MHS831

Actually, the moves they have made are pretty impressive--these are unusual times. The Darnold move may not pay off, but to get a developmental, 23 year old QB with NFL experience and not have to use your first rounder drafting a 21 year old developmental QB with NO NFL experience was brilliant. Now we get the QB AND the LT. The players we have signed on the bottom end are low risk, high reward players. Erv and Elf on the OL, the biggest head scratchers to me, can play every position on the OL. So I will reserve judgement, but Marty's answer was to re-sign what you know (he used to brag that 3 of his draft picks were the highest paid at their respective positions---because HE PAID THEM) and throw scrubs at some spots like RT, RG, DT, CB, etc. while he tried to figure it out. I will take this---it seems like the second year of the three year turnaround.

Individual stats are still reflective of the supporting cast--you cant separate them. And there is no real reason for them. Put Tom Brady in NY last year. Are his stats similar to Tampa? That would be a big ole bowl of NOPE.

So lemme get this straight--You want a QB who throws into the teeth of the defense and you want his completion percentage to be 64%. You want the yards over 4000, but you want the interceptions in the single digits. How many current QBs do that now?

First numbers were Jake Delhomme in 2003, the closest this team ever came to winning a super bowl,

The bad thing about these mocks is trading is too easy and fun as hell. I end up with 30 players and 22 future draft picks. So I send my mocks to some teams needing GMs. Fingers crossed.

1) The round 1 LT is a must, and the more I watch Slater, the better I feel about it. 2) A smart, elite C is something we lack and Paradis is old. Go ahead and get one now. If he can win the job now, cut/trade Paradis. 3) Mills is a QB we can develop and trade for a first rounder or two if Darnold catches on and become good, and he could be a good backup until then. 4) Twyman is a pass rushing 3 T. 5) Thomas is a solid zone CB with starting potential. We have some older guys for now, so let's give him a year to learn. 6) Shi Smith is a slot WR/return guy. 7) Ball is going to start at RT in the NFL. Let him learn for a year--playing in jumbo packages, etc. was surprised to see him at 222. Regrets? Did not address S, #1 CB, TE

Why is this "depending on the draft?" The Panthers got strong QB play in 2003 and 2015, and neither QB had 4000 yards. both were over 4% BELOW 64% in completion percentage. Did you adjust for a 17-game schedule? And to say wins are not the measure of an individual QB, neither are stats. Darnold will not be calling plays and he has no control over the existence of a pocket. He does not run the routes or catch the passes for the WRs/TEs. So there are too many variables for anyone to reduce the measure of a QB to a few cherry picked statistics. Winning is all that matters. Jake Delhomme nearly won the Super Bowl with a 59% completion rate and 19 TDs and 16 Ints. 3200 yards. Yet he was a gamer. He took the team on his back and he made plays when they were needed. I am looking for the skillset, but a leader is not determined by stats. We all know that. Bridgewater came closer to your stats that Delhomme did. He had 3700 yards and completed 69% of his passes. His TD/INT ratio was about the same as Jake's was in 2003. So using this model, Teddy Bridgewater in 2020 was a better QB than Jake Delhomme in 2003, the team that barely lost Super Bowl 38).

What would you say if he posted the following numbers: Completes 59.2%, 3200 yards, 19 TDs and 16 Ints. for an 80.6 QBR. Super Bowl? What if he did this: Completes 59.8% 3800 yards 35 TDs and 10 ints. for a 99.4 QBR. Super Bowl?

I'd be celebrating this for weeks.

This makes too much sense. If Darnold struggles or goes down with an injury, the season is not over with TB---as much as that makes people mad--with upgrades to the OL, TE, and CMC returning, we should be OK. I fully expect the D to be better. Or we could go with our current backups. Yikes.

I think your thread has brought forth some interesting discussion-rework his deal and trade him. I am not certain teams will wait for him to be cut because there are others interested. Still, you will have a bigger market after the draft for trades (Minshew, possibly, Garropolo, etc. But some teams and players seem to be quite content with big name backups (Raiders, Bills, for example). To be honest, If Atlanta does not draft a QB this year (and they shouldn't) Teddy would be a great backup for Ryan.

There will be an offer since multiple teams are kicking the tires and the reality of the free agent market and draft prospects are dire. Teddy is an experienced, bottom tier starting or elite backup QB. That has value. I see (possibly) the Seahawks and Bears getting into the mix, in addition to the Broncos and Texans make sense. I could also see Bridgewater back in New Orleans with that circus at the QB position. I say Denver, because trading up for the fifth best QB has to be a bummer of a thought to sleep on every night. Dark horse? New England.

I think we have to make up that 2nd rounder for the reasons you provide. But trading Teddy will recoup the 4th and 6th, and if we move back a bit at some point, we could recoup the second. If so, then the Teddy for Darnold swap was good for us because we get rid of a lot of TB's salary AND we still have our 1st rounder that we did not spend on a QB

They are the products of their environments. The were not breast fed.

This is a group of informed posters--nice and refreshing. By piecing together things I have learned from you all over the past few months and watching the available video of these players, I think we have to look at T as a 2 starter process that should be addressed this off season. Moton (according to some of you) wants LT money in the $20-23m range. Not a good look for a RT. 8 years ago that was elite QB money. I think we need to draft a LT in round 1, and a RT later to take over in 2022. There are a lot of young RTs later in this draft and we could be developing one NOW. So when I see RTs in the middle rounds, I start frothing at the mouth like a rabid rabbit. Here are some I really like: 2nd round: Mayfield (some have a first-round grade, but I have him around #40, which is great. Would we draft 2 OTs at 1 and 2 during the same year? Doubtful, but he is a swing T and is very mechanically sound. 3rd round: Carman is interesting because he is a G or RT--which means he could play either...Radunz would be a great developmental RT to draft in round 3 because if our LT every went down, he could switch over without losing too much... 4th/5th round: Spencer Brown from N. Iowa should be there early day 3, and at 6'9" and 320 lbs, he is a bigun. James Hudson (Cincy) and Brady Christensen (BYU) would be nice additions in this range. Not starters for now, but they will be one day. Remember, D'Ante Smith (ECU) was at the SR Bowl with our staff, and this is about where he starts getting love. 6th/7th round: Tommy Doyle (Miami Ohio) is a big swing T who has a nasty demeanor. Former Hockey player. Josh Ball (Marshall) is a former 4-star recruit who signed with Florida State before transferring to Marshall. He has a ton of upside, and he may not be drafted. I think he could start in the NFL in a year or two.

I am guessing a 3TECH since all we have are NTs Remember, they wanted KK to return on a cheap deal

Leatherwood has the longest arms--that is all I have for him, After the top 3--I am not into Cosmi, Leatherwood, or Radunz. I like Jenkins Mayfield, Eichenburg, Walker, and Vera-Tucker as a second OL drafted. I am guessing that Slater is going to be the pick. Good feet, just lacks the punch and run blocking Sewell offers. Still, I will be happy with either

why would anyone be against him? You are right--he has a chance, and with the exception of Mr Pecker massage, all other candidates would too. At least we did not send anyone 3 firsts for a bust.

who do you play for?

Agreed, but the risk was well worth the potential reward. We have seen other players under Gase prosper elsewhere. So there is something more than theory at work--we know Darnold will be better here than in NY--fairly fair statement. How much better? Not sure.

The one thing you cannot deny is the math. Darnold is young (23). The draft picks are not that problematic because the trade saved the Panthers the need to use the #8 overall pick on a QB with no more certainty for success than Darnold has. The #8 pick is worth 1400 points--the others have an adjusted 2021 trade value of about 300 points. So we really did not LOSE draft stock by doing this--we gained it. And once we get something for TB, it will be an even sweeter deal. Now that does not guarantee SD will be good, but there are red flags about Fields, Lance, and Jones as well. Well played, Fitts. And thank you, Pythagoras.

Picking JJ's brain might be time well spent.

Virtual Meetings on the Charlie Football site (Font size approved by Panther55 and MrScot.--seriously, do not know why it did that )

If that is the case, then I draft OT in rounds 1 and 2 this year.

You are all over it. Hudson had some "issue" or something, but I have not heard much else. Christensen has short arms (under 33") fwiw.