Panthers trade up to 9th pick of second round - select Devin Funchess

[MV%doe]

I've moved on from it for the most part, so I don't hurt the gettleman fan club's feelings by disagreeing with his moves... But ultimately, that's the biggest issue I had with it.

I said when we took Shaq, that it's likely he would've been there much further down... We likely could've traded back at least 7 picks to possibly the early second round, got Shaq, and picked up another pick to use to trade up again where we could've taken Devin Smith or Funchess.

We don't know this, but honestly, neither does any gm out there... They only have an idea of what teams are looking at which players, but like Shaq said, he could've went anywhere from 20-50,and seeing how he started slipping in many projections (much like we saw with Clemmings now), that's where I have my issue,in that we could've given ourselves much more maneuverability if we traded back for shaq and picked up another pick.

But oh well, it's done and that's who we have. No room for dissenting opinions, so let's all fap.

I know rumors are rumors and I don't like either pick at ALL.

Rumor was dallas would have picked shaq at 27. It stated by steve jones last year that if they didn't move up last year, the 2nd would have been early and 3rd turner. Now take that as you want.

[calipanther]

I have no idea where the sense that not trading back was bad.

Pick up more assets for the franchise I understand. Making a deal when what we are selling has no value? Doesn't make sense.

Does everyone remember when we drafted Cam they thought we might "trade back"?

You have to have a willing buyer. No one as interested in trading up for Cam. Just as no one was interested in the 25th pick when we took Shaq.

What is Gettleman supposed to do? Call every team in his 10 minute window and ask what they be willing to give up? "Hey I have the pick that even we don't want. Would you be willing to give up a future first rounder and this years second so my franchises fan board feels better about this guy?" "I'll remember this next time you want to trade." "Pretty please?"

Come on guys. If it ain't a sellers market you can generate interest. This is a Mel kiper fallacy.

[*FreeFua*]

I know rumors are rumors and I don't like either pick at ALL.

Rumor was dallas would have picked shaq at 27. It stated by steve jones last year that if they didn't move up last year, the 2nd would have been early and 3rd turner. Now take that as you want.

Dallas had a top 15 grade on Byron Jones, maybe if Jones was gone they would've taken Shaq but I'm thinking they were going Jones as long as he was there.

[Fidel Cashflow]

Possible. I was just watching nfln and they have a reporter in New Orleans and they said there was an audible groan everytime a TE was picked... I consider Funchess a TE, so it may have been they were targeting him.

 

Absolutely

[Mr. Scot]

It's no secret to anyone who has been watching Panthers games the last few years that our red zone efficiency has gone down a lot. Like I said in my original post, my thinking is that Dave first and foremost wants to improve that, and with Newton, Olsen, and Stewart already in the mix, when you add in Benjamin and Funchess, that's certainly a formidable challenge to defenses.

 

Fixing the OL and improving the runningback stable could be part of that too.

[Proudiddy]

The difference is one has proven it where the other has no real accountability.

You're free to disagree, but everyone else is also free to disagree with you, and that includes pointing out flaws in your thinking. People do the same to me. It's part of the discussion process.

As far as that goes, some people have demonstrated knowledge while others have demonstrated a lack of it. My mode of response to someone is generally based on that established pattern (if there is one; some people are unknowns). Disagreeing with me doesn't make someone dumb, but yes sometimes even smart people make dumb arguments. Heck, I've looked at past posts of my own and said "What was I thinking?"

Sometimes you just have to say "I was wrong" because sometimes you are. We all are. If you keep stubbornly defending a judgement on a player / coach / executive that's been shown to be incorrect, all you do is look worse. And it's not automatically a 'circle jerk' just because a lot of people happen to disagree with you.

You're right, scot, we all have been wrong at some point. I've said in this very thread that I have been wrong, and will be wrong again. But I've been right more often than not, if we want to consider predictions made here on the huddle. I'm not saying I'm an NFL talent evaluator, but that's where that is a ridiculous argument to be made as well... Anytime someone says, "I don't agree with this pick, I think player X was better," they are immediately met with, "well he's an NFL Gm with 208 years of talent evaluation experience, you're Internet nobody." okay... So why are we even here discussing it then? You're saying one thing, but doing another. I didn't compare myself or my resume to gettleman, nor would I. TRG did.

That's the problem we're running into here. Everyone IS free to agree or disagree with the picks, signings, lack of signings, etc, but the moment someone steps outside of the box and says "I would've done this," they get hit with a nuke, "well you're not in the front office. Let's all worship at the altar of gettleman." That isn't inviting discussion or differing opinions. And so, here I bring it full circle... That whole thing about everyone getting it wrong sometimes... So do NFL front offices. So has Gettleman. So, it's possible that the people saying they disagree with moves may be right.

That's the funny thing about the draft and what you just stated... How is disagreeing at this point, wrong? No one knows until these guys play games. Once they do, whoever is right can say, "I told you so," but until then, yes, there is a suffocating circle jerk attempting to shutdown anything that doesn't jibe with their way of thinking.

Contrary to popular opinion, I don't hate gettleman. In fact, it's in my interest for him to do an awesome job because my team's success depends on it. But, as a fan, I disagree with his approach.

Do you want to talk about who has been wrong, or made a dumb argument? Let's talk about his approach to the WR corps and OL last season. Would you like to dissect that? I don't feel like digging it up, but I can't count how many idiots had a wet dream on this very forum when we signed Cotchery. I reminded them he was a situational WR that was best working out of the slot, and greatly relied on talent around him to open things up for him, and that was how he got 10 tds in the season before. That was shot down. Gettleman was a genius, well simply plug him in and he'll give us the same production. How did that work out? Same with avant. The OL? We don't have to go through the details. I complained from the offseason on that the lack of speed and talent at WR would kill our offense and would make things very hard for cam. That's exactly what happened. Our offense is what held up back, almost knocked out of the playoffs, and ended our season in Seattle...

I understand gettleman can't magically snap his fingers and fill in all those holes we had in one single swoop... But I knew it was a weakness and voiced that. It was never appropriately addressed and it remained a problem that plagued our season. I wasn't wrong about that, but those on the other side of the argument refused to accept that, as illogical as it was, and then eventually, because of that denial, turned around and blamed Cam for all of our issues, lol. So, it's a never ending cycle...

My hope was that we would address those issues so we won't go through that again. As random Internet fan guy, just like everyone else here, I felt those needs were best addressed in other ways. Gettleman made his moves, and we'll see what happens,but until then no one knows who is right or wrong. And if I'm wrong, I'll be eating my crow and cheering like everyone else. I don't give a poo as long as my team is winning. But, in that same vein, that crowd that convinced themselves gettleman tricked the entire league by gutting our receiving corps and then assembling the slowest unit around that caused so many of our struggles have an awfully short memory... It's a two-way Street.

Front offices aren't immune from criticism and mistakes either.

[MV%doe]

Dallas had a top 15 grade on Byron Jones, maybe if Jones was gone they would've taken Shaq but I'm thinking they were going Jones as long as he was there.

I didn't know that, hmmm you think jerry has kept al davis head alive somehow and ask him for draft advice? Bryon Jones without the insane combine #s is just a mid round injury-prone player.

[Proudiddy]

Dude, nobody's "censoring" anybody. Nobody but the mods and admins even has the power to do so.

You're just in a position where a lot of people happen to disagree with you. I've been there too.

Sometimes you're right. Sometimes you're wrong.

Regarding Shaq, it's posted in another thread that a Dallas guy said they were prepared to take him two spots below us, so there it looks like you're wrong.

Scot, as you like to say, "you're smarter than that."

You know I meant censor in a metaphorical sense. If a while crowd of people go out of their way to smother any dissenting opinions until there are none, that is censorship lol.

As far as shaq, cool... Then I'm wrong. I still would've liked to go about things differently.

[Proudiddy]

Also, apologies for formatting and typo errors, I'm on my phone.

[TheRed]

Fixing the OL and improving the runningback stable could be part of that too.

 

Certainly. It stands to reason that at some point we will likely pick an RB in this draft as well.

 

As for the OL, I think that Gettleman learned his lesson from last year, at least I would definitely hope. Though at this point it looks like any OL drafted would be depth at the most, but we need all of that we can get. I imagine that Gettleman will be looking high and low again after the draft for some more undrafted FA gems, like Brown, and Norwell of last year. I would like to see as much competition as possible on the OL.

[Mr. Scot]

You're right, scot, we all have been wrong at some point. I've said in this very thread that I have been wrong, and will be wrong again. But I've been right more often than not, if we want to consider predictions made here on the huddle. I'm not saying I'm an NFL talent evaluator, but that's where that is a ridiculous argument to be made as well... Anytime someone says, "I don't agree with this pick, I think player X was better," they are immediately met with, "well he's an NFL Gm with 208 years of talent evaluation experience, you're Internet nobody." okay... So why are we even here discussing it then? You're saying one thing, but doing another. I didn't compare myself or my resume to gettleman, nor would I. TRG did.

That's the problem we're running into here. Everyone IS free to agree or disagree with the picks, signings, lack of signings, etc, but the moment someone steps outside of the box and says "I would've done this," they get hit with a nuke, "well you're not in the front office. Let's all worship at the altar of gettleman." That isn't inviting discussion or differing opinions. And so, here I bring it full circle... That whole thing about everyone getting it wrong sometimes... So do NFL front offices. So has Gettleman. So, it's possible that the people saying they disagree with moves may be right.

That's the funny thing about the draft and what you just stated... How is disagreeing at this point, wrong? No one knows until these guys play games. Once they do, whoever is right can say, "I told you so," but until then, yes, there is a suffocating circle jerk attempting to shutdown anything that doesn't jibe with their way of thinking.

Contrary to popular opinion, I don't hate gettleman. In fact, it's in my interest for him to do an awesome job because my team's success depends on it. But, as a fan, I disagree with his approach.

Do you want to talk about who has been wrong, or made a dumb argument? Let's talk about his approach to the WR corps and OL last season. Would you like to dissect that? I don't feel like digging it up, but I can't count how many idiots had a wet dream on this very forum when we signed Cotchery. I reminded them he was a situational WR that was best working out of the slot, and greatly relied on talent around him to open things up for him, and that was how he got 10 tds in the season before. That was shot down. Gettleman was a genius, well simply plug him in and he'll give us the same production. How did that work out? Same with avant. The OL? We don't have to go through the details. I complained from the offseason on that the lack of speed and talent at WR would kill our offense and would make things very hard for cam. That's exactly what happened. Our offense is what held up back, almost knocked out of the playoffs, and ended our season in Seattle...

I understand gettleman can't magically snap his fingers and fill in all those holes we had in one single swoop... But I knew it was a weakness and voiced that. It was never appropriately addressed and it remained a problem that plagued our season. I wasn't wrong about that, but those on the other side of the argument refused to accept that, as illogical as it was, and then eventually, because of that denial, turned around and blamed Cam for all of our issues, lol. So, it's a never ending cycle...

My hope was that we would address those issues so we won't go through that again. As random Internet fan guy, just like everyone else here, I felt those needs were best addressed in other ways. Gettleman made his moves, and we'll see what happens,but until then no one knows who is right or wrong. And if I'm wrong, I'll be eating my crow and cheering like everyone else. I don't give a poo as long as my team is winning. But, in that same vein, that crowd that convinced themselves gettleman tricked the entire league by gutting our receiving corps and then assembling the slowest unit around that caused so many of our struggles have an awfully short memory... It's a two-way Street.

Front offices aren't immune from criticism and mistakes either.

 

Thing of it is, the point that he's an NFL GM with lots of experience, a proven track record and success with the Panthers is a valid point.

 

I'm a decent chess player, but I'm pretty sure if I compared myself to Gary Kasparov people wouldn't take it all that seriously.  And me saying, "Yeah, well he's lost some games" wouldn't really help my argument.

 

Gettleman certainly isn't perfect.  I don't know a GM who is.  Heck, Ozzie Newsome is generally acknowledged as one of the best in the business but he's drafted busts too (Sergio Kindle comes to mind) and he horribly mishandled the situations of both Steve McNair and Ray Rice.

 

Do those things discredit his body of GM work or somehow make me smarter?  Not really.

 

Every year, 31 GMs are going to fail to reach their goal.  Some will get closer than others.  And under Gettleman, we're getting closer to being a consistent winner than we ever did before.

 

You wanna put yourself in opposition to that, it's your right.  But you're putting yourself in a spot when you do.  And trust me, I understand what it's like to be the bearer of an unpopular opinion

 

Don't take this too personally.  And don't make it an ego thing.  Trust me, you'll do a lot less typing that way.

[Mr. Scot]

Certainly. It stands to reason that at some point we will likely pick an RB in this draft as well.

 

As for the OL, I think that Gettleman learned his lesson from last year, at least I would definitely hope. Though at this point it looks like any OL drafted would be depth at the most, but we need all of that we can get. I imagine that Gettleman will be looking high and low again after the draft for some more undrafted FA gems, like Brown, and Norwell of last year. I would like to see as much competition as possible on the OL.

 

I think you will.

 

I also think Norwell actually may have been a bigger find than we even know at this point for one big reason:  attitude.

 

Trai Turner has basically sai "I thought I was mean and nasty, till I met him."  And Turner may not be the only guy to benefit from that.

 

[TheRumGone]

Your opinion matters too.

I'm not saying it for my sake. I'm saying the gettleman fan club is quickly approaching Stalin-esque levels of censorship.

I'm not getting into this to start the day off, TRG.

I thought there were better ways to acquire a receiving talent. We're not privy to all the info nfl front offices are, but it appears we took shaq earlier than he could've been had, then traded several picks to move up and take funchess.

I wanted speed and sure hands. That can still be had, but the black and white of it is, I didn't like the way we went about it and who we took in this moment... They both could be great players. But this board is here to discuss agreement, disagreement, etc. I want our team to win Superbowls. If gettleman's picks do that, then he is the greatest man that ever lived... Regardless, we have the ability to agree, disagree, and discuss.

You're right, who cares what I say, you say, or anyone on this board says... Oh well, who wants discussion? Unless we live in gettleman's buttcrack, we have no right to speak.

 

you are so off the mark here it isn't even funny anymore. OF COURSE THIS BOARD IS TO GIVE OPINIONS. but when you literally just compared your "talent evaluation" to a dude that has been doing this for 30 years, thats not giving a good argument. It makes you look like an idiot. For example. JawnyBlaze gives good arguments why he doesn't like certain picks.

 

I'm with you. We need speed. But i'm trusting that these guys and DG know what they are getting with this guy. I'm looking at a Alshon/Marshall type of duo. We need a speed receiver now.

 

[Proudiddy]

Thing of it is, the point that he's an NFL GM with lots of experience, a proven track record and success with the Panthers is a valid point.

I'm a decent chess player, but I'm pretty sure if I compared myself to Gary Kasparov people wouldn't take it all that seriously. And me saying, "Yeah, well he's lost some games" wouldn't really help my argument.

Gettleman certainly isn't perfect. I don't know a GM who is. Heck, Ozzie Newsome is generally acknowledged as one of the best in the business but he's drafted busts too (Sergio Kindle comes to mind) and he horribly mishandled the situations of both Steve McNair and Ray Rice.

Do those things discredit his body of GM work or somehow make me smarter? Not really.

Every year, 31 GMs are going to fail to reach their goal. Some will get closer than others. And under Gettleman, we're getting closer to being a consistent winner than we ever did before.

You wanna put yourself in opposition to that, it's your right. But you're putting yourself in a spot when you do. And trust me, I understand what it's like to be the bearer of an unpopular opinion

Don't take this too personally. And don't make it an ego thing. Trust me, you'll do a lot less typing that way.

Thing is, I'm not doing any of those things but simply disagreeing with individual moves that are made. I also have said I loved signing Ginn, Tillman, Oher, Martin, Colman, etc.

That's where perception comes in.

My opposition on this board is turning this into a Proudiddy v Gettleman argument. I have no ego, at least not enough of one to stack myself up against him lol. I'm saying I don't like this, I would've done it this way, and people are perceiving that to mean, "look at my Internet track record where my job isn't on the line! Trust me, my Madden online franchise is a 25x champion!" I'm not the one framing it that way. Like I said, when someone (not you) can't win an argument, they reach for the furthest, most extreme thing to discredit the other. So, if me saying "that's the wrong move" can't be disproven at this moment, what better way to dump on it then to say, "he's an NFL gm and you're not. Shut up and watch."

Okay... Bye bye dialogue!

I have said I disagree with certain moves, and have loved others, with my biggest gripe being that WR has widely been ignored while other strengths have been addressed and addressed again.

I'm watching and say what I think... That's all.