Bill Voth's chat with Gettleman Part 3: On the offense

[panthers55]

Remmers got beat like a drum against the Seahawks.

 

I'll give him props for coming in and doing better than Chandler, but we shouldn't be completely content like our RT problem is solved.  I hope Remmers can be the guy, but I'd keep options open.

He was promoted from the practice squad to a starter in a few weeks time IIRC.  He had to learn along the way.  It seems to me he did a fantastic job like Norwell did given the circumstances.  Lets see how he does this year with a full offseason, camp and preseason to get ready and build chemistry with his teammates.  Offensive line is one of those spots where it isnt just how he works as an individual but how they mesh as unit.  The whole has to be better than the sum of the parts. 

[Panther53521]

This is just what I have been telling everyone that constantly criticizes Shula.  Shula runs the system that both Gettleman and Rivera want.  When he has the players to run his system, he can be successful.  When he doesnt we struggle.  For those on Shula's nuts about poor playcalling, consider being an Eagle's fan or a Saint's fan.  Because as long as Gettleman is here, our current offense is the kind of offense you can expect.

 

Sits back while the bitching and whining continues despite the fact that Gettleman said it isn't going to change and the goal is to give Shula and Cam more weapons to work,not making changes to the system or philosophy.

 

His plays work, we all know that. Its his rhythm, timing and situation awareness that everyone loses their mind over. He is slow to adjust to the defensive adjustments. If a team adjusts to the pass then you pound the rock and vice versa.  His redzone play calls is extremely lacking, I dont know if he tries to get to cute or what.

 

I could very well see Shula making the same playcall in the Super Bowl as the Seahawks did.

[Kuech the Sneak]

He was promoted from the practice squad to a starter in a few weeks time IIRC. He had to learn along the way. It seems to me he did a fantastic job like Norwell did given the circumstances. Lets see how he does this year with a full offseason, camp and preseason to get ready and build chemistry with his teammates. Offensive line is one of those spots where it isnt just how he works as an individual but how they mesh as unit. The whole has to be better than the sum of the parts.

I think I remember reading about gettleman talking about an oline saying that you don't need to have a ton of high picks and really talented guys to put together a good oline. He was saying how you needed 5 guys who knew how to play together

[panthers55]

His plays work, we all know that. Its his rhythm, timing and situation awareness that everyone loses their mind over. He is slow to adjust to the defensive adjustments. If a team adjusts to the pass then you pound the rock and vice versa.  His redzone play calls is extremely lacking, I dont know if he tries to get to cute or what.

 

I could very well see Shula making the same playcall in the Super Bowl as the Seahawks did.

No offense,  but most of those generalizations are being made by posters who don't know how the system works.  Shula's offense gives Cam almost total control to change plays and audible to other options.  Even when they are in a certain set, they can run a number of plays out of that set.  So to say that Shula is the problem at situational awareness or in making defensive adjustments is barking up the wrong tree.  It is Cam who is still struggling with defensive adjustments and situational awareness. He calls the audibles and decides most times on what play is run from the options he is given..

As for redzone play calls, again who do you think steps up to the line and decides what to run based on defensive alignment or decides where the ball is going to go??  Don't get me wrong, this is not placing all the blame on Cam because he did a fantastic job given all the injuries and the lack of playing time until week 2 of the regular season. He played much of the season hurt.

The problem with the redzone offense was that our biggest weapon, Cam couldn't run as he wanted to most of the season, the offensive line gave him little time, had little push in the run game, and Cam really had only 2 redzone weapons, Olsen and Benjamin.  Other than that we had few options and consequently little success.  Both Cam and by extension, Shula need more redzone options when it becomes much harder to score given the field gets compressed and obvious options are always taken away.  If you compare the end of the season to the first half you can see what a healthy offense can look like.  Hopefully we have that this year. 

[MV%doe]

Looks like p55 took over for me, ala solo supporting a OC. Mine was henning, but i like him before panthers hired him. I didn't have any issues with shula as a QB coach, but didn't care for his history as OC or HC. 2013 I had shula as a 7, but the before the season started I thought he'd do no better than a 4. 2014 he was a 4-5 rating, if only he didn't lose his balls at mid-field and upped his red zone TD scoring %...... you'd think with tolbert, stew, olsen, kev, and cam they'd have better success.

Who knows how much Offensive input RR, dave, and even jerryrich have come game day. I do know RR has a say in it, plus i dont know what type of feelings RR has formed during cams 4 year career. That first year was very rough, but cams come ALONGGGGG way. Plus its almost a given that all HC defensive coaches don't like to take risk and rather win by holding the points low than out scoring.

Lastly in the history of panthers, the fanbase has NEVER liked any OC.

[pantherclaw]

Remmers got beat like a drum against the Seahawks.

I'll give him props for coming in and doing better than Chandler, but we shouldn't be completely content like our RT problem is solved. I hope Remmers can be the guy, but I'd keep options open.

here is the low down.

We have to upgrade the LT position. No way around it.

Remmers, while not perfect, has given us the best play at RT that the Panthers have had since Wharton played the position.

The chances of adding two tackles that'll upgrade both positions, is slim to none.

Remmers will continue to develop.

While i expect competition to be brought in, Remmers will have the advantage from the beginning.

[CRA]

No offense, but most of those generalizations are being made by posters who don't know how the system works. Shula's offense gives Cam almost total control to change plays and audible to other options. Even when they are in a certain set, they can run a number of plays out of that set. So to say that Shula is the problem at situational awareness or in making defensive adjustments is barking up the wrong tree. It is Cam who is still struggling with defensive adjustments and situational awareness. He calls the audibles and decides most times on what play is run from the options he is given..

As for redzone play calls, again who do you think steps up to the line and decides what to run based on defensive alignment or decides where the ball is going to go?? Don't get me wrong, this is not placing all the blame on Cam because he did a fantastic job given all the injuries and the lack of playing time until week 2 of the regular season. He played much of the season hurt.

The problem with the redzone offense was that our biggest weapon, Cam couldn't run as he wanted to most of the season, the offensive line gave him little time, had little push in the run game, and Cam really had only 2 redzone weapons, Olsen and Benjamin. Other than that we had few options and consequently little success. Both Cam and by extension, Shula need more redzone options when it becomes much harder to score given the field gets compressed and obvious options are always taken away. If you compare the end of the season to the first half you can see what a healthy offense can look like. Hopefully we have that this year.

Shula said in December Cam had power to audible about 35-40% of the time

[panthers55]

Shula said in December Cam had power to audible about 35-40% of the time

That was in reference to calling a different play such as a pass to a run. There are so many variables within a play. For example you can keep the play but designate someone as a hot read or based on single coverage throw it to a particular receiver. You can run the ball but change the back alignment or where the ball is going if you see an over stack to one side of the other. On the read option plays he is keying off the end or the outside linebacker depending on what defensive alignment you are facing so he can decide to give it to Stewart hold it or even throw it. Obviously on many passing plays he is deciding who to throw it to or whether to dump it off short. So if you add in the times he can change the play completely and the times that he can change elements of the play or direct where it can go, he really has a lot of leeway and determines what we do based on what the defense is doing most of the time.

[mc52beast]

Being built like the Seahawks... except our guys don't go postal when they lose.

[MHS831]

Remmers struggled in Seattle.  Let's put that in perspective:

 

2 months earlier, he was on another team's practice squad.

He was probably still learning the playbook here. 

The noise in Seattle is the 12th man.  Tough place to play OT.

The Seattle defense is designed to take advantage of that noise--speed and complex pass rush packages

 

I am not too upset about that game.  Many OTs much more heralded and experienced have looked bad in Seattle.  Remmers would be an ideal backup because he can play RT and played LT in college--he can pass protect.  However, he is the best RT we have had here in a long time.  I have every reason to believe he will get better in 2015.

 

 

 

[Mol3m4n]

No offense, but most of those generalizations are being made by posters who don't know how the system works. Shula's offense gives Cam almost total control to change plays and audible to other options. Even when they are in a certain set, they can run a number of plays out of that set. So to say that Shula is the problem at situational awareness or in making defensive adjustments is barking up the wrong tree. It is Cam who is still struggling with defensive adjustments and situational awareness. He calls the audibles and decides most times on what play is run from the options he is given..

As for redzone play calls, again who do you think steps up to the line and decides what to run based on defensive alignment or decides where the ball is going to go?? Don't get me wrong, this is not placing all the blame on Cam because he did a fantastic job given all the injuries and the lack of playing time until week 2 of the regular season. He played much of the season hurt.

The problem with the redzone offense was that our biggest weapon, Cam couldn't run as he wanted to most of the season, the offensive line gave him little time, had little push in the run game, and Cam really had only 2 redzone weapons, Olsen and Benjamin. Other than that we had few options and consequently little success. Both Cam and by extension, Shula need more redzone options when it becomes much harder to score given the field gets compressed and obvious options are always taken away. If you compare the end of the season to the first half you can see what a healthy offense can look like. Hopefully we have that this year.

No offense, but I don't think you know how the system works.

[panthers55]

No offense, but I don't think you know how the system works.

But I listen to those who do know the system and simply discuss what I have been told and have read.  I don't pretend to be an expert just pay closer attention than most to those who are.

[Kuech the Sneak]

Remmers struggled in Seattle. Let's put that in perspective:

2 months earlier, he was on another team's practice squad.

He was probably still learning the playbook here.

The noise in Seattle is the 12th man. Tough place to play OT.

The Seattle defense is designed to take advantage of that noise--speed and complex pass rush packages

I am not too upset about that game. Many OTs much more heralded and experienced have looked bad in Seattle. Remmers would be an ideal backup because he can play RT and played LT in college--he can pass protect. However, he is the best RT we have had here in a long time. I have every reason to believe he will get better in 2015.

Yeah I would be comfortable starting remmers next season, especially If we can't find a better player through FA or the draft. But we have to find a way to upgrade LT, can't have byron bell starting anymore games for this team

[Kuech the Sneak]

here is the low down.

We have to upgrade the LT position. No way around it.

Remmers, while not perfect, has given us the best play at RT that the Panthers have had since Wharton played the position.

The chances of adding two tackles that'll upgrade both positions, is slim to none.

Remmers will continue to develop.

While i expect competition to be brought in, Remmers will have the advantage from the beginning.

I agree with pretty much everything here, remmers is solid but LT is the biggest priority and needs to be upgraded 100%