LinvilleGorge

I didn't pick up anything odd. If anything it's comforting that he's not pounding his chest acting like we've arrived because we finally have some meaningful games in December.

I think higher potential ceiling is pretty much confirmed.

Sigh... go back and read the post I quoted and then honestly try to tell me you weren't cherry picking metrics to try to make your point. Then you pick two games (with a combined 14 passing attempts in them) out of 20 total games (with a combined 631 passing attempts in the other 18 games) to further demonstrate you aren't cherry picking? I mean... I guess I should thank you for taking the time to demonstrate my point. LOL

That's why it's important not to cherry pick specific metrics which is what you're doing here to try to make your argument that stats don't matter. But when a guy is superior across the board... I mean, you're left with a real uphill battle to make a compelling argument with concrete data to back it up. You're basically left with trying to make the argument that despite this guy performing worse in practically every measurable metric of QB play, I think he's actually a better player. That's a tough case to make.

I'm not saying they tell the whole story, but when a guy is measurably better at everything it seems logical to conclude that... well, he's better. It's pretty rare to compare two players where one is measurably better across the board and try to argue that the lesser performer is actually the better player. You'd expect to be able to find something to hang your hat on in the numbers.

I mean, without some sort of concrete metrics you're basically just left with a pure opinion argument. I would expect a better player to be metrically superior at something. When one guy is measurably superior across the board it's speaking pretty loudly.

I would've loved to have had Howell get a shot to play under Pete Carroll but Carroll has obviously developed some pretty bad Geno Smith goggles in his final years and it might bounce him out of the league.

I wish I knew what DC's scouting report on Howell was. He was the QB coach in Seattle at the time and they were scouting Howell pretty hard. So obviously DC either wasn't very high on him or lost those arguments in the draft room. I will say the Seahawks had a pretty solid draft that year so it wasn't like they were picking bums over Howell. Their 3rd round pick has started all 42 games he's been healthy and their 4th round pick has started 32 games for them. So it very well could've been that DC was slamming the table for Howell but they simply had players higher on their board available.

He's just competitive as hell. He wants to compete. I mean, the guy basically tanked his own draft status his final year in college playing like The Golden Calf of Bristol because that's what the Heels needed him to do to compete because we only had one D1 level WR on the roster and everyone was doubling him. I just can't see him ever being happy sitting around holding a clipboard. But if I was in his camp I'd be beating it into his head that a backup QB job is still one helluva job to have and to suck it up and do it if it comes down to it because it beats the hell out of going and getting a "real" job.

I'd love for Howell to get another chance as a starter simply because I feel like he got a raw deal in Washington. He was playing for a pass happy OC who was really doing more auditioning for a HC role that he felt like he'd been getting passed over for than he was actually trying to run a functional offense. They passed the ball at a higher rate than any other offense in the league that year despite starting a second year player first year starter with an OL that couldn't pass protect at all and a lot of his league leading INTs came while trailing late throwing YOLO balls trying to comeback. Basically the perfect recipe for a bunch of turnovers. My concern for Howell long term in the NFL is that if he's not a starter I don't think he has the mentality of a long term backup. He's not a guy that's just gonna smile and cheerlead and be happy to hold a clipboard.

Sure I can. I've been wrong before and I'll be wrong again. Am I sitting here begging for us to sign Sam Howell to a franchise QB contract or a one year $27M contract? Nope. I'm saying I want us to sign a more physically talented veteran QB to a reasonable short-term contract compete with Bryce next year and Howell fits that bill. Howell is my pick in large part because he's my favorite college QB of all-time. But if we signed someone like say Mariota instead, honestly that's fine too.

Comparing NFL to college isn't exactly an apples vs. apples comparison with the drastically different levels of competition. Timmy Chang didn't face anywhere near the level of competition that guys in major conferences faced. Right now? With Baker seemingly limited by injury? Yeah those guys might be better than the Baker of right now.

If a guy has better statistics across the board what is the argument for him to be a worse player? It comes down to attitude and contract. Murray is a dick coasting on talent with a contract the Cardinals need to get out from under while Bryce is a good guy on a rookie contract. But on the field despite basically mailing it in Murray is a better football player.

I'm not surprised. It's a pretty amazing (awful) achievement. LOL

Pick the statistical category and I bet Murray is statistically better over his career than Bryce. Completion percentage, yards, TDs, TD:INT ratio, YPA, YPG, rushing yards and TDs, winning percentage, whatever. I bet it's Murray in a clean sweep. He's just frustrating because it's obvious he could be significantly better if he maximized his talent.

I'm not all that religious, but prayers up...

I still want to know if a player has ever recorded both an INT and a lost fumble on the same play prior to last night. Prior to watching that play my initial reaction to such a premise would've been "*scoff* Well, that's impossible." Then Jalen Hurts was like "Hold my motherfugin' beer and watch THIS!" LOL

It wasn't quite butt fumble/Younghoe sticking his toe in the turf level blooper reel but damn... it was pretty bad. LOL

I didn't specifically mean you. I was just talking about the Panthers' brass and pro-Bryce fans in general.

It's based primarily off of cope. He plays just well enough jest often enough for them to cling to hope because swallowing that bitter pill of admitting that trade up was a huge blunder is gonna be a tough one. But not nearly as tough as the one we'd have to eventually choke down if we extended him to a franchise QB contract. From the fan perspective I think it's a mix of not wanting to be wrong and the fact that Bryce seems like a legitimately decent guy that you wanna root for.

Yep. Football can be a crazy game. If you're on an NFL roster you have the ability to play well if the stars align, especially if your opponent is overlooking you. That third stringer was probably all state in HS and all conference in college. You would've had that game circled on the calendar to face him back in those days and ain't nothing changed now. He's still him.

Just wanted to clarify that I am neither a starter for the Bucs nor am I going to IR.

That's true but honestly I've been very surprised with how well his talent level has translated to the NFL. The guy looks to have legit franchise QB tools. I did not anticipate that. I basically thought that Kirk Cousins was probably his absolute ceiling.