What does Gettleman do about Cam

[TheRed]

Yeah, we've heard the excuses a million times. That's why Gettleman would be smart to reserve his judgement for next year, when there's more clarity in what Cam brings to the team. Rankings-wise, Cam hasn't been very good. I don't think it matters much since our offense isn't geared for Newton to put up mind-blowing numbers. However, MHS is right in the fact that Cam is optimistically a top 10-15 quarterback. Over four years, we've still seen the glaring passing and decision-making issues, and can we realistically say that Cam is the leader of our offense, or its most valuable player? Simply, he's not worth 100m+. But, Gettleman may have to fork that over since it's hard to find a "decent" QB in the league nowadays on top of Newton's influence on local media, etc. 

 

The running QB issues are a real concern as well. As he ages, he must start playing in the pocket more, and he'll lose one facet of his unique arsenal (running). As a pocket passer, Cam must become more polished and consistent. Problems have been present ever since he entered the league, and last year, I thought he turned the corner. Unfortunately, he regressed this year. (I know, coaches, shitty WRs, injuries, etc.) I get it.

 

As of right now, he's not worth 100m+, but he'll get that contract for other reasons. When he led that comeback against NE last year, I thought he had "matured". He looked spectacular during the beginning of this season, truly remarkable, but that quickly faded. It's not that any of us "hate" Cam, it's simply that we find his lack of consistency and improvement over four years to be frustrating. This is a team discussion thread, and we are providing opinions on a specific player; no need for all the animosity. 

 

If all you got out of that was that I was making "excuses", then I think you should consider reading it one more time.

 

Accurately describing the situation with all the factors is not making excuses. I'm sorry if you don't like someone laying out all the facts of how the season played out, but that all happened. It doesn't absolve Newton of blame of some silly poo like that, but it all played a part.

 

This year he will actually have a full offseason to work on things and get some continuity with the rest of the offense. That will help tremendously.

[Swan]

If all you got out of that was that I was making "excuses", then I think you should consider reading it one more time.

 

Accurately describing the situation with all the factors is not making excuses. I'm sorry if you don't like someone laying out all the facts of how the season played out, but that all happened. It doesn't absolve Newton of blame of some silly poo like that, but it all played a part.

 

This year he will actually have a full offseason to work on things and get some continuity with the rest of the offense. That will help tremendously.

 

 

Yeah, they played a factor. Won't disagree with that, but I've read too many times around here that they are 100% of the reason Cam sucked. I apologize if that's not what you were implying; this is the internet, so sh*t gets jumbled up. 

 

I agree. This year, we'll receive more clarity on the issue once/if Gettleman upgrades the O and Cam gets healthy. I hope that next year, in the event that Cam doesn't improve, people don't use Shula as a scapegoat. Then, it would be too ridiculous.

[Carl Spackler]

If all you got out of that was that I was making "excuses", then I think you should consider reading it one more time.

 

Accurately describing the situation with all the factors is not making excuses. I'm sorry if you don't like someone laying out all the facts of how the season played out, but that all happened. It doesn't absolve Newton of blame of some silly poo like that, but it all played a part.

 

This year he will actually have a full offseason to work on things and get some continuity with the rest of the offense. That will help tremendously.

 

I wouldn't bother arguing with an idiot like him, anyway. Not only can he not see anything objectively regarding Cam, he's also from Texas.

[TheRed]

Yeah, they played a factor. Won't disagree with that, but I've read too many times around here that they are 100% of the reason Cam sucked. I apologize if that's not what you were implying; this is the internet, so sh*t gets jumbled up. 

 

I agree. This year, we'll receive more clarity on the issue once/if Gettleman upgrades the O and Cam gets healthy. I hope that next year, in the event that Cam doesn't improve, people don't use Shula as a scapegoat. Then, it would be too ridiculous.

 

I'm not sure what you're reading, but generally I've seen only maybe a few people who blame all that on his inconsistencies.

 

Most people seem to be able to recognize what occurred and apply sound logic in determining that while he needs to improve, other moving parts in our offense need to improve also. Our WR's have to start bringing down passes, and they have to be on the same page with routes.

 

I think Cam should consider visiting with Chris Weinke down at IMG Academy again, and bring the WR's along too.

 

One big thing we need to address in the offseason is speed. I think we could utilize fozzy more on screens, but we need another speedy receiver. I like Corey Brown, but he's going to need to bulk up some in the offseason, because right now he can't keep taking those hits.

 

We also need to figure out what to do at left tackle, Bell simply is not a starter, we need a mauler protecting our QB's blindside.

 

Shula should not be "the" scapegoat for our offense in 2014, but he didn't help at times. He has to improve his red zone playcalling, like now. When you have Cam Newton, Kelvin Benjamin, Greg Olsen, Jonathan Stewart, and Mike Tolbert, you should be able to score.

[tiger7_88]

And that's just it in a nutshell.

 

Some people don't think rationally about how hard it is to find an upper tier QB in this league. Maybe Cam is in the top 5 in a year or so, or maybe he stays in the 5 to 12 range. Either way, those guys are very hard to find. 

 

Look at who's left in the playoffs. Brady, Rodgers, Wilson and Luck. Guys like that don't grow on trees. Maybe Cam belongs in that group or maybe he is somewhere outside of it. But he's someone to build around, and someone we can win with. 

 

The whole argument of "well, we're going to play hardball and if he doesn't sign, we'll just trade him away for picks and find our next QB" is incredibly naive. We'll end up with the next RGIII or Geno Smith or we'll go the vet route and end up with what Tampa had this year. 

 

Is that really what you want?

 

The sad thing is, yes, that is what many of them want.

 

They'd rather have uncertainty and losses with the QB whose style/appearance THEY prefer than to win with the guy that they chose to hate for irrational reasons long, long ago.

[teeray]

Great question. I think you have to factor in Cam's upside into the equation. I also think that, if he has not progressed as much as you would like in 4 seasons, it may be time to get a more effective QB coach. I am not blaming the QB coach, however, I am simply making adjustments to get the most out of my investment. If I were GM, I would offer Cam a deal in the $18 per year range for five seasons. I feel that Cam and Co will want over $20. To reach that amount, however, there would be incentive clauses in it. Then I would only guarantee about $40 million. This is not my area (others are smarter about contract structure and comparable contracts, but I really think a running QB carries more risk than one that doesn't in the NFL, and I think a pocket-passing QB carries more value in the NFL because WR timing and linemen are more in tune with the QB's proximity. Timing is everything. I think most coaches, WRs, and OL prefer a pocket passer who can run, not a runner who can throw from the pocket. Cam has the potential to change into that and the physical talent to become great at it, but he has not shown the growth they hoped for, in my opinion, which is why Gettlemen and RR are talking about his inconsistent behavior.

Many people on here say stupid crap like, "If you don't pay him $25m, he will go free agent and somebody will." Sure they will. There are desperate teams that overpay. But Gettlemen is building a team geared toward winning on a regular basis, and you do not do that by overpaying. Cam is NOT a $20m per season player. If you take the average salary at his position, and he has been about average in terms of production, then you see where his real market value is. However, there are some variables that you must consider:

1. He has either been involved in a lockout (year 1) or recovering from surgery (year 4) during 50% of the offseasons. The Cam fans have not mentioned that, but it is huge. On both occasions, he was not familiar with any WR he would be throwing to.

2. He has had some issues on the OL. Maybe these caused him to develop bad habits, but habits are formed through repetition. Unless he is practicing these same bad habits, I do not see how 20 throws per week would cause that. Still, he has attempted to stay in the pocket and transform, but the OL has been inconsistent. This is a variable to consider, not an excuse for bad play.

3. His WRs have always been below average. However, timing is everything, A WR drops passes and passes are overthrown a lot when that happens. Cam has more unforced overthrows than drops or throwaway passes, so blaming them for all things bad about Cam is stupid. Look what Lafell and Smith did in systems where timing is perfected and the QB is a pocket passer. Both increased production by about 30-40%. That is a huge difference.

Gettlemen will argue that if you have to bring in an elite OL, an elite backfield, and an elite WR corps, how much can you afford to pay a qb who needs studs all around him to be successful? Cam fans are stupid if they blame these things and then insist Cam is worth a megadeal with guaranteed $$. If that happens, can Cam win shootouts? Because we would not be able to pay our DL or LBs. That is called Math.

I have a question for you, and I really want you to objectively consider the answer.

Q: If Gettlemen thinks giving Cam Newton a huge deal that is largely guaranteed is the only way to keep him here, does he do it?

I don't think he would. I think he tags Cam until he finds a QB. Or, even more drastic, he takes the $20m and invests it in other players and finds a QB in a year or two. I assure you that he has peeked at the QB crop in next year's draft. It looks to be a good one. Then there is the fact that he has a backup who was 2-0 last year with the same players Cam had to go 5-8-1. Sure, it was Tampa Bay, but you could then argue that Anderson rarely works with the first team in practice. Is the difference between Anderson and Newton worth $20m? I am just thinking out loud as I guess he might.

Many people here thing the contract for Cam is a gimme, that we should give him the debit card and move on. They do not know Dave Gettlemen, who was hired because he is the Anit-Hurney.

You keep acting like Cam hasn't been successful.

You keep implying that Cam has been straight garbage or something.

What most of us are saying about o-line issues and WR issues is that they are needed to make the offense successful. Not just Cam Newton. These issues would apply if anyone else was playing QB and would hinder our offensive production.

[tiger7_88]

Wouldn't surprise me if most of these wannabe billionaires who are clamoring for Cam to be paid whatever he wants are shopping at the Dollar Store because Walmart is too expensive.

 

Doze straw-men doe...

[TheRed]

I assure you that he has peeked at the QB crop in next year's draft.  It looks to be a good one.  Then there is the fact that he has a backup who was 2-0 last year with the same players Cam had to go 5-8-1.  Sure, it was Tampa Bay, but you could then argue that Anderson rarely works with the first team in practice.  Is the difference between Anderson and Newton worth $20m?  I am just thinking out loud as I guess he might.

 

So you've talked to Dave Gettleman personally about potential draft prospects? That's interesting, please, do tell us more.

 

Yes MHS, Gettleman believes that the gap between Anderson and Newton is so slim that one of his first key offseason moves in 2014 was to pick up Newton's fifth year option for 2015, guaranteeing him nearly $15 million for one season. Did you even read that before hitting post?

[WOW!!]

"Hate" is a strong word. I'll assume you're a "hugger".

I like that better then slurper..

[AceBoogie]

Look the Cam hate boils down to 2 things.

1. "He beat my college team and stole a laptop so he's a thug"

And

2. I'm not allowed to say because of certain mods that get too sensitive.

[WOW!!]

Look the Cam hate boils down to 2 things.

1. "He beat my college team and stole a laptop so he's a thug"

And

2. I'm not allowed to say because of certain mods that get too sensitive.

You get use to it after a while. But you start to realize they only hate good players.

Nobody hates on Gabbert.

[Squirrel]

You get use to it after a while. But you start to realize they only hate good players.

Nobody hates on Gabbert.

 

Didn't know Gabbert plays for the Panthers.

[teeray]

Didn't know Gabbert plays for the Panthers.

Some of the same people in this thread telling us what smart GMs would do were the same ones who swore Gabbert was better prospect than Cam 4 years ago.

So if it were up to them he would be.

[NanuqoftheNorth]

Lots of students from the Hurney School of Management in this thread.

Relax fellas Cam will be rewarded handsomely for his efforts