shula is a symptom, not the disease

[Professor Queso]

I'm a strong advocate for replacing Shula as OC at the end of the season and bringing in somebody that will design an offense around our strengths, in particular Cam's strengths. It's time to accept we are a pass first team. While I agree with many point's made in this thread the underlying factor is because of Big Cat we will always have that retro flare to our team and Shula embodies retro. Using his father's 1970's play style is no longer effective and it's time to move into the modern age. The read option, or lack thereof.. is not enough.  

[Jeremy Igo]

It's time to accept we are a pass first team.

 

....with zero NFL caliber tackles.

 

 

 

Someone pour me a whiskey.

[Mr. Scot]

I wouldn't characterize George Shinn as a bad owner, but he was a horny and dishonest bastard in the end.

 

And I don't see JR being that active in running the team.  He obviously cares about winning over money, as his GMs have always paid to the extent of the cap.  He fired his kids because he didn't like the way they were doing things.  But on the other hand, he has sent a message of "be loyal" to his GMs, which has resulted in a lot of players being kept past their prime and large contracts intended to keep players here for the remainder of their careers.  I think that we can agree on that.

 

In the past three years, we've seen Gamble, Gross, and Smitty treated like guys off the street by the new GM.  These are the best at their positions the franchise has ever seen.  While I have not been happy with that, it sort of puts the whole "loyal to a fault" idea to bed.  Richardson hired Gettleman and has clearly stepped back and given him the freedom to do his job.

 

So yeah, Shula may be a symptom of something, but it's not of a bad owner.  

 

I don't wanna take away from a really good post, Jag, but was that what you meant to say?

 

(autocorrect claims another victim?)

[Nick_81]

We will only get a new OC when Rivera is no longer the head coach.

 

 

I don't see him firing his own guys.

What about Ramsdell?  Multiple people around the league have stated that he's one of the best offensive minds in the game.  The guy has coached QB's, WR's, RB's, and TE's with great success. What exactly was he hired for?  I understand he's "senior offensive assistant," but do you have any idea how he influences the offense?  My assumption was that he's Shula's eventual replacement as OC...

[Cyberjag]

So actually, I'm kind of curious.  Does anyone out there think that Shula was hired at JR's urging?  IIRC, he got the job because of the work he did with Cam in his rookie year as the QB coach.  Prior to that, we had Chud, who wasn't anyone's idea of a conservative playcaller.

 

Rivera is a defensive-minded coach.  As such, he's going to want to slow the game down on offense and limit turnovers.  That's pretty much what most defensive minded coaches do.  And yes, JR likes them--all four of our HCs to date have been ex-DCs.  But that's seriously the extent of it as far as JR's concerned, he's not out there hiring coordinators or telling Rivera to slow things down or asking Shula to make sure the entire play clock is used before the ball is hiked.  

 

I'm really wondering just what Fiz is thinking that JR does, other than show a preference for DCs when he approves coaching hires.

[Jeremy Igo]

What about Ramsdell?  Multiple people around the league have stated that he's one of the best offensive minds in the game.  The guy has coached QB's, WR's, RB's, and TE's with great success. What exactly was he hired for?  I understand he's "senior offensive assistant," but do you have any idea how he influences the offense?  My assumption was that he's Shula's eventual replacement as OC...

 

No one I have spoken to can say what he does. The only time I have seen him do anything is with Ken Dorsey and the QBs. He seems to be more of a mentor for Dorsey, who the Panthers are very high on, than anything.

[Cyberjag]

I don't wanna take away from a really good post, Jag, but was that what you meant to say?

 

(autocorrect claims another victim?)

 

Shinn had the keys to the city until his sex scandals caught up with him.  He was having affairs with cheerleaders and one woman accused him of kidnapping her and forcing her to have sex with him.  And when he left for New Orleans, it was in violation of league rules--it later came out that they helped cook the books on how many season tickets they had sold down there. 

 

So yeah, no autocorrect needed.  Shinn was a good OWNER in that he let his GMs and coaches do their respective jobs, and the Hornets had a pretty good history for a small market expansion team.  As a person, not so much.

[Mr. Scot]

No one I have spoken to can say what he does. The only time I have seen him do anything is with Ken Dorsey and the QBs. He seems to be more of a mentor for Dorsey, who the Panthers are very high on, than anything.

 

'Consultant' job descriptions can generally be whatever the team wants them to be, so that's possible.

 

Bruce DeHaven might play the same role for Richard Rodgers.

 

 

So actually, I'm kind of curious.  Does anyone out there think that Shula was hired at JR's urging?  IIRC, he got the job because of the work he did with Cam in his rookie year as the QB coach.  Prior to that, we had Chud, who wasn't anyone's idea of a conservative playcaller.

 

Rivera is a defensive-minded coach.  As such, he's going to want to slow the game down on offense and limit turnovers.  That's pretty much what most defensive minded coaches do.  And yes, JR likes them--all four of our HCs to date have been ex-DCs.  But that's seriously the extent of it as far as JR's concerned, he's not out there hiring coordinators or telling Rivera to slow things down or asking Shula to make sure the entire play clock is used before the ball is hiked.  

 

I'm really wondering just what Fiz is thinking that JR does, other than show a preference for DCs when he approves coaching hires.

 

Story was that Cam endorsed Shula and Rivera decided continuity was best.

 

Honestly, given Rivera's personality and Hue Jackson's personality, I'm not terribly shocked they didn't go that route.

 

I could have sworn there was a third candidate but I forget who it was.  I'm think he was a WCO guy, though.

 

[Professor Queso]

....with zero NFL caliber tackles.

 

 

 

Someone pour me a whiskey.

 

 

Haha your gonna need a double man because your exactly right. We can dream about the prospect of having an elite aerial attack .

[Nick_81]

No one I have spoken to can say what he does. The only time I have seen him do anything is with Ken Dorsey and the QBs. He seems to be more of a mentor for Dorsey, who the Panthers are very high on, than anything.

Well that's refreshing.  We hired a QB coach... coach.  

 

You'd think with the background, and success, the guy's had, we'd be utilizing him a little better.  Of course, I'm not "inside" and don't really know...

[Professor Queso]

*only dream

[Mr. Scot]

Shinn had the keys to the city until his sex scandals caught up with him.  He was having affairs with cheerleaders and one woman accused him of kidnapping her and forcing her to have sex with him.  And when he left for New Orleans, it was in violation of league rules--it later came out that they helped cook the books on how many season tickets they had sold down there. 

 

So yeah, no autocorrect needed.  Shinn was a good OWNER in that he let his GMs and coaches do their respective jobs, and the Hornets had a pretty good history for a small market expansion team.  As a person, not so much.

 

Aaahhh, gotcha.  My mistake, then.

 

I don't follow basketball that closely so I wasn't aware of the sex scandals

 

[Jangler]

need more cowbell

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

sorry, but somebody had to say it.

[Cyberjag]

Ok, I went back and re-read the original post.  I think that the entire essence of it can be captured right here:

 

alright im drinking by myself