Okay I have 4.5 days to pass a drug test

[Happy Panther]

what would the difference be between a good salesmen who smokes weed and the alcoholic salesmen that has been with the company for years?

The best employee I ever had was a pot smoker. I think he occasionally even smoked up before work. For him weed is basically the perfect ADHD drug and made him more focused. He is killing it in a very high profile job right now and is in better shape than anyone I know.

 

There is a reason that we keep talking about the medicinal uses of marijuana. For some it is a very beneficial drug.

 

My other employee was a heavy drinker and I had to hold his hand through everything.

 

It is too bad that the stereotype still exists that anyone who uses marijuana is a stoner. Some are and some aren't

[Jase]

salesmen don't really do anything productive, so does it really matter if they smoke weed or not?

 

I'd rather hire a pothead who has never had a sales position at my company than a salesman that has never smoked pot.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

*shifts the conversational paradigm*

[Happy Panther]

 

 

 

 

Never said anything of the sort? Really?

How do you not see what I wrote is not what you wrote? Do I really have to explain this to you like a child?

[sharkkiller]

How do you not see what I wrote is not what you wrote? Do I really have to explain this to you like a child?

 

Yes please. This should be entertaining.

[sharkkiller]

The best employee I ever had was a pot smoker. I think he occasionally even smoked up before work. For him weed is basically the perfect ADHD drug and made him more focused. He is killing it in a very high profile job right now and is in better shape than anyone I know.

 

There is a reason that we keep talking about the medicinal uses of marijuana. For some it is a very beneficial drug.

 

My other employee was a heavy drinker and I had to hold his hand through everything.

 

It is too bad that the stereotype still exists that anyone who uses marijuana is a stoner. Some are and some aren't

 

 

And as a boss, you have the right to hire whoever you want.

 

This is where I think the disconnect in this conversation is.

 

It is not about whether an employee can be good while smoking pot, it is about the rules set down by the potential employer.

 

They do not want to hire someone who smokes pot, and that is their right as a potential employer. Cheating to get past the drug test is wrong. That is the entire point that I am trying to make. Period. I do not care about your ambiguous definition of morality. 

 

If I own a company and do not want to hire someone who smokes pot, I have that right, as it is illegal at a federal level. Just like if I do not want someone who drinks while they are working, I can fire them for being drunk at work. I cannot fire them for drinking while they are not at work, as it is not illegal to do so.

 

If I want to be more lenient and let someone work while they are high, guess what? I can do that too, because it is my company. 

 

I am not sure where the disconnect is in this conversation, but you are all acting like I am attacking pot smokers, when I am not. I am simply saying that if you want to work somewhere, then you should abide by the rules set forth by that company. 

[Happy Panther]

Yes please. This should be entertaining.

 

I'll try but you don't seem very sensible or open.

 

My argument is that many believe that a lie is not immoral if it is a beneficial lie. Some people argue that you take a utilitarian view and measure the cumulative benefit even if others are harmed but my measure is just the benefit.

 

I my example the hiring guy could benefit, 805 could benefit and it does me no harm. The last part is just an aside. Nowhere did I state that is the only measure. 

 

You somehow twisted that into my measure of morality being purely selfish.

 

So what you are saying is that if it is a benefit to you, it is OK to lie or cheat. 

 

 

Or are you looking at it from a selfish, me first, screw everybody else, until I am the one who gets screwed, then it is wrong, perspective?

 

 

Again I don't know how you made this jump. None of those two sentences are anywhere in what I wrote.

 

If you still don't have the capacity to understand understand then this discussion is over.

[sharkkiller]

I'll try but you don't seem very sensible or open.

 

My argument is that many believe that a lie is not immoral if it is a beneficial lie. Some people argue that you take a utilitarian view and measure the cumulative benefit even if others are harmed but my measure is just the benefit.

 

I my example the hiring guy could benefit, 805 could benefit and it does me no harm. The last part is just an aside. Nowhere did I state that is the only measure. 

 

You somehow twisted that into my measure of morality being purely selfish.

 

 

Again I don't know how you made this jump. None of those two sentences are anywhere in what I wrote.

 

If you still don't have the capacity to understand understand then this discussion is over.

 

 

I quoted your exact words. "Does not harm me in any way"

 

So jumping from that to selfishness is a big jump? Not sure how when you use the word "me" and do not seem (in your own statements) to care about the harm for anyone else, that it can be seen as anything other than selfish.

 

You did not clarify in your original statement that the measurement of harm was applicable to anyone but you, however you made a  point to say that as long as it did not harm you it was ok. 

 

If you are going to argue about something, be sure to present a complete argument, and if you don't then do not assume that the other person knows what you are thinking. I simply used your words to come to a logical conclusion about what you were trying to say. If I was wrong, then my apologies, but in what seems to be a trend in this thread, you jump straight to insults about someone's intelligence.

 

And if you read all of my posts, you will see that I am open, and reasonable. 

 

Let me say it one more time.....I DO NOT CARE IF SOMEONE SMOKES POT!!!!  Just don't cheat on a freaking drug test and then justify it by saying pot should be legal anyway. 

[Happy Panther]

 

 

They do not want to hire someone who smokes pot, and that is their right as a potential employer. Cheating to get past the drug test is wrong. That is the entire point that I am trying to make. Period. I do not care about your ambiguous definition of morality. 

 

What I have tried to point out to you is that there are different ways to measure morality. Yours is only one way and mine is another. 

 

Mine is based on idea's of Kant and is hardly ambiguous. Here is a link if you would like to learn something.

 

http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/kant-moral/

 

The fact that you say x is wrong period means you have no capacity to consider that there are alternative ways of viewing an issue.

 

If I have known this I would not have bothered trying to have intelligent discussion. Waste of time.

[Happy Panther]

I quoted your exact words. "Does not harm me in any way"

 

You are truly a moron.

 

Good day

[sharkkiller]

What I have tried to point out to you is that there are different ways to measure morality. Yours is only one way and mine is another. 

 

Mine is based on idea's of Kant and is hardly ambiguous. Here is a link if you would like to learn something.

 

http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/kant-moral/

 

The fact that you say x is wrong period means you have no capacity to consider that there are alternative ways of viewing an issue.

 

If I have known this I would not have bothered trying to have intelligent discussion. Waste of time.

 

 

Dude,

 

I did not say it was wrong. The company he wants to work for said it was wrong.  

 

Why is this even about you or me? Or Kant, or whoever. It is about the owner of a company setting a rule that should be followed if you want to work for that company. That is it. Period. Holy crap. 

[sharkkiller]

You are truly a moron.

 

Good day

 

You know what, I am not going to stoop to your level of immaturity. You obviously have the reading comprehension of a 6 year old, and are unable to see past your own ideology. 

 

You have no argument when someone points out your own words to you so you resort to name calling.

 

Typical.

[TheRed]

[thatlookseasy]

And as a boss, you have the right to hire whoever you want.

 

This is where I think the disconnect in this conversation is.

 

It is not about whether an employee can be good while smoking pot, it is about the rules set down by the potential employer.

 

They do not want to hire someone who smokes pot, and that is their right as a potential employer. Cheating to get past the drug test is wrong. That is the entire point that I am trying to make. Period. I do not care about your ambiguous definition of morality. 

 

If I own a company and do not want to hire someone who smokes pot, I have that right, as it is illegal at a federal level. Just like if I do not want someone who drinks while they are working, I can fire them for being drunk at work. I cannot fire them for drinking while they are not at work, as it is not illegal to do so.

 

If I want to be more lenient and let someone work while they are high, guess what? I can do that too, because it is my company. 

 

I am not sure where the disconnect is in this conversation, but you are all acting like I am attacking pot smokers, when I am not. I am simply saying that if you want to work somewhere, then you should abide by the rules set forth by that company. 

 

Well that goes back to my question earlier in the thread.  If I normally smoke pot every few days, then quit for a few weeks before I get tested, do you consider that cheating the test? 

 

If the entire point of the drug test is that "they do not want to hire someone who smokes pot," then clearly that would be cheating, right?

 

And if quitting before the test is not cheating, then the whole point of the drug test is to show you can stop smoking for a short period of time (which like I said earlier, makes drug tests silly and pointless)

[Happy Panther]

 

 

And if quitting before the test is not cheating, then the whole point of the drug test is to show you can stop smoking for a short period of time (which like I said earlier, makes drug tests silly and pointless)

 

The point of a drug test is to avoid hiring someone who will end up in rehab which costs the company time and money.

 

Unfortunately they are testing the wrong drugs.