us a stat that shows that CAR's oline does not protect Cam better than RW's oline other than your eye.

I felt 45% more hits on Cam..

[juliosantos]

they are only better stat wise but stats dont make the qb . cam is way better then most of those players with the exception of a few.

stats are stats, if matt ryan throws the ball 200 times more he is going to put more passing numbers then cam , does that mean hes a better qb? no.

Its more macro then people think , if you have a bad oline and bad wr core do they get the blame no cam does . i just re watched the game vs the steelers where we got blown out.

little things i noticed is , cam completed a pass almost everytime he had time in the pocket and we drove the field and something like a sack or a dropped pass would stall our drive.

This is cams year everyone is doubting him , we have a upgraded oline and a upgraded wr core . this is the first time in a long time where we can say we are deep at wr . also cam is in his contract year and being a competive guy hes going to want to show why hes worth the money.

 this is a long shot but im thinking cam has a mvp like season 

[KillerKat]

​I have 3 as clearly better than Cam. 

1. Rodgers- The gold standard QB. 

2. Brady- Was once number 1 but is reaching his decline due to age and has a bad reputation i dont want on my team.

3. Manning- Maybe one of the greatest, but his career is low in it's sunset.

 

Cam falls in the next group that includes in no order.

Cam- No explanation eeded for Panthers fans. 

Flacco- IMO the best QB in this teir that is as good as Cam, and has success to back it up.  

Brees- Let's be honest, just like Peyton, he has seen his better days and has no more upside, only downhill from here. 

Luck- Will be a good QB, but Cam still has just as much potential, plus has more athleticism and natural ability. 

Wilson- I think his team-mates are more responsible for the Seahawks success 

Rivers- I think is a fine QB. This is a team sport... but PR has never been able to elevate his team far into the playoffs. Sometimes you have to put the team on your back. Yes, I know Cam has not won a ring either, but he is younger, more talented and has a better team. We will get our chance. 

Big Ben- Everyone knows who big Ben is. He has a lot in common with Cam as far as big play ability and able to extend the play with his mobility. Ben is getting older though and has already reached his potential. He does have some nice rings to show off though. 

I believe these 7 guys to all be about equal in talent, though personally I would choose Cam Newton over any of the rest of them because of his athletic ability, youth and still unreached ceiling. He is also improving every year. 

 

So if I had to choose a QB for my Panthers, I would consider all of the before mentioned reasons as my criteria and would only choose Rodgers over Cam Newton.  

​you know what "no debate" means

[KillerKat]

No debate Culter better than Cam. The one that last his starting job. Yep, no bias there at all.

[MedellinHeel]

First 11 are for sure. Those last 5 not so much. 

[rodeo]

I keep getting the urge to debate this, but as soon as I start I just sigh and stop because it's no debate. It's physically taxing.

And now I've just pissed myself.

[Mother Grabber]

who would you trade straight up, 1-1 for Cam? For me, that list is just one name:

Aaron Rogers

and I'd have to think about it for a while. no one else in the entire NFL would I trade for Cam straight up.

some of the names on that list I wouldn't want if you gave them to me. Cutler, really? dafug.

[sharkkiller]

So is he saying that there is no debate because it is so obviously true? Or is he saying no debate because it is his opinion with no facts to back it up, and he does not want anyone to start a debate that he knows he will lose?

 

I am leaning towards the latter.

Me- "But Cam has had better stats over the past 4 years than quite a few of those QBs, and made the playoffs two years in a row. some of those QBs have not been in the playoffs at all in the past 4 years."

Douchenozzle- "Hey, I said NO DEBATE. Stop debating me."

[Mr. Scot]

​In this context, we were talking QB protection. The stats bear out what I have seen as well as many other people who watch more football than us both combined to come up with those stats. You have no idea how much football I watch. If you watched as much football as I did (including SEA games), you will come to the same conclusion and you probably wouldn't have swallowed "David Carr is a great QB according to stats" line.

​Carr had great stats, but he was a lousy QB.  That's kinda the point.

But if you wanna stick with the "stats are context" line, then I'll need answers to the following questions...

- How many of the QB hits tallied came behind the line of scrimmage versus ahead of it?

- How many of the plays on which Cam was hit were designed runs?

- How many potential QB hits was Cam able to escape with his mobility?

- On how many plays was a back or a tight end kept in as an extra blocker?

- How many hits on either QB were a result of "coverage sacks"?

- How many hits came because either QB held the ball for too long?

- How many times did the respective teams employ 3, 5, 7 step drops or rollouts?

And to be clear, all of these questions will need to be answered by an exact number from a verifiable source.  Otherwise the "statistics are context" argument falls apart.

See, these are the kinds of things us "non-stat guys" pay attention to when we're watching an actual game.  It's also the kind of thing scouts, GMs and personnel people use to evaluate quarterbacks and linemen rather than just "checking the stats".  These, and more.  Honestly, I could have added additional questions but I figured this was enough to make the point.

But hey, if you can provide a verifiable answer to these questions, then I'll certainly take your argument seriously.

As an alternative, I might suggest going with the "I didn't mean it; I was just trolling" tactic to get out of the argument and save face.  That might be your best option here.

[CelibatePimp]

Dude what stops you from answering those questions yourself to support your argument? Lol asking questions like I even care? 

 

What great stats did Carr have? You are obviously not independent minded. One of those guys who follows what people say. Lmao and you say my statement was trolling? Thanks for playing Mr. "Carr has great stats".  

I honestly would like you to show us those great stats but it will further embarrass you. You're not worth my time. 

[Mr. Scot]

Dude what stops you from answering those questions yourself to support your argument? Lol asking questions like I even care? 

What great stats did Carr have? You are obviously not independent minded. One of those guys who follows what people say. Lmao and you say my statement was trolling? Thanks for playing Mr. "Carr has great stats".  

I honestly would like you to show us those great stats but it will further embarrass you. You're not worth my time. 

​Carr had, among other things, the best completion percentage in the league.  Everybody here loved citing that stat when we signed him.  And WCO quarterbacks usually do have great percentages.  It's one of the reasons they tend to be overrated.

And it's honestly pretty funny to have someone who's holding hard to the stat line when I'm saying to follow your eyes instead tell me I'm "not the independent thinker".  Ummmm, yeah...

Face it, dude.  You lost this one.  But the old "i could refute you, but i don't care" out is at least a good choice for an exit strategy. Kudos for that.