Stewart healthy & moving well. Rivera's Party Line a Red Herring.

[TheRed]

"Don't use selective stats, but excuse me while I go ahead and do just that".

[TheRed]

I love me some Mike Tolbert, but at the end of the day he's a Fullback. He had 361 yards. Marshawn Lynch had more yards, and touchdowns (1,257 yards, 12 touchdowns) than Tolbert, and Deangelo Williams (1,204 yards, 8 touchdowns) combined last year.

[Rise of The Hive]

Hopefully we are on to something with the running game again.

[TheRed]

I love selective stats to try and make a point. Yes Wilson had 6 games of less than 200 yards.  He also had 10 games of over 200 yards and won 9 of those games.  Compare that with Cam who had 6 games of under 200 yards and again 10 games of over 200 yards. in those 6 games we won 4 of those.  Wilson had 2 games of 300 yards and 2 more over 250.  Compare that to Cam who had 1 game of over 300 yards and 2 more over 250 yards.    Wilson threw for 26 TDs with 1 game of 4 TDs and another 2 games with 3 passing TDs.

Cam threw 24 Tds with none of 4 and 3 games with 3 TDs.

 

So tell me again how Cam was relied on to carry the team and Wilson was not yet in almost every category they were almost equal

 

Amazing how you selective stats can prove anything you want.

 

Maybe you would learn something if you would not completely ignore facts when they are presented to you.

[PandaPancake]

Is anyone else amazed when they see Stew actually played in 6 games last season? Because it honestly felt more like 2.

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I won't post a pic of what I look like right now but just picture a child's face when you're trying to explain to them that a dime is worth more than a nickel.

I have never doubted Stewart (unlike some fans obsessed with cap figures) but he can only break and/or plow through so many defenders before being stuffed. Our OL has to do a much better job this year.

I kind of wonder if they'll try to get Stewart and Williams to take a pay cut like Godfrey did. If I was an aging running back having a job is better than hoping a team will pick me up. But then egos and agents get involved that leads to craziness

Sent from my XT1080 using CarolinaHuddle mobile app

[panthers55]

"Don't use selective stats, but excuse me while I go ahead and do just that".

What is good for the goose is good for the gander.

[panthers55]

Maybe you would learn something if you would not completely ignore facts when they are presented to you.

I didn't ignore them, I countered with my own facts which totally proved that Wilson was just as important to their offense as Cam was to ours.  I learn something everyday, like if I am in disagreement with you, I am on the right side of the argument,

[TheRed]

I didn't ignore them, I countered with my own facts which totally proved that Wilson was just as important to their offense as Cam was to ours.  I learn something everyday, like if I am in disagreement with you, I am on the right side of the argument,

 

So now Russell Wilson is just "important to the offense"? So much for him shouldering the whole load huh.

[panthers55]

I love me some Mike Tolbert, but at the end of the day he's a Fullback. He had 361 yards. Marshawn Lynch had more yards, and touchdowns (1,257 yards, 12 touchdowns) than Tolbert, and Deangelo Williams (1,204 yards, 8 touchdowns) combined last year.

  Lynch had 301 carries for 1257 yards and 12 TDs and a 4.2 average. He had 36 receptions for 313 yards and 2 TDs for a total production of 1570 yards and 14 TDs.

 

Combined Williams and Tolbert had 302 carries for 1204 yards and 8 rushing TDs and 53 receptions for 517 yards and 3 TDs for a total of 1721 yards and 11 TDs.

 

So what does it matter if they use one back and we use 2.  The production is still the same.  We use multiple backs and they use 1 primarily.  The run production is still similar. 

[panthers55]

So now Russell Wilson is just "important to the offense"? So much for him shouldering the whole load huh.

He shouldered the load as much as Cam did with almost identical stats.  Again do you have a point or just like to argue. You have gone a long way to prove absolutely nothing as all of their stats are very similar as was their significance to the team. Keep throwing stuff against the wall until something sticks.  Even blind pigs occasionally find an acorn or two.

[TheRed]

  Lynch had 301 carries for 1257 yards and 12 TDs and a 4.2 average. He had 36 receptions for 313 yards and 2 TDs for a total production of 1570 yards and 14 TDs.

 

Combined Williams and Tolbert had 302 carries for 1204 yards and 8 rushing TDs and 53 receptions for 517 yards and 3 TDs for a total of 1721 yards and 11 TDs.

 

So what does it matter if they use one back and we use 2.  The production is still the same.  We use multiple backs and they use 1 primarily.  The run production is still similar. 

 

I was speaking purely of the run game. The critical factor in this that you keep missing or flat out ignoring, is that if you take out Cam's scrambles, our rushing statistics and the overall outcome to the 2013 season itself will look drastically different, and not in a good way.

 

He shouldered the load as much as Cam did with almost identical stats.  Again do you have a point or just like to argue. You have gone a long way to prove absolutely nothing as all of their stats are very similar as was their significance to the team. Keep throwing stuff against the wall until something sticks.  Even blind pigs occasionally find an acorn or two.

 

I don't know how many different ways I can spell this out for you. It is more than just his overall rushing totals. Russell Wilson had 539 yards rushing, he had 4 games with 50 yards or more rushing, not one of those games was he the sole leading rusher.

 

That was not the case unfortunately with Cam Newton. With Stewart healthy again, hopefully that will change.

 

Now I've explained this to you twice, you just changed the subject the first time, so no I won't bother again after this.

[updownsigma]

I won't post a pic of what I look like right now but just picture a child's face when you're trying to explain to them that a dime is worth more than a nickel.

I kind of wonder if they'll try to get Stewart and Williams to take a pay cut like Godfrey did. If I was an aging running back having a job is better than hoping a team will pick me up. But then egos and agents get involved that leads to craziness

Sent from my XT1080 using CarolinaHuddle mobile app

 

So, exactly what part of my post was confusing to you?

[Mol3m4n]

I didn't ignore them, I countered with my own facts which totally proved that Wilson was just as important to their offense as Cam was to ours. I learn something everyday, like if I am in disagreement with you, I am on the right side of the argument,

You're ignoring a big point in this argument. Without Cam's drive saving 3rd and 4th down plays the running game would be obsolete. Without Cam then your stats would be hundreds of yards less than what they are. Look at dwill's ypc and then tell me that his numbers aren't skewed by long runs of 10 yards or more.

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[panthers55]

Wait, so Cam was the leader in first down runs by a wide margin?

 

Its almost as if this data supports what my eyes saw and the conclusions I drew.  Weird.

What you see is only part of the picture which is clarified by various statistics.  For example, Cam had 10 more first downs than Williams on almost 100 fewer carries which on face value would indicate he was much better.  However as I showed in an earlier post, Can had 20 opportunities for first downs on third down/fourth and and either 1 or 2 yards.  He had another 20 opportunities on third or fourth down and less than 5 yards.  You would expect him to convert a high percentage of these if all he did was approach the line and fall forward. Williams on the other had a total of 5 third/fourth down carries all year and 4 of those were from more than 6 yards.  Most of Williams first downs were when he had to convert from more than 6 yards for a first down.  He had 21 runs for more than 10 yards and almost 160 of his 200 carries were on first or second down and 10 yards to go.  I would say that converting 35 of his runs into first downs was pretty great given that he had very few short yardage opportunities.

Tolbert had 31 first downs and was given roughly 20 opportunities on third and fourth down and less than 4 yards.  he had 6 carries for over 10 yards and converted several passes into first downs throughout the year.

 

Was Cam more dynamic than Tolbert?  Yeah.  Was he much better than Williams, hard to compare since Cam was often given the ball on third and fourth and short while Williams had to earn most of his first downs from 10 yards away.  Additional Williams ran the ball with everyone loading the box while many of Cam's scrambles were on passing plays where the safeties and linebackers were in coverage and once he juked a linemen or two he had little resistance for 10 yards or more.

 

Again no disrespect to Cam as he was great but what you saw was only part of the picture which I have clarified with facts and numbers.