MHS831

Interesting. Very possible. I am under the impression that it is on a case-by-case basis--but it is a good question.

Plummer going to be the #2? I imagine he will get some time if the game slips away--one side or the other. Might mean Dalton has taken his last snap in a Panther uniform.

in 2022, the NFL suspended the Miami Dolphins owner and fined him $1.5 million for violating policies related to the integrity of the game when they were tanking.

I want the draft capital too, Cam, but I can answer it this way: We would be picking no worse than 10. If we lose out, it could be as bad as 7. If veterans who are free agents see that they can get in early on a winning team on the horizon, they are more likely to be interested in signing with Carolina that, say, Chicago, who seems to be in disarray. This is speculative, however--and I don't see us as big players in free agency--so it may be a mute point.

Sorry for the tech screw up--could not clear.

Tankathon Draft Order (12/28/24) *GIANTS While a win is unlikely because the Giants’ strength of schedule could take them from first overall pick to sixth using current data, Indy is erratic and Philly could be resting starters. Regardless, I see little chance the Giants punish the fans with an insulting win to lose an opportunity to get a franchise qb. *PATRIOTS New England has 2 home games left if chilly Foxboro. The Chargers are only giving 4.5 points this week and Buffalo could very well be resting starters next week. It seems unlikely on paper, but New England does not need a QB and they are going to try to win. *JAGUARS Jacksonville gets Tennessee at home and they are still slight underdogs. The end the season in Indy, who could be fighting for a wildcard. If they are going to win, it is Sunday. A 1 point home dog against a bad team means anything could happen. *TITANSBasically, the Titans are very slight road favorites at Jacksonville Sunday. Panther fans should root for the Titans because someone is going to go tho 4-12. Tennessee’s SOS is higher, so the Panthers want them to win. Jax can win and still not help the Panthers. If Tennessee wins, it could mean that the Panthers move up a spot. *BROWNS Their only hope is for a snow storm in Cleveland for the Dolphins game–they still lose. Cleveland has scored below 20 points 12 of 15 games this year. Yikes. They will be a top 5 pick, which will make the draft interesting. With Watson and Winston struggling, what will they do? *RAIDERS Based on the Saints terrible performance vs.Green Bay Monday Night, the Raiders were made favorites (-1.5) in the Big Easy. New Orleans not only looked like crap, they have a slew of injuries (Kamara for one) and are playing on a short week following a demoralizing win, while the Raiders are riding a one-game win streak. *BEARS In their last 4 games, the Bears have been outscored 45-131. The golden child who was destined for greatness (courtesy of the Carolina Panthers) has lost his mojo. With one game to play at Green Bay, they will not win another game this season. If the Panthers lose out, the Bears will not draft ahead of them–they have a .560 SOS to the Panthers’ .494. *PANTHERS While the Panthers almost beat Tampa Bay at home recently, they are 8 point dogs at Tampa. Their best chance for a Wis in Atlanta week 18, but if Pennix plays like he has so far, we probably lose. *JETS The Jets were considered a favorite to compete in the playoffs when they scrimmaged us. Heads are going to roll in January, one might think. Their SOS is slightly higher than the Panthers right now–so if both teams lose out, Math will determine who picks before whom. *SAINTS It is very unlikely that the Saints impact the Panthers’ draft position, but mathematically, they could if the Panthers win a game, the Saints lose out, and the SOS shifts from the Panthers’ favor to their favor somehow. However, the Saints (currently) pick 10th, and it is impossible for the Panther to pick worse than 10th. Who to root for this week and why: SATURDAY, 12/28 Chargers (-4.5) vs. Patriots: Of course, the Patriots are the team to root for, but if they win, their SOS is much lower than the Panthers, so the Panthers would not jump them–yet. But the Pats play Buffalo the following week, and the Bills could rest their starters. Long shot, but No Brainer- GO PATS!!. SUNDAY, 12/29 Titans (-1) vs. Jags: If the Jags win, their record goes to 4-12 like the Panthers is likely to be, but their SOS is lower. The Titans could win and their SOS would be higher than the Panthers if both are 4-12. No Brainer–GO TENNESSEE!! Jets vs. Bills (-10): Pull for the Jets, but they are nearly 10 point dawgs. Not likely, but No brainer–GO NYJ!! Raiders (-1.5) vs. Saints: A Saints win eliminates them from any chance of picking ahead of the Panthers, and even if the Panthers go 1-1 and the Saints finish 0-2, it is likely the Panther pick ahead of them. On the other hand, a Raiders win and a Panther loss this week puts the Panthers ahead of the Raiders. No Brainer–GO VEGAS!!! Colts (-7.5) vs. Giants: The Giants would have to run the table to pick later than the Panthers. Don’t waste sweat on this one. Indy has a winning road record and NY is 0-8. Not happening. No Brainer-forget about the Giants. Dolphins (-6.5) vs. Browns. The forecast today in Cleveland is 58 degrees and overcast. Fish dodge a blizzard. However, the Browns could surprise because Winston is streaky when he is not being stupid. If the Browns pull of the home upset, their SOS is higher than Carolina’s. No Brainer–GO BROWNS!! Noteworthy: The Panthers move up in the draft order immediately if any of the following three teams win: Tennessee, Las Vegas, Cleveland, Since the Bears already played Thursday night, a Panther loss moves them ahead of Chicago based on current SOS. If the Panthers win out, the worst they can pick is 10th overall

Another personal attack--you can't see yourself, can you? Petty.

I have since found an article--Kamara is out (you are correct) and their performance against Green Bay contributed to the swing. Other injuries as well.

That is exactly what they are doing. No timeline yet on Brooks, and Chuba is their workhorse. If he blows out a knee during these last 2 meaningless games, we' d have to draft or sign a top RB to start next season.

Speaking of draft position, this was curious to me--Any background information that would justify a 4-point swing in the line (making New Orleans the home dog against the 3-win Raiders)?

Emotional? Hardly--but your post is yet another meritless personal attack, suggesting that you are suffering from some degree of hostility which is silly. You seem to be incapable of intelligent discourse because you offer no counter intelligent opinion or reasons why this is, using your extended vocabulary, "dumb." Your response "let the coaching staff handle it" assumes that is not part of the equation and could apply to EVERY topic on this forum. In other words, "you got nothing." Yet I clearly and repeatedly stated that this would be a tool for the coaches and front office to use during the off season. So I was saying the coaches would handle this--comprehend? Who else would handle it? Stop trolling. Share your opinion and allow others to have their own. Since what I have suggested is done frequently in the NFL--I was only suggesting certain players--your perspective is ripe with naivete (Google it) and without any supporting rationale. A simple Google demonstrates this: BOY THOSE NFL TEAMS ARE DUMB.

Preacher--choir.

I bet it is confusing to some--the idea of evaluating talent, collecting data, and providing experience to young players. Now stop being a child and learn how to voice intelligent opinions without taking it so personally. Do you have that capability?

Good point--let's take the person who some feel needs no further evaluation: Richardson Do you know which safety position he played? How would he do at the other S position? Big Nickel? Nickel? For example. How would Farley do at S? Nickel? Etc. Jones? What do you know about him? We know more about Richardson than others, but how versatile is he? Can he play other spots? That is what this opportunity gives you. I do not understand the argument to NOT take a look at some players before making offseason decisions about them. Another reason you do this: Experience for the players. Injuries are something you must plan for in the NFL. While Richardson may never be a starter, if he has experience at Nickel, SS, FS--he could become a more valuable reserve. In college, I started off as an outside LB--before the last week of practice, they gave me reps at TE. They threw me a pass during the final game. In spring practice, I was moved to TE. That brief experience in a game at TE was important. The coaches told me that they wanted to get the "taste of blood" in my mouth, but they evaluated the 10 plays and critiqued my blocking, route running, stance, etc. It gave them some talking points --things to work on--before spring practice. If you have no recent film on Raym or Farley at S or Richardson at nickel, etc. why not take a look? A: there is no reason. I realize that college and the NFL are very different, but I also realize that the best organizations have the "next man up" philosophy and they tailor their approach to the skill sets of their players--not the other way around. Rivera would get us eliminated and then he would play to win at all costs; he was insecure about his record, in my opinion. Take the evaluation to a new level--the playoff teams cannot do this--we can.

do you have a remote?

They are on an NFL roster now, and you build the roster from the bottom up. Who are you going to keep (most are projects of some sort) and who are you going to move away from? Another point--some players develop and mature at different rates--some players are "gamers" and not good practice players. You could try Farley at S, for example. You could see if Velus Jones can make a play or two from various spots (RB, WR, KR). What is the reason you wouldn't?

Same thought. They will argue, "We can eliminate another preseason game." Starters don't play in those as it is.

Says who? Two games lets you know if you have something or not. You see what they do when given a shot. Heck, the preseason is only 3 games, and then you say, "Let's see how they do against the 1's" It also gives you a chance to gauge their improvement from the last time they made film. You give me 80 plays of football against the first teamers in a real NFL game, I can tell you enough about that player.

I realize that the coaches see the players on the roster and practice squad at practice, but there are several players I want to see play substantial minutes in a game situation. I AM NOT SUGGESTING THAT WE START ALL THESE PLAYERS--I AM SUGGESTING THAT WE GIVE SOME MEANINGFUL PLAYING TIME TO A FEW FROM THIS LIST. This article about 2022 draft pick (Bears) Velus Jones led to this thread: https://oldnorthbanter.com/panthers-urged-to-give-former-draft-bust-a-chance-entering-season-s-final-games-01jfzg7bj02n Velus Jones, WR/RB/KR: Very fast and can be elusive. The article compares him to a Cordarrelle Patterson. Stood out at 2022 SR Bowl. Drafted in the third round (I think) by Bears. I did not know he was on the roster. He is 27. Caleb Farley (CB/S): He has had his fair share of injuries and his play has been sub par, but maybe the former first rounder was in the wrong position. Let him face the LOS and move him to Safety. His injuries (back and knee) and size 6' 2" 200 lbs make it tough to play CB, but I think he might be able to handle Safety, based on my limited knowledge of the skill sets for both positions. For now, let him play CB, but if he looks decent, consider S. Demani Richardson (S): Yes, he made a play last week. Let him play more to see if it was a fluke or legit. Xavier Woods is set to become an UFA at age 30. Jaden Crumedy (DT): I have a feeling there will be some house cleaning at DT/DE (3-4) this offseason. Ray and Tuttle have been embarrassing this season, and Ray becomes an ERFA. Tuttle can be cut post June 1 for a $6m savings. A. Robinson has been average at best, but he is signed for 2 more seasons (he too can be cut post June 1 for a $6m savings). We know we get Brown back and I am confident we draft a DT. Can Crumedy work into the rotation? What if we go 4-3? We need some film on him playing from the 3 tech and the nose. Jacoby Windmon (ILB) I realize that he is playing, but we need to put him in different situations to see how he looks. At 6-2, 250, he has the size to play ILB in a 3-4 or 4-3, but he has also had some reps as a DE in college, if I am not mistaken. I would like to see him in coverage and blitzing. He led the team in tackles last week (8). Andrew Raym (C) We may have something in Mays, but we need depth. Can Raym play? We'd have to bring him up from the PS, but he could step up and keep us from drafting a C late.

Look at our WR situation from the other side. Who are you going to put your better CBs on? Johnson and Theilen went out early---XL had 138 yards in the first three games on 12 catches. Yardage-wise, that is over 30% of his total for the season. 12 catches is nearly 30% of his catches for the season. When these players went out--Johnson, AT, Mingo, etc. it left XL facing the best corners of the opposition for many games. He is raw--we knew that when we drafted him. You can't throw a raw WR at the best CBs in the NFL and expect instant success. If he spent the season facing the second or even third best CBs on each team, he'd probably have better stats. Legette is still thinking out there, in my view. When the light comes on, he will be good. ------------------------------------------------ Hearing that there is noise to play Velus Jones over the next two games. We will see if they do.

Our biggest weakness right now is DT/DE in the 3-4. I think we might be better equipped to run the 4-3 than a 3-4 right now. (Have not given it a lot of thought, but I can put it on paper quickly.)

He had a top 5 Defense in San Diego as the DC and it took him 8 years to be hired as a head coach. Junior Seau and company--there has to be a reason. When I talked to him at OTAs, he was not impressive. Remember, he made the comment about being a left handed left tackle and some of his game management decisions were super stupid--and with Cam Newton at QB, he never had back to back winning seasons. Now take Mike Tomlin--he has never had a losing season--Kenny Pickett, etc. at QB. That is a coach.

I do too--not sure about any after that. Maybe the kid from Bowling Green? Boom or bust.

Not saying we have to break the bank; TE is a position you can draft later and pay less, so it is a good value to have a good TE. Who does Miami have at WR to keep Jonnu covered with LBs? Hill, Waddle, and if they need more speed and quickness, Malik Washington from UVA. He is benefiting from the attention the Fish's WRs get every play. Speed. Tua needs a solid TE who probably plays beneath the radar a lot. I am talking Greg O good. Kincaid in Buffalo has 424 yards and he is ranked 24th among TEs in receiving. He has potential, and in that system, he is likely to not get much more than that. Ja'Tavion Sanders has 29 catches--and he got 15 in three games--which is promising, but not dominant--he is not even listed in the top 32. Tremble, fwiw, has 21 catches. I think these two would be excellent #2 and #3 TE options, but Sanders is not really showing Alpha chromosomes at this time. However, to your point, if we bring in some stud WRs, our TEs get better and they get open more. We are close.

I think he is going to be good--are you putting his potential (4th rounder, I think) up there with the elite TEs--I see some offenses where you have 2 TEs--sometimes in the backfield--etc. I don't see Sanders as the elite TE I had in mind, but I like his potential. I think he is a #2. he could prove me wrong, but I don't see it yet.