MHS831

Personally, I understand the concerns about Jones, but statistically, he has not disappointed and he is supposedly a fast processor and has a quick release. His average per attempt is higher than some of the players you/we covet more. She is not saying he sucks do not even think about it, she is saying (if I understand correctly) that she has concerns. I am not as concerned, but I am not saying any QB is going to be trash and I am not crowning any player. Did Jones miss open WRs? Yes. Does Fields have question marks? Lance? Heck, even Watson has had 2 ACL surgeries and could have another--TD did. If so, and we have given up 3 firsts and 2 star players, where are we going to be? I am saying that nobody knows how good these guys are going to be--the success rate in the NFL for first rounders is about 50%--a coin toss. Yet we have huddlers who already know the answer and attack any and all who make a positive comment about a player they do not want. How stupid. The more informed Huddlers simply state why they like a player or that they do not like a player because...and they give concrete reasons. Again, I love the drama---I love discussing it and I actually ask for concrete reasons to oppose my opinions because I am not an expert. I want to hear alternative points. Verge has reasons, shared videos, etc. I am still not sold, but at least someone provided concrete reasons. Some points were good, and some lead me to more questions. And then we have people on here whose usernames are cleverly phrased sex positions and they just bash others without facts, using profanity and proclaiming to know it all. Folks, a sign of maturity and intellect is to consider every issue from every perspective before making up your mind. Finger-pointing temper tantrums are for toddlers--I do not care about a toddler's position on the Panthers.

doesn't the league approve these? Yikes if this is something they accept.

There is so much data here, I do not know were to begin my apology after succumbing to the insurmountable surge of logic that has just overwhelmed me. Even your username suggests insecure early adolescent.

When you want to start talking real statistics and measures of QB excellence, I would be willing to talk." Blue = purple because I said so! Take that!" WTF? But you are immature and think you know all. Here is a tip: Nobody knows--not you, not me. So stop your macho BS because it is confirming your ineptitude and nothing more. Weinke? Are you serious? What a cherry-picked, pointless statement. Please don't respond. I am not going to respond your pointless chest pounding. Sheeez.

Did what? Threw for 77.4% completion rate? 350 yards per game? Won a national championship? A: No, No, No. Has Matt ever played on a big stage for a ring? Oh, that is right. Once. How did that turn out? (Hint: 28-3--choking sounds) Do they give trophies for arms? Oh, I guess they do.

No-he cannot do what those guys can do--exactly. Neither can Brady, so he doen't try. Now, some will say, "He is comparing Brady to Jones!!" I would say to them, "You would mock me if I compared Tom Brady in college to Tom Brady in the NFL." Funny story. I was with my coaching buddies (used to coach HS football) at a preseason game vs. the Pats. Bledsoe, the pro bowl QB for NE, was removed during the second quarter, and some #12 came in that I had never heard of---and I watched him. I actually said, "Guys, I think #12 is better than Bledsoe." They all died laughing at me--the teased me all the way home (lived an hour from Charlotte). It was brutal. (I tell this story because I was right--I forget the times when I was not). Today, remind them of it, and they tell a different story--don't recall, etc. I sense some of that will go on here--either way.

They won't admit that they just do not know. I do not see Jones as one who has given anyone reason to write him off. I will say this--if we trade for a QB, we better be right. In the draft, I look at Jones vs. Fields + 2 picks, Wilson + 2 or 3 picks; if we for trade Watson, I look at the players (in the past) we would have lost if we had traded a few years ago--same deal. Is Watson worth Burns (1st rounder), Brown (1st rounder), Moore (1st rounder), CMC (first rounder), and Shaq Thompson (another 1st rounder). Well, that is what it will take to get Watson here. 3 firsts, CMC and Thompson, according to rumor. Are we really better off with Watson after taking that kind of hit? Pretty steep. Or would we be better off signing Trubiski, trading back, adding some key pieces in free agency.... But people will say, "TRUBISKI SUCKS" Have you seen him in a clean pocket with weapons and a running game? Nor have I.

I think I can say this--if the experts see something special in Jones, then I would be happy to see them trade back and take him.. As we approach, I am more interested in the upsides of Wilson and Fields-but I have not written anyone off--trusting the coaches (for the first time in a while) know what they are doing. I am starting to think fields is the man-and we are trading with Miami to get him

I have to agree. We are.

Hoping for the best. He has some skills.

We will. He may be a bust, may fall like a brass balloon. But to say anything (as others are doing) with absolute certainty about a player who has only performed at the highest level on the highest stage is false bravado. I do not know who will be good and who will not--I am just basing my support for a man that possesses some impressive stats and impressive cognitive and leadership skills. If you ever hear me say, "He is not going in the first round..." or "He is a bust" then please understand that i am bluffing to impress others into thinking that i have wisdom I actually lack, because any intelligent fan, scout, GM, etc. will tell you, "The best I can give you is an educated guess."

Damn strong argument. We are waiting to hear why he would not. Why he might: 77.4% completions, 42 TDs, 4 Ints, 350 yards per game. What criteria are you using to dismiss him? Remember not to list things that he had when he won a national title with numbers higher than Burrow (last year) and Trevor. He has a quick release and processes very quickly. So if you discount the fact that he succeeded on the biggest stage in the toughest conference and won a national title, please tell me about this amazing power you have--because it has not been a problem to this point.

The time of year we play along...tell these guys, "OK, I'll bite" I still say, "Do not fall asleep on Denver." That is what I say.

I think of Pride like I do Norman, but Norman (at the same point) took chances that got him in trouble; Pride seemed shy about taking risks. I think Pride will be better. And Jackson is asked to tackle in this defense and he is very unwilling to do that.

I see how you see that---it is really hard to predict who is going to succeed and fail, which is why we all think we can be GMs better than the GMs. I do--I am like, "If Hurney can do this, I can..."

Exactly---I do think processing and his swag are important. I see the weaknesses (as I just posted) and do not know if I were a GM if I could pull the trigger on him. Not at 8. A friend of mine (now a lawyer in Va) went to college with Fitspatrick, and they were friends (Harvard). Fits told him (early in his career) "The only area in which I lead the league is good looks (kidding). He said, I am not a great athlete, I have a below average arm, and I am very white, a condition I have been working on since birth, but it is still an issue. I just see the field better than most. I recognize when the DBs feet are out of place when the WR seems covered--I see him open in one second and throw it knowing that there is no way the DB can recover. In the NFL, if you wait for the WR to get open your window is probably closed. I don't worry about the now, I live in the future 1 second from now. I just see it all and if I were a better athlete with a stronger arm, I could make more happen than I do, but I know my limitations and stay in my lane...I can go back to the sideline after a play and tell the coach why I did not throw to all three WRs and threw it away. Sometimes, it is not until they watch the film do they see why I did it. It is not intelligence, it is not athleticism, it is just what I can do that separates me from others who cannot." (paraphrased) That was about 12 years ago--probably while I have implicit bias. No, Fitz has never been great because he lacks the tools and has played on some terrible teams, but I think the great ones share this ability to some degree. I am basing my opinion of Jones on that--Jones seems to have "it".

I see scary red flags with Fields, Lance, Wilson (to a lesser degree) and Jones as well. They all have some bad tape---and concerns. I think we are picking them apart, but we shall see. I do not like drafting Jones at 8, but think they might. I do think Jones will be better than most think because he processes so quickly--but he is not the athlete Fields is and does not have the canon. He cannot run like Lance. I get it, but what he does well is hard to see on film because it occurs between the ear holes in his helmet. I am not sold on any QB--the best QB draft EVER had 6 first rounders taken--3 were busts. Three became hall of famers (1983). When I go back and watch what I can before that draft, I am telling you, I would have never picked the 3 hall of famers out of a lineup---so I am just throwing it out there and munching popcorn. I love this time of year.

He is either a big NO for folks or he is a top 3 QB. Funny how polarizing he is.

Not interested in debating whether a QB is going to be good or not--systems and patience play huge roles. Most of us would have bashed Tom Brady if it was suggested we drafted him.... I am interested in Rondale Moore, a player you pitched last week, I think. He could be there in 2nd. I am also interested to see you are high on S Gillespie--another round 2 prospect. I would love to hear that Moton is going to the left side and we could take Teven Jenkins and plug him in at RT on day one. If we added 2 Gs in free agency, that could get scary. I am also impressed that you are not too high on Cosmi--not a first rounder. Round 2 looks good if we want value at G. Thanks for posting this, Verge.

Not knocking you for posting it--we should--it just amazes me when people try to cover all the bases. The fact that Watson and Tepper are flirting is the news, but they have to take it to some analysis that is common sense.

And you are a nobody whose opinion is about as meaningful as yesterday's weather update. It would bother me more if you agreed with me.

Isnt the stuff these scholars are reporting rather common sense? The panthers will either trade for Watson, draft a QB, or stick with Teddy for a year. We will know more about this by the end of next week.

Says??? Mac can run an offense. He had some of the best stats ever at QB this year. He simply is not going to be an option, qb draw, scrambling, etc. He can read a defense quicker than most people can read a Stop sign. He has a fairly quick release and an average arm that is much less of an issue than with QBs with slower deliveries. You may guess that is what Jones is, but if he is used correctly, I am afraid you will be denying you said this in a few years. Mond? He has the tools, the skill set--needs to put it together. I will go as far as to say that Jones will be drafted by a better team, and after Lawrence (The jags have picks and cap room galore), he will be the most successful QB early in his career.

Not when he was 4. That's my point.

I think Tribuski would play the best ball of his career here if we landed a few OL and a WR3.