MHS831

Home movie of him with a prostitute, and when he turned on the light, we learn that the prostitute was actually..... Sorry. Bad, Bad, Jeff Ireland joke.

Did not read the entire thread, but he ran a 4.7 at the combiine. However, he plays faster, in my opinion. He wants to play LB, not SS. A lot of people are going to regret not drafting this guy.

She was/is the reason the NFL wears pink in October--maybe DWIll expected more of a tribute than he got. I dunno. All I know is this: It is a very emotional time for DWill and I know he is in pain. He has to know that his career is probably done. His mother recently passed. Probably a bad idea to go social media with the venting, but I do not think Jerry Richardson is at the source of his pain. The realities of life are. He aged out at the same time his mom died. That is tough. You have to remember that this is his side of the story. I doubt Mr. Richardson offers a reaction.

Maybe they have a tough time separating the family atmosphere from the business side. DWIll was a panther for a third of his life--tough getting cut. It takes time getting over a mother's death. I give him a pass. Look at his life the past year-money doesn't buy everything.

No more cow Bell for us.

THAT PHOTO IS THE KISS OF DEATH. All 3 players not to be on roster in 2015.

I see this as another shot of chemo to rid us of Marty Hurney. Guts you, makes you sick, but it is necessary. I should also say that DWill was paid much more $$ than his production was worth. I admire the man, the smiling reminder that this is just a game. Still, this was inevitable.

wasnt Bus Brett Favre's agent? Remember how Favre played teams each of the last 2-3 seasons so he could miss training camp but still get a huge deal?

Well stated. There are a lot of folks here who seem to want to make Cam the highest paid player in the NFL to validate him. To those folks I say, "Remember the good ole days when Marty Hurney was here?" These are the same people who have been saying that Cam has no protection and no weapons. Pay the man too much, and that trend will continue. I have been saying for months, Gettlemen is not emotionally attached to Cam. He can keep him for 2 more years if he wants, and he might do that while he finds and develops another qb. Imagine if he traded Cam to Cleveland for their 2 #1 draft picks? We would have 3 first rounders and $20 m to use in free agency. Anderson was undefeated last year.... I doubt that happens, but if Cam is not committed to Carolina, if getting overpaid here is not enough for him, then maybe Gettlemen explores ways to turn a negative into a positive. Yes, this site would explode, but they are not in Gettlemen's shoes, having to make football decisions that benefit the long-term development of the franchise.

I think Wilson will be way overpaid. Luck and Cam should get similar deals. While Cam has been a tremendous part of the offense here, Luck took a 2 win team and has had double figure wins each year since. Both are probably looking at $23-25m.

I love the draft at WR this year--your suggestion would be a welcome addition in the second round or later. There are other options too, like Kansas State's Lockett etc.

Gettlemen will not make Cam the highest paid player in the league until it has been earned. Check him out on PFF and take his numbers into a mock negotiation and play Bus Cook. You are not walking away with a blank check. I personally think it is going to get ugly if Cam does not face the reality of his situation. His stats and history do not scream, "Guaranteed money." I know people on here do not want to hear that, but imagine how you will feel if Cam does not take his game to the elite level--you have seen flashes, but on paper we are not talking elite yet. Dave will not get emotional. He will not feel bad about it while the ink is still wet. He will make a fair offer. I think Bus and Cam will accept a fair deal. As for Russell Wilson--he is not worth what they are going to pay him in my opinion. Kaepernick is much less of a QB than Cam. I think Cam wants to win and will sign a deal that allows Dave to reduce his cap hit this year. I would also add that a good QB like Cam is in a position-in this market--to demand more than he is worth. I am just saying that if you think DG gives him everything he wants, you have not been watching DG. Not bashing Cam, just analyzing the situation. DG has been talking, and he always tells the truth.

I would think that he and his agent are aware that refusing to allow them to look at his knee will cost them. However, I would also assume that they could be thinking that it will not drop as much as it would if they allowed teams to look at it. They were talking about the need for a combine, and it was originally designed to allow teams the opportunity to check out injuries. The rest evolved from that concept. Why is Gurley there? Interviews?

Good points. As fans, we forget that the best player could be the player that creates cap space by allowing the GM to cut players and enter negotiations with other players with options. Ealy was a great example of this. However, we all feel rather confident that Hardy was not going to be on the roster in 2015 when he was franchised, so need does not have to mean this year. When you consider how productive rookies are in their first years, it is almost stupid to try to meet 2015 needs in the draft. Our scope is narrow and short. A GM has to have vision that extends the length of contracts and he has to know what costs are ahead. So, to extend your excellent points, "Best" does not mean to us what it means to Gettlemen.

Gettlemen is no fool. What does he mean by "best?" Here is what I think "Best" means to a GM: 1. Most Talented 2. Rarity of Talent at position 3. Need 4. Ability to learn-get on the field early 5. Upside 6. Character 7. Versatility (multiple positions; multiple skills at one position; 3-down player?) 8. Special teams ability 9. Injury history 10. Attitude

I hope he causes a top WR to drop to us (Kevin White, Devante Parker)

Good question, BJ. There are 2 things that could cause us to draft another position--(of course there are more, but this is how I see it): 1. If no T you mention above is on the board. Over the past 2 years, the top 5 OTs are gone by the 19th pick of the first round. It could be that the only tackles on the board are Fisher or Sambrailo. They are not first rounders, IMO. 2. If a top DL or WR is on the board, we could decide to wait--all of the T have some asterisk by their names. Too soft, a RT, was abused at SR bowl, etc.

I respect your loyalty and wish I felt as convinced--I think Cam will continue to evolve and I see this as the year he gets the weapons and the protection. We are on the same side, even though we see it differently.

First off, I never said the 30-point thing, Never said the 20+-point thing--but if you have to fabricate and twist to argue against my very simple comments, go ahead. Knock yourself out. Your entire rant is based on those erroneous statements. You and a few others try to find any scrap you can to exploit when I make an honest comment about my perception (and most of the nation's) of Cam. What I wrote about Cam was generally very positive--but you find the one aspect that was critical and melt down. Why are you so sensitive about Cam? He has improved and needs to improve more to become great. He is not a top 10 QB yet. See the bold section--something you call fact. Cam, Gettlemen, RR--all have talked about consistency issues and mechanics. But you call his play consistent over the past 2 years. Are the statisticians also biased and against Cam? Let me tell you something about "when it counts." All 60 minutes. Ask the defense. My post was pretty positive about Cam, and, frankly, what I believe not only to be the truth, but to obviously be the truth. It does not mean that I hate Cam or think he sucks--I think you and some of the others who attack me every time I make any comments about Cam are really not interested in the truth; you seem to have another agenda. Again, you are wrong if that is the case, but just ignore my posts as you seem to ignore reality in this matter.

Red is on my ignore list because he misinterprets direct statements, takes everything out of context, and can't debate without acting butt-hurt. There is no gray area for Red-he translates everything into a simple white./black. hot/cold, good./bad classification so he can process it. He is angry and bitter, but i sense that life has not been kind to him, so I don't take it personally. If he is tracking comments I made back to 2013, surely taking something out of context and not framing the point the way it was framed, then there is a bigger issue to worry about here. So I ignore Red because I do not engage in discourse with people who cannot handle it. Maybe you see how he tries to provoke in the response above. Even when I have not responded to his ridiculous attempts to provoke for months, he is still at it. It is sadly personal for him.

It would have been 21 points had Brown not had a 79-yard punt return, but the Bears were actually ahead early in the game by 2 TDs. The Bears could not hold that lead against most of the league. You found 1 example against a team in disarray-- not exactly an endorsement. You could equally ask, "How did we fall behind that far against the Bears, a team that was terrible in 2014, surrendering 448 points on the year and winning all of 5 games?" The knock on Cam is not my doing, and he is commonly-perceived as a player who gets down when the chips are down. Finding an isolated case proves the blind squirrel theory, and nothing more. Heck, Frank Reich won a game from 34 points back, and he was not a great QB. Don't get me wrong, I want Cam to be great too, but I see this more objectively. I do not get mad at people for having a differing opinion. EVERY expert in the country will tell you that he has shortcomings; the only place they are not acknowledged is here on this board. Now, if Cam improves in these areas, he will be great. The knock on Cam is that he is a front runner, has mechanical issues, and a few lesser concerns. One is a perception that has been repeatedly addressed in the media by people who know more than you or me; the other is obvious to anyone who knows a little about football. I want him great. I want him to be the best ever. he is not there yet. Cam and the front office have some work to do this offseason first.

Cam is a special athlete and this is more than enough proof that his heart is in this more than his wallet. I think he can be the greatest QB to ever play, but as impressive as his statistics and awards are, I have not seen the growth I would like to see, but he is still young. This could be due to any number of factors, and we better build around him this spring so we can rally around him this fall. The same drive that motivates Cam can be his worst enemy. Yes, he has won championships and yes, he was rookie of the year and went to a pro bowl as a rookie. Up to that point, everything was easy for Cam in a sense. He needed some adversity to help round him as a player. Now, as you mention, he has battled adversity as an NFL QB, perhaps for the first time. Injuries, turnover, etc. I will say that the 2 games he sat on the sideline this year might have been the best thing for him because he could actually watch a game he was not in. I want to see him lead when the team is down by 14. I want to see him fix his mechanical issues. When I mention these things, I tend to get blasted. What do you think is keeping him from being a top 3 QB in this league? Is Peyton Manning a better athlete with a stronger arm than Cam? Is Brady? Heck no. Trust me when I say that Cam needs to see the game from the eyes of the teammates who are counting on him to lead them. He needs to trust his pocket (maybe this will change) enough to step into throws. He needs to be consistent and not ride that emotional roller coaster. It is OK to be passionate, but the next play is the next play. That is how Cam becomes as great as he wants to be. Argue that he is the greatest QB in the world and all the problems fall on the OL, WRs, and OC if you want, and you will be partially right, but every great QB had/has similar problems. Cam is almost there, but not quite. I think he is given the tools to turn the corner this year. I think, if Cam works on his mechanics during the offseason, the Panthers are a Super Bowl team--great defense, great QB, great OL---they have all the parts.

When I saw this situation, it was Mike Minter in the cart at an OTA. Minter was one of the all time class acts.

Coaches would have more say than players, which is why I really questioned Voth on this one.

Always appreciated, Jeremy.