Ian Rappaport:J.Graham appeals decision

[PandaPancake]

You're right! Maybe it was one of the other Saints fans commenting in the thread! Oh wait... We both know who you were talking to, but the I wasn't even talking about you act is cute.

I explained it a few posts up if you'd care to look. Thanks for adding to the discussion though!

So defensive for someone who just wants to talk football. You're very good at making excuses. Do you work in upper management or perhaps public relations?

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[saints4life25]

This. Saints fans want to act like Loomis is infallible, but the Saints weren't poo until they lucked into Brees in free agency who most of the league had written off as having a bum shoulder. It's hard to fug up when you have a franchise QB. The rubber meets the road when you have to replace one. We'll find out what Loomis is made of in the coming years.

In Hurney's defense, he never had a true franchise QB and many of his bad contracts were players who had their careers derailed by injury.

Meh. We've gotten off topic. The Saints did get a little lucky with Brees, but it's not like they just threw a bunch of money up and hoped. They trusted their doctors and Brees doctors and it worked out. They get some credit too.

[saints4life25]

So defensive for someone who just wants to talk football. You're very good at making excuses. Do you work in upper management or perhaps public relations?

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Self employed. It's made me a good bull*******. ;)

[panthers55]

We were in cap hell before the draft, remember? Then BAM we signed Byrd and your god promptly abandoned you. Still, I guess it can't hurt to pray that JG holds out, or some team is dumb enough to trade 2 draft picks AND pay him north of 10 mil per year, or whatever.

Anyone who knows anything about current contracts knows that you can sign anyone to a cap friend contract in year 1.  That isn't the problem it is paying them in subsequent years.  Byrd costs 3 million this year, 10 million next year and 9.7 in 2016 and 10.5 in 2017.  Loomis did it with Brees last year and is doing it across the board.  Trying to find the missing pieces to make one last run before they collapse under the weight of the salary cap.

Saints have 141 committed to the cap in 2015 without Graham, rookies and any free agents added.  

[saints4life25]

The only way to keep Brees from having a 26 million cap in 2015 is to restructure which isn't anything but backloading the contract even more than now. That is the problem here, If you keep backloading contracts by pushing money to later years you build up more dead money and you keep paying for nothing in subsequent years.

If Brees gets restructured you are just guaranteeing he isn't your quarterback for more than 1 or 2 years at the most. You can't just ignore the money or keep pushing it out. Otherwise his cap hit will reach 30 million or more in a few years.

As for Evans and Colston you either pay them 20 million in 2015 or you pay 10 million in dead money and don't have either of them. Or you do what I told you they were doing which is through restructure backloading the contracts even more and pushing more money into later years.

Yeah like I said, you can keep trying to manipulate the numbers but sooner or later you have to pay the price.

First of all the Saints are in cap hell and just because they signed Byrd to a cap friendly deal in 2014 and will do the same to Graham as well won't change that they can't afford to keep paying the money. Byrd counts 3 this year and 10 next. Graham will likely not cost more than the 7 million this year but it will go up to 12-14 next year. That is an increase of likely 15 million which when you add to Brees contract will add 20 million or more to the cap with those 3 alone.

The Saints keep acting like they can do what other teams can't and not pay the price, but then again they thought they could do that with bountygate as well. Problem is that you have to pay the price sooner or later. Bottomline is Loomis is just delaying the inevitable.

We're just going to keep argueing about something that we won't have a definitive answer on for a few more years. If the Saints end up in cap hell (whatever that is) you were right and get to say I told you so. But at the end of the day, if going all in brings a Lombardi, who cares?

[LinvilleGorge]

Meh. We've gotten off topic. The Saints did get a little lucky with Brees, but it's not like they just threw a bunch of money up and hoped. They trusted their doctors and Brees doctors and it worked out. They get some credit too.

 

The Saints medical staff deserves most of the credit.  Dude was heading to Miami until the Miami medical staff wouldn't sign off on it.

[saints4life25]

Anyone who knows anything about current contracts knows that you can sign anyone to a cap friend contract in year 1. That isn't the problem it is paying them in subsequent years. Byrd costs 3 million this year, 10 million next year and 9.7 in 2016 and 10.5 in 2017. Loomis did it with Brees last year and is doing it across the board. Trying to find the missing pieces to make one last run before they collapse under the weight of the salary cap.

Saints have 141 committed to the cap in 2015 without Graham, rookies and any free agents added.

But Byrd signed a deal for 9 million a year, so is it really such a big deal for his cap hit to be 10 million a couple of years instead of 9? And for the record, the last two years of his deal have hardly any guaranteed money and large roster bonuses, meaning he'll either be worth it and stay around or he won't an he'll be cut.

[saints4life25]

But Byrd signed a deal for 9 million a year, so is it really such a big deal for his cap hit to be 10 million a couple of years instead of 9? And for the record, the last two years of his deal have hardly any guaranteed money and large roster bonuses, meaning he'll either be worth it and stay around or he won't an he'll be cut.

Last 2 years have large base salaries and hardly any guaranteed money. Got mixed up, sorry.

[Bodybag]

Isn't the cap supposed to get substantial bumps over the next few years?

[panthers55]

We're just going to keep argueing about something that we won't have a definitive answer on for a few more years. If the Saints end up in cap hell (whatever that is) you were right and get to say I told you so. But at the end of the day, if going all in brings a Lombardi, who cares?

the answer is already clear.  They are in cap hell and just manipulating the numbers as long as they can.  I saw it happen to the 49ers with DeBartolo and with the redskins several years ago, etc.  The difference is that I can see where things are going based on the past while others like you don't have that perspective.

 

The saints are not going to get another Lombardi anytime soon.  They can't play on the road well enough to win it all.  Truth is they are no longer the best team in the division let alone all of football. 

[PandaPancake]

Isn't the cap supposed to get substantial bumps over the next few years?

I believe so, sir.

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[panthers55]

Isn't the cap supposed to get substantial bumps over the next few years?

Any cap bump is also just carte blanche for players to ask for more money or to get it from someone else.  Right now the supposed cap bump next year to 140 million still won't cover the 141 the saints already have committed not including Graham. their rookies and any free agents.  They also have little to no carryover money due to being so close to the cap this year.

[saints4life25]

The saints are not going to get another Lombardi anytime soon. They can't play on the road well enough to win it all. Truth is they are no longer the best team in the division let alone all of football.

We shall see, good sir! Thanks for the discussion.

[Bodybag]

Payton's record on the road is actually quite good.