Vince Young will be in the Hall of Fame

[Guild]

KT no one is paranoid that black QBs might be great. No one outside of some redneck hicks really cares much one way or the other what race someone is quarterback or no.

I think you are just stuck in the 20th century.

[King Taharqa]

I think yall are in denial. Black QBs are judged and viewed differently than white QBs. As shown by this thread, for black QBs JUST WINNING isnt enough. Thats a fact. White QBs are the most desired in this game sometimes even irregardless of talent. Thats a fact. Within the next few weeks Vince Young WILL lose a game. And when he does, best believe people will come out the woodworks to microanalyze why he lost and why he cost his team the game. Vince wins his way, just because it aint the same way as a Drew Brees or a Phillip Rivers or a Peyton Manning dont mean it aint effective or shouldnt be apart of this sport. I love this game of football. I love the NFL. I love that Jerry Richardson had a dream. I love this website that Zod has created for us and all the times we've shared and views we've expressed. If you listen to anything Ive ever written on this message board. Hear me when I tell you, the NFL culture has a problem. And it needs to look in the mirror very closely and be honest with itself when it comes to the history of the black quarterback. All these guys, Vince, Donovan, the Randalls, the Doug Williams, the McNairs, even Vick. These guys are fighting for something bigger than just the game of football.

[Guild]

Hmmm, I think even white QBs who do bad but still win are going to be complained about.

You're right JUST winning isn't enough. White, black, purple, or green a QB needs to execute and use his brain effectively.

[pstall]

Once again. No measurable way of determing fair scrutiny.

This argument could be the same for calling the media liberal. To the beholder they want so bad to be right in their judgement.

But because there is nothing tangible to latch on to, they are always justified because it can't be disproven.

I had a buddy who was made when James Brown died that he didn't get fair or enough coverage.

I asked a simple question. How much coverage would the networks need to do to be considered enough? Uhh..I don't know.

The tail chasing is sad because the tail chaser doesn't even know it.

[dimbee]

Don't forget Warren Moon, KT, the best of em all

[KillerKat]

I think yall are in denial. Black QBs are judged and viewed differently than white QBs. As shown by this thread, for black QBs JUST WINNING isnt enough. Thats a fact. White QBs are the most desired in this game sometimes even irregardless of talent. Thats a fact. Within the next few weeks Vince Young WILL lose a game. And when he does, best believe people will come out the woodworks to microanalyze why he lost and why he cost his team the game. Vince wins his way, just because it aint the same way as a Drew Brees or a Phillip Rivers or a Peyton Manning dont mean it aint effective or shouldnt be apart of this sport. I love this game of football. I love the NFL. I love that Jerry Richardson had a dream. I love this website that Zod has created for us and all the times we've shared and views we've expressed. If you listen to anything Ive ever written on this message board. Hear me when I tell you, the NFL culture has a problem. And it needs to look in the mirror very closely and be honest with itself when it comes to the history of the black quarterback. All these guys, Vince, Donovan, the Randalls, the Doug Williams, the McNairs, even Vick. These guys are fighting for something bigger than just the game of football.

Ever stop and think that white QBs get scrutinized too? Did it ever occur to you that Young basically sucked until this year? The only question now is can he keep playing like this? Some QBs just get critised cause they simply suck, regardless of color. Of the guys you mentioned:

Vince: sucked untill this year

Donovan: always considered top 3-5

Randall: was great

Doug Williams: he was an average QB

McNair: was a really good QB

Vick: just plain sucks

There have been plenty of white QBs that get called out because they suck. Even they too get treated unfairly by the fans. It's not just a black thing. If they suck, they suck. If they're good, they're good. It doesn't matter about color in this day and age.

[King Taharqa]

Ever stop and think that white QBs get scrutinized too?

I pointed out earlier in the thread there are white QBs who are scrutinized. We're not talking about them. We're talking about the top 5-6 who arent, who are believed to be Jesus Christ and are not under the immediate pressure to win like black QBs. For instance last year, Drew Brees' Saints did not perform well and finished at 8-8. Was there ever a point in the year when the talking heads questioned Brees toughness to lead? Did people put the Saints lousy record on Brees head? Or did people dickride him for "almost" breaking an irrelevent passing record. You see, Donovan McNabb dont get that kinda pass, he has to win no matter what. No one's gonna be celebrating him getting some passing record if the Eagles flop. And people still called Brees one of the best QBs in the league.

Did it ever occur to you that Young basically sucked until this year?

How do you "basically suck" at QB and you've won 60% of your starts, have been to a pro bowl, have led your team to the playoffs, and have a Rookie Of The Year award? If you're white and you do all that, then you're Matt Ryan. A promising young QB who's good for the league and is no question an NFL caliber QB. If you're black, then you still need to prove your QB or as you put it earlier in this thread KillerKat "dont even deserve a roster spot". :rolleye: 3 months ago 90% of you were telling me Matt Moore is better and has a more promising career than Vince Young.

Vince: sucked untill this year

see above.

Donovan: always considered top 3-5

Not true. Some dont even consider him that NOW. He was booed the day he was drafted and has always been underappreciated by the Philly fanbase. Even when Allen Iverson was in town, he was more loved and appreciated than McNabb has ever been. He still doesnt get as much props as some white QBs who've done half as much as him.

Randall: was great

Got criticized just like Vick when he played for using his athletic gifts. Never gets the credit he deserves as a passer.

Doug Williams: he was an average QB

...that won a Super Bowl and led a pooty Tampa franchise that had never won nothing to the playoffs early in his career.

McNair: was a really good QB

agreed.

Vick: just plain sucks

Blind hatred. Another QB who's won the vast majority of his games, been to 3 pro bowls, beat our franchise 6 times (including 5 in a row). He took a pooty Falcons franchise farther than Matt Ryan will and is still a bigger star than him even as a 3rd string backup for the Eagles.

There have been plenty of white QBs that get called out because they suck. Even they too get treated unfairly by the fans. It's not just a black thing. If they suck, they suck. If they're good, they're good. It doesn't matter about color in this day and age.

You guys keep dodging that fuschia elephant you see. We aint talking about the white QBs that suck. We're talking about the ones who get blown. Peyton, Drew, Carson, Tom, Phillip, Ben. The ones who are seen as gods. The ones that we want to act like there's no way a Donovan McNabb or David Garrard or Michael Vick or a Vince Young could even be as good. I dont defend black QBs that suck. You dont see me in hear barking about JaMarcus Russell or Jason Campbell or Quincy Carter. I stand up for the ones who are good and make plays yet still get pooted on cuz people want to keep white QBs on this bullpoo ass imaginary pedestal.

[PhillyB]

the day KT gets outraged at the pitiful number of white guys playing the DB position in the NFL, i will start to listen to what he has to say.

[King Taharqa]

the day KT gets outraged at the pitiful number of white guys playing the DB position in the NFL, i will start to listen to what he has to say.

DB is not the most important position on the football field, and its that lack of white guys playing a skill position like DB or RB that has so many so overprotective of them playing the starring role on the football field, QB. So thanks for proving my point PhillyB.

[Brandon]

KT, at what percentage of black QB's starting in football will you be happy?

[Guild]

DB is not the most important position on the football field, and its that lack of white guys playing a skill position like DB or RB that has so many so overprotective of them playing the starring role on the football field, QB. So thanks for proving my point PhillyB.

So you don't see what he is really saying?

[X-Clown]

KT, you can't have it both ways. You prop up Vick and Young because of their winning percentages and because of Vick's playoff wins several years ago, but have been calling Delhomme a cancer for years even though he's won 60% of his starts as a Panther and more playoff games then both of them combined. Then when you criticize Delhomme, you throw out stats, but claim that they are not as important when evaluating Vick and Young because they win and - yet Brees' stats aren't impressive because his team went 8-8. Which is it?

Moral of the story - it's a team game, you can't just give the QB credit for the team's wins.

[Dingo_ate_Babies]

a black guy complaining?

damns that rare

[OneBadassCat]

I pointed out earlier in the thread there are white QBs who are scrutinized. We're not talking about them. We're talking about the top 5-6 who arent, who are believed to be Jesus Christ and are not under the immediate pressure to win like black QBs. For instance last year, Drew Brees' Saints did not perform well and finished at 8-8. Was there ever a point in the year when the talking heads questioned Brees toughness to lead? Did people put the Saints lousy record on Brees head? Or did people dickride him for "almost" breaking an irrelevent passing record. You see, Donovan McNabb dont get that kinda pass, he has to win no matter what. No one's gonna be celebrating him getting some passing record if the Eagles flop. And people still called Brees one of the best QBs in the league.

How do you "basically suck" at QB and you've won 60% of your starts, have been to a pro bowl, have led your team to the playoffs, and have a Rookie Of The Year award? If you're white and you do all that, then you're Matt Ryan. A promising young QB who's good for the league and is no question an NFL caliber QB. If you're black, then you still need to prove your QB or as you put it earlier in this thread KillerKat "dont even deserve a roster spot". :rolleye: 3 months ago 90% of you were telling me Matt Moore is better and has a more promising career than Vince Young.

see above.

Not true. Some dont even consider him that NOW. He was booed the day he was drafted and has always been underappreciated by the Philly fanbase. Even when Allen Iverson was in town, he was more loved and appreciated than McNabb has ever been. He still doesnt get as much props as some white QBs who've done half as much as him.

Got criticized just like Vick when he played for using his athletic gifts. Never gets the credit he deserves as a passer.

...that won a Super Bowl and led a pooty Tampa franchise that had never won nothing to the playoffs early in his career.

agreed.

Blind hatred. Another QB who's won the vast majority of his games, been to 3 pro bowls, beat our franchise 6 times (including 5 in a row). He took a pooty Falcons franchise farther than Matt Ryan will and is still a bigger star than him even as a 3rd string backup for the Eagles.

You guys keep dodging that fuschia elephant you see. We aint talking about the white QBs that suck. We're talking about the ones who get blown. Peyton, Drew, Carson, Tom, Phillip, Ben. The ones who are seen as gods. The ones that we want to act like there's no way a Donovan McNabb or David Garrard or Michael Vick or a Vince Young could even be as good. I dont defend black QBs that suck. You dont see me in hear barking about JaMarcus Russell or Jason Campbell or Quincy Carter. I stand up for the ones who are good and make plays yet still get pooted on cuz people want to keep white QBs on this bullpoo ass imaginary pedestal.

Man that's like saying Jake Delhomme is good just because we win in spite of him. Just because your team wins doesn't you mean you played good enough to win. Plenty of people respect McNabb hes a good QB. Micheal Vick was "good" because he could scramble but once contained he was below average at best. The mobile QBs have to be able to do what the pocket QBs can do. That's what makes their athletic ability dangerous. To able to stay in the pocket and make the right reads, audibles, etc, and if things still break down they are able scramble and make things happen. McNabb can do that, McNair did do that, Romo is kind of like that but he's a candyass.