MHS831

They should, but they are sending out QB vibes. I really do not get it--the #4 QB in this draft is not worth the #4 pick, and they have many other needs and a serviceable QB. I am going to make a longshot prediction and say the take Chase WR or Sewell T

Welcome. It is a great place to interact and learn alternative perspectives. I break them down into 4 basic groups, and those who are these things probably have to look them up because they are only called these things behind their backs. The rest of us know what these things are, so we laugh at those who don't know. The four types of Huddler are as follows: 1. The pillock 2. The mumpsimus 3. The smellfungus 4. The Lickspittle Of course, the complex Huddler is usually a combination of 2 or more of these, hard to detect at first glance.

was that photo from his days as Belk model? The "Hurney collection"?

Plan C--put an ad for a highly-skilled QB online--I recommend Indeed.

I see both sides of the argument about drafting a QB now. I want one badly. I still think we are holding out for Watson, to some degree, but there is nothing wrong with building the roster THEN bring in your guy.

I think you are trading for Darnold to give him a 1-year therapy camp and you put him through mechanics hell. He has the arm strength. You tie his feet together and tell him to dance around...You make him catch a free-range chicken with his hands...you make him do one-handed push ups--all during a season-long montage made famous in the 80s movies. At the end of the song, he starts the super bowl and wins it.

You want to plan for a QB in year 2022? Here is one way: Trade a conditional 4th rounder for Darnold and pay him his salary for 2021. Work with him--put him as the #3 QB on the depth chart--and have the QB coach work with him all day on his mechanics. If he progresses, offer him a backup QB contract with incentives for 2022-25 or so. If he does not, let him go.

Which may be the reason they hold onto him for Trevor's rookie season. This would have to be a good offer--like a third and a conditional 2022 pick. (speculating, but when I do that, I am never wrong)

This is correct, but with Marty, whose job was on the line most of the time, there was no long-range plan. If we decide to build the roster and draft a QB next year, here is what I would do: Trade back. Some team will trade up for a WR, T, etc. add a first rounder in 2022. Add a second rounder this year. Then next year, you have 2 firsts, cap room, etc. You have added your CB and OT.

You are making sense today! Keep it going...

This is not directly related to the in-depth analysis weaving a tapestry of knowledge in this thread, but I do have an interrogative point to make. Which is better?: A. An average QB with a strong defense and an stud OL and weapons like CMC, Anderson, and Moorex2? B. A potentially-good to great QB (and potentially a bust) with a defense that features weak corners, an OL that features drifters and retreads, yet he still has weapons like CMC, Anderson, and Moorex2? I do not know the answer, but I wonder how many early first round busts would have been good on established rosters? The world may never know.

It is not news until it happens--and if there are other possibilities. Come on man--sharing updated information is not something that should be treated with dickism.

Person may have his reasons, but rarely does he have inside info. He is the same Person (see what I did there?) who proclaimed that Moton was gone (knowing that we could franchise him) and actually gave his vision a 60% likelihood of being true. Many of us (without insider info) called BS--we felt that Samuel could be gone, but no way in hell we lose Moton. So this could be Person trying to finance a new batch of hair gel by getting clicks--but I do see this being a possibility. I think Brady and the offense: Who did they want? Bridgewater. Who were they ready to see leave? Cam. This is about style of play within the system, not the people or past accolades. Bridgewater sucked, and that fell through. So who best fits the Brady system? I think that there are question marks and a season of development for Lance and Fields, and I think Jones lacks the athleticism to run the options etc. and he is probably at his ceiling. So yeah, I see it. Now, what veteran might fit this system--a casualty of the draft? Minshew does come to mind, to some degree, and so does Darnold. Darnold is the most intriguing because his problems are mechanics that are fixable. He rarely has his feet in position. When the game slows down and with good QB coaching--and maybe some time on the bench, he could be good. Do we have that kind of time? I am not talking first option here, but a season behind Bridgewater might do wonders for him.

Minshew. Last season, on a team in full tank mode, in 9 games Minshew completed 66% of his passes and had 15 TDs vs 6 Ints. He won a game. The year before, he was 6-6 on that terrible team and threw 21 TDs vs. 6 ints. Give him some time and some weapons. Jake Delhomme II?

Also, I think they know that SF will cut him, and feel that he will return to the beginning for free.

I am a professor. Of course, this is hardly APA or MLA format--not even Chicago Manuscript...So I will leave it here: At a football game between Harvard and Yale, a Harvard student held up a sign to taunt Yale. It read: "Yale cites Wikepedia" I laughed out so loudly. Found it:

I have challenged people to tell me exactly why they are so certain Jones does not belong with the other QBs at the top of the draft. Fans read some crackhead's article and another that repeats it and they start believing they are in the know. Here are some of the attempts (paraphrased) to dismiss Jones. 1. His body. (See GOAT, and tell me what kind of body do you need to read and throw?) 2. He has an average arm. (Well, when your brain is slow to react, you need a gun to make up the time you lost trying to figure it out. When you anticipate and read quickly, you simply make sure the ball is there on time. An average arm is easier to catch than a laser, so it is actually better). 3. He was only good because he had a good team around him. (what else is he supposed to be? Being good is a negative if you have a supporting cast? I am assuming that Trevor is good for that reason, Fields is good for that reason, and Lance is good for that reason. And if you look at Wilson's schedule, he was good for that reason. What a stupid point. Jones completed nearly 80% of his passes for an 11.2 yards gained per attempt average. He average 350 yards per game and had 42 TD passes vs. 4 Ints. That is better than all other QBs---oh, and he won a championship, something only Fields did not do.) So if you are convinced that Jones sucks, the stats do not support your opinion. ------------------- Here is what I think: SF sees Jones as the best fit for their offense, and they probably assume that Wilson and Trevor will be gone. So they may play the draft gamble game and project him to be there at 12, or the remove all doubt. Securing #3 allows them to focus on the rest of the draft, make trades, etc. because they now KNOW who they are getting.

We would have to make them a strong offer-not a 4th rounder-maybe higher. They have a ton of cap room and some early picks, but maybe they would take a third or so. And you are right, they are gold, but they had him and threw him to the wolves, and I think this is the last year of his "cheap" contract...and there is this-he was rather screwed over by the Jags--maybe they do it for him. Maybe they give him the opportunity to start because it is the right thing to do--maybe they do not want the tension that could develop between the two young QBs? I dunno.

Man I like the way you think--I agree, but Verge has been right a lot, and she reports that her scout source is confident Jones is who they want. To me, the math is definitely not working here, but he DOES fit their system and he is fairly ready to start early. He is very smart and processes quickly---it is possible--and I would never be saying this had Verge not shared that. Reminds me of Daniel Jones getting drafted early for many of the same reasons. We marvel at the athletes, but the old school GMs and coaches know that winning Super Bowl QBs are not the best athletes--sports car vs. Mini van--which is better to carry the team on a long journey? We want the Corvette, but the Astro Van.... I hope you are right about Denver (they are frustrated with Lock, but he needs to be developed--I think the Josh Allen example has to make these GMs think about trashing a young, developing QB. In my opinion, we still do not know what Darnold has because the team has been in the toilet for 3+ years--they really should trade back and build. Zach Wilson (and a lot of sites are saying that the Jets have tipped their hand a bit and will take him) may not be worth #2 overall. I see red flags all over Fields and Lance--I see their skill sets, but I also see struggles for 2 years before they have fully adapted. Fields has that Ohio State QB curse--the "Curse of Art Schlichter" (made that up) but has examples of processing. Lance has all the tools, but his inexperience and the level of competition makes us wonder. And he could be impeded by the "Curse of Carson Wentz". I dunno. I think the best plan for Carolina is to have a bunch of plans. I still wonder if we do not trade back and use the picks to go after a player like Minshew or Darnold. I also think we see the Watson news as a buying opportunity, knowing he may not be available until 2022. Waiting a month only helps us read the tea leaves more clearly. If we trade for Watson with conditional picks and keep Bridgewater, would everyone be OK with that? Maybe draft Mond if he is there later?

The decision to move up or sit at 8 or move back etc. has not been made yet. We are holding onto some cap room for a reason---and we are not spending it---because we have no idea how this thing will unfold. I doubt Carolina moves up before the draft begins--and that depends on a few things: 1. How do the Panthers feel about Lance, Fields, and Jones? Personally, I think there are markers that a player must pass in the draft before Carolina makes a move--or not. More on that in a tick. 2. Have the Panthers decided to stay in the Watson hunt even if it takes months? If so, does that impact their moves? I mean, if you still want Watson, trading up is stupid. Here is the deal--watch ATLANTA. We know the Jags, Jets, and Niners are going QB. The other 3 teams are all in for a QB, but Atlanta has a QB and they have other needs--especially defense. Verge seems to think that the Niners like Jones--and if they take him at #3, it gets interesting. Now hometown boy Fields is on the board. Do you take him? There is a lot to like about him and a lot scares you about him. Do they risk blowing that pick when they already have a QB that they are paying tons for? If I am the GM, I take Sewell or trade back. I might even trade back hoping to land a top T. However, if they decide to fill some holes for Ryan, a LT is the most important pick they can make--so they make it. I think that is what they do. So if the Falcons pass on a QB and take Sewell, the Bengals may then be willing to trade out--because it is widely believed that they want Sewell. However, some have Slater higher than Sewell (I do not) and he could be the pick at #5. The Dolphins have committed to Tua at #6, and they seem to like the fact that they keep getting first rounders to move a few spots. However, at this point, if you like both Lance and Fields equally, you sit. Watch Denver--they will be on the phones like a New Delhi Telemarketer--so if you want Fields but not Lance--you call Miami at #6. Sitting at #8 works if you think Lance will fall--and it is possible that he falls to #8 because he is a huge risk. There is one other option: If we do not like Lance, for example, and he gets past Detroit, what would the rights to draft the last top 4 QB be worth? Denver, Washington, New England, New Orleans, or Tampa Bay may be in the market. We trade back, acquire some picks, and use them to trade with Jacksonville for Minshew, for example. Everyone knows Denver will take the QB at 9 (if that is where they stay) so the price would be considerable. I fully expect that the Panthers have plans A-Z and know what to do and when to try to do it. Watch the Niners, but they are going QB--regardless--and it will be Jones or maybe Fields. Then watch Atlanta, because if they take Sewell, the remaining teams are not desperate for a QB. If the Niners take Fields, then you can just sit at 8 because Jones or Lance--maybe both--will be there. I am not sure this is coherent or even worth a thread, but there will be an unexpected move on draft day during the first hour or two.

No QB in round 2--I see your point. I think we will sign a veteran, but one guy flying WAY below the radar could be a day-3 pick and he has perhaps a better chance of starting than Newman or Mond--people are going to laugh at this, but here goes--day 3 draft pick and potential starter in the NFL (in 2023 or so): https://www.nfl.com/prospects/davis-mills/32004d49-4c67-8397-4c7b-81c6636ba80e People will squint at this and laugh, but if he gets healthy, he has the size (not mobile) arm and brain to play in the NFL.

Could be Mond, could be Trask (yes, he had a bad bowl game with all of his WRs sitting out the game)--and that player may not be the guy in 2021. I think they will be playing in 2022 and 2023. These guys can be coached and the system is so important. Not my first choice, but if you go back and look at drafts in the past, how many QBs (if you are honest) would you have taken are now "Busts?" In the Rosen, Mayfield, Allen, Darnold draft, how many people would honestly say they would have selected Allen?

First, Mond and Newman are not in the same class. Mond's skill set is off the charts. Just has not put it all together, yet. Can Brady help with that? I dunno, but I do not know enough about QBs to write off players with skills before they ever played a down.

It was tough to watch, but if we upgrade the OL, throw in a healthy CMC, we will be better for the time being--enough to keep us out of the top 10 in the draft and playoffs at the same time. It is the kiss of death to be mediocre. Financially (Thanks Marty!) we are into him for big bucks in 2021 if we start him or release him, and he is currently (MAYBE) the best QB on the roster. Winning culture. We could go with that and wait until the draft to see what falls out of the tree--will current QBs be cut or traded? Who best fits our system? Me? I am going after Minshew with a 2022 second rounder to see if Jax will trade. Why would they not? He is a cheap backup for a season, but he is getting benched by a college player.

I would definitely trade back--but I will speculate that there is a chance that we are higher on Lance than the NFL scouts--wonder what the odds are that Lance slips to us? I might say, 30-40%--if trading were not allowed, I might say higher.