Two Tight End Sets - By the Numbers

[t96]

What is the fascination with two tight end sets?

 

 

Memories of Shockey and Olsen mainly.

 

Also to help out our patchwork line in protection.

[IamSoClutch]

Gotta remember, Chud was a fantasy guru in the mold of Norv Turner.

Shula is a nobody guru in the mold of that guy who chooses "ask madden" when he plays.

[CoastalCat]

Here is the breakdown of the two tight end sets against Pittsburgh on Sunday night.

 

Number of total offensive plays: 62

 

Greg Olsen snaps: 62

Ed Dickson snaps: 23

 

(Richie Brockel had 6 snaps but he is more of an H-Back, filling in at fullback from time to time on running downs.)

 

Obviously Greg played every down. So the snaps Ed Dickson played were two tight end sets. Looking at these numbers we can see the Panthers ran a two tight end set 37% of the time.

 

So lets break down that 37% into running and passing.

 

Total running plays with two tight ends: 7

Total passing plays with two tight ends: 16

Total passing plays with at least one tight end pass blocking: 6

Total passing plays with two tight ends running routes: 10

 

So passing plays featuring two capable tight ends in Greg Olsen and Ed Dickson both running routes happened in 16% of the total offensive snaps.

 

Questions:

 

Should Shula be calling more plays with the tight ends down field? Against a 3-4 defense, these tight ends are matched up against larger, slower backers frequently.

 

Is the Panthers offensive line capable of adequate protection without help from at least one tight end?

 

I was hoping for some sort of progress statistic at the end of all that. Now that we have a breakdown of how often they run certain formations, what works and what doesn't? 

[Udogg]

I think both your questions hinder on the question of whether the line can hold up well enough.   Of the pressures on the QB a lot are not physical mismatch issues, they are blocking assignment issue.   Not sure if this is a bad play design or just bad play.

 

Should Shula be calling more plays with the tight ends down field? Against a 3-4 defense, these tight ends are matched up against larger, slower backers frequently.

If down field means 10-20 yard range, then I don't know.    Depends on what set.  Out of the shotgun, the last 2 games there is no  respect of our PA.  LB's aren't stepping up at all. They are sitting at that 5 to 7 yard depth and not moving. Couple that with our O-line not blocking and people dropping 8 into coverage(seems to be used a lot with Cam) or blitzing 5  I don't think calling more plays to the TE are going to be effective.  Doesn't matter what set, when we block well we play well.

 

Is the Panthers offensive line capable of adequate protection without help from at least one tight end?

Pittsburgh lined up wide on 3 rusher downs to isolate either Silatolu or Chandler consistently getting pressure. 

Our RB's who were the checkdown on a lot of plays never released because they stayed in all night to help.  Pittsburgh delayed blitzed if they didn't realease.

Kalil released people like he had inside help when he didn't.  Bell played outside speed rush like he was going to get help inside, which he didn't have.

Chandler was getting owned consistently with power rushes.  He got a lot of chip help end of 3rd going into 4th quarter.

Amini looks clueless at times pass blocking.  He got bull rushed by linebackers,  he got speed rushed by ends.

Add to that, none of our RB's blocked very well.  Even the ones like Brockel who's only job is to block.

 

 

 

 

[Ivan The Awesome]

Swole Bones needs to get a shot. Dickson isn't cutting it.

[igor]

our problem is byron bell , everyone else is ok but bell is holding us back 

[Carolina Cajun]

our problem is byron bell , everyone else is ok but bell is holding us back 

 

Not true, Bell isn't great, but he's not the only weak part of our line.  Turner is not playing well at all, Amini is playing poorly, Khalil isn't even playing up to specs.  This on top of the play calling isn't cutting it, there's a lot wrong with our line play and that doesn't just fall on 1 player.

[Growl]

I think this is yet another case of Shula not understanding what his strengths and weaknesses are (which, btw, is his real problem and not the slew of stupid things the Huddle has fabricated)

Two TE sets would do some much for this offense, and if Dickson isn't capable of being the other guy, then get Brandon Williams out there.

[pstall]

Didn't Pitt get the most sacks they have had so far this year?

I think the 2 te set can be effective but its where and when you use it.

Also what gets overlooked is the play BEFORE the formation. Meaning is it disguised at all or is it in obvious passing situations?