We were looking at Thigpen???

[Lt Pinkerton]

Sevendust sucks

[Cyberjag]

I'm criticizing just Jake....when you equate that to criticizing the Panthers Org as a whole you become a snuggler. I love the Panthers but a large % of the fanbase is borderline Terry Schiavo-esque and irritate the crap out of me

I guess I'm wrong. It just seems like you rarely have anything positive to say, and most of the threads I see you post in are about Jake.

Sorry about that, Chief.

[WildBill559]

during both bye weeks (prior to Oakland and Arizona) they wanted to get Jake's arm some rest, so they gave him some extra days off. But it somewhat backfired because instead of rejuvinating his arm, it caused it to stiffen up. Now you can take that for what you want, but the numbers in both games are among the worst of Jake's career, so it makes sense that his play was directly impacted by the stiffness.

After it "backfired" the first time, they went with the same plan again? :confused:

[KillerKat]

In any honest apples to apples comparison, Delhomme wins. Fox and Hurney know this.

But since you disagree with what comes across as an almost religious fervor, can you tell me where and when we could have gotten a better QB than Jake without taking apart the team?

When has Fox tried to obtain a better option other than scrubs at backup QB? When have we ever developed a QB so that he's better? The only QB in Fox's tenure that has shown improvement and has potential to still continue to improve is Matt Moore. Anyone else we have obtained was poo undrafted QBs or crappy QBs from other teams that we thought could develop but we didn't. Who's fault is it for not putting the effort in getting a legit RELIABLE backup QB that didn't go to sh*t when we got him?

[KillerKat]

That isn't what I said. You are not stupid, so I can only assume your bias is at work again. Your point seems to be unless the player whines to the press about it or the injury has some effects that are known like concussions that there IS no effect. That's not logical in any way shape or form. Any time a player comes back from a major surgery there is an effect. Have you ever had surgery on your arm? I have and am affected to this day almost 12 years later. Luckily I don't play football. If it makes you feel better to have "proof", Mark Schlereth talked about how TJ affects baseball players (sometimes you are on sometimes you are off, which certainly describes some games Jake had last year) and he has experience with being around that since his son is a pitcher.

My point was that you compared speculation of Jake's arm affecting him throughout his whole career to Anderson's concussion which has been proven that it does affect play.

Den-Actually most people saw, and it was discussed a bit afterwards by players/coaches and on here that the Cats going to hurry up & throwing to back the 8 out of the box and that's what loosened up the Denver D fro the run game, but of course you didn't see that because it didn't fit your bias. Yeah he turned it over a bunch vs Den. One int. He had a 65% comp % and 9.7 YPA. I can clearly see why you think he struggled upon watching the game and looking at the stats. Geeze louise.

Jake struggled a bit early in the ATL game then did a very good job in the second half. Do you have a bad memory or is your bias that great?

And like I said these 2 were the iffy ones for me. The 6 others that I mentioned were definately poor games for Jake. These 2 were on the fence for me cause for the denver game, I can't predict that Jake would've continued to strugge if we continued to pass. I can only base that on pass performance which greatly favors he would've continued to struggle. For Atlanta, like I said before I can't fault him for not being able to keep drives going longer than usual due to playing catch up cause the defense failed.

I didn't answer about the other games you mentioned? I think that was self explanatory in my initial response that those two games defining bad or shaky for you told me all I needed to know about how you judge him. Besides I also don't agree that all those games were horrible either in the context of doing some things to help your team win. SD and Chi weren't statistically pretty and he was off accuracy wise, but down the stretch he helped his team. I don't call those HORRIBLE games (like Oak) for that reason.

And that's the difference with me and you. I judge for how I see a player perform himself.

I don't care about the DA best/Jake worst argument.

And I notice YOU did not answer about the 10 games without INTS. I assume that was because of Smitty, DWill, Moose and Stewart, right?

He's not the best QB in the world, he's not and never will be elite. But to say he's as bad as you purport is silliness, pure and simple. I don't expect elite performances all the time from a non-elite guy. You do. I look at his performances as what should be expected from HIM not what should be expected from Tom Brady (who, by the way, has had a couple "FAIL" playoff games one of which his team overcame that to win).

I don't expect him to be elite. I want him to be consistant to where his good games far outweight the bad. I want him to be more on target instead of the usual too high, too low, off target throws.

I would respect it more if you would just simply say that you despise him and that no amount that he could ever do or has done would make you happy he was the QB like other people on here have done with him because you hate him personally. At least it's honest instead of trying to use different standards or ridiculously high ones or lack of logic so he "fails" all the time.

As long as he continues playing bad, Im going to continue criticizing him.

[Cyberjag]

When has Fox tried to obtain a better option other than scrubs at backup QB? When have we ever developed a QB so that he's better? The only QB in Fox's tenure that has shown improvement and has potential to still continue to improve is Matt Moore. Anyone else we have obtained was poo undrafted QBs or crappy QBs from other teams that we thought could develop but we didn't. Who's fault is it for not putting the effort in getting a legit RELIABLE backup QB that didn't go to sh*t when we got him?

Fox went out and got David Carr, who was the last "big name" QB to hit free agency. Other than Drew Brees, what other QB has been available who made sense to draft or sign that is better than what we already have?

Do you want to go down the list of available free agents during Fox's tenure? Or would you like to go over those who we could have drafted and what we would have given up if we did? Or is it easier to lazily condemn those in charge for a fictitious lack of effort?

[thefuzz]

I was thinking about Thigpen and us taking a flyer on him yesterday.

Wonder if we could get him for a 4-5th rounder?