strato

As was mentioned, the CBA since 2011 encourages this type of gamble, the reduced rookie pay.

That seems like the way these things go for us. But I would bet they knew Diggs was down and other stuff. Knowing nothing really about how long this deal was in the works, but people knew that if they waited we probably would cut him loose and it was for free then. We have seen the damaged goods and everybody knows it before and it does normally go badly for the seller. Morgan made some decent bargains in his draft trading, I am going 'benefit the doubt' this one and say he likely did try to get more elsewhere and that was it.

We did one for Chicago, so we needed one for ourselves I guess.

But here is the thing about these meetings that isn't being acknowledged: the guy doesn't need weekly meetings to meddle. If he wants to meddle, he simply sends for the coach and meddles. Or goes and finds the coach and meddles. Easy. So really, probably don't need to sweat the meetings themselves. Which could potentially be productive, actually. There is context which is Tepper, at the time Reich speaks, is uneducated by the events of the months that have followed, and may now understand that obsessing over not winning and why his prize little soldier was so impotent, was probably brought on by grief and he was in the denial stage. People do learn, sometimes. I just hope he has. I haven't seen but a hint or two of meddling - with the late game Bryce appearances, and I suppose that may not even be a direct result of meddling.

Yeah that is a good point he makes, I mean we probably took the best offer we could get. It makes me afraid they are bringing Young back. I want to leave with him.

Yes he does. He will need football instincts to make up some for that, and I don't see that either. Yet. Like people say, he is likely thinking too much and that blocks instinctual response.

That is what it smells like. I expect Morgan to try and save face on getting value with whoever is next.

And they couldn't work Bryce into a deal, as long as we are giving stuff away?

Without the Tepper factor, we would be a good spot for that. Yeah that 2023 draft, no one thought Levis or AR were up there with Stroud. It was clear who the possible guy was in that class.

I think people knew they wanted him gone and that is how it goes with disgruntled players when everybody knows it. Situation sucks. That pick swap compensation really sucks.

Entitled and immature, apparently.

That’s a very good point. Not like it used to be, with rookies signing the biggest deals of all time type of scenarios.

I think maybe yes. But they disappoint me weekly. I feel about wanting to see what we have there, about the same as I felt waiting to see what the offense would look like with Bryce. With a lot more hope for Brooks. He should be a big piece …. I saw one player comment that was really impressed with him. I forget who it was, it was last week.

He might not have gone there if he didn’t know Payton. This isn’t any kind of big deal afaic. Payton is an ass, Horn took the bait, okay. It is over. He did it because he is an ass, and isn’t scared of them turning it around on him. Poking them. And I’m sure they will use that to motivate themselves because disrespect should motivate them.

We see the insidious doings that lead to 2025 Bryce Young on the Panthers roster and reliving the nightmare yet another year, making it three years wasted on huge mistake. It is sort of like watching a toddler reaching its hand into a flame, after not learning the first time that it will burn you. You know what is about to happen. But it has to find out for itself. Problem is, I get burned too in this case. Not just the toddler.

Yeah I am usually reasonable on hearing different perspectives. I have had enough of Young and his impacting the Panthers. Just make it stop. But I don’t really object to the meetings (I am not sure I’d personally require a weekly appointment, just open lines where I can have a question answered or something explained). At the same time, I am not a Tepper fan in any way. I don’t even remember when that turned, it was so long ago now. Of course I was thinking originally, cool - billionaire owner, money will flow. Then I got more of a taste of it. I wish he had bought a different team. I hate what he has done to mine.

There are some things you can’t discuss rationally. Like don’t don’t discuss Bryce with me in terms of his future being here as Panthers QB. I won’t hear it. With others it is the meeting. The thought that an owner might want to know what is happening and how it’s going. Because the suggestion or an inflection in a statement transforms it into instructions from the boss. And that is meddling. More or less. I have two minds on it. The first is that if I own a company I ask whoever I want whatever I want. In the interest of being informed. The second is, the owner needs to stay the hell out of telling the coach to switch to the 3/4 or what QB to take and who to start and who to draft and all that.

You quoted me but I am not really sure why this thought relates to what I was saying - but I do get that that is the reality of fielding a team on Sunday.

Easy, the difference is Reich, after he was hired. Canales, before he ever interviewed. Which is why I felt Canales would at least know what he was getting into. There is no way an NFL coach can look at Young and see what the media and the fans and the Tepper’s saw. Just no way, so Canales absolutely knew. What might be fun is to dump Bryce and then do a coaching search with that high pick, just to assess why no one wanted the job. Would you want to take a job that requires you to build your offense around Bryce Young? Hell no.

I wasn’t one of the ‘we have to have an offensive master mind play caller’ people to start with. Reich was okay with me but I really only knew a little about him as a coach. Didn’t follow Indy. Knew people considered Irsay a loose cannon. I don’t know that any of it mattered once the stuff started here. And I don’t know who went behind who’s back once they were here. None of it matters that much to me in any analytical sense, scene of the crime type of view. All of whatever it could have been or not have been was over when they took Bryce Young. I don’t blame anyone much for anything after that little bit of undermining the prospects of the team for the next 5 years. And even though Reich was out of here soon enough and we are still eating the same crappy meal and it isn’t a mystery as to why.

Money is money. Reich wasn’t broke when he took the gig. I doubt he was. At a point, money stops being what mattered. Someone fuging you over and changing the rules in the middle of the game, tends to obscure the reason you want to be there. At some point your only hope of relief is to force them to fire you. I don’t know what happened but have the big guess that number one they forced Bryce on him and took all the fun out of it right there. Then forced him to keep playing him when he needed to not be on the field. I’d be wanting out too.

If this isn't bottom I don't want to see it. We need to get Bryce off the field and off the team and stop chasing a bad investment and get to the business of digging out of this hole.

Him playing good is a relative thing. Why are people thinking because he was better than the bottom of the barrel job performance we have seen the first two weeks, that that means he s good? Who is he better than? He will struggle to crack a top 25 QBs list even if you started him another 19 starts. . That's good enough? Why? Because we spent so much? I don't mean to attack You. It is that everyone seems to be changing their tune all of a sudden and your post is a great example.

Reich got steamrolled. Tepper shoved a totally overwhelmed project into his lap and said make it work by September. Impossible. I am not unhappy with Canales like so many people are, but considering the anger I believe even more that we should have kept Wilks as HC as a bridge. Couple of years to instill some discipline and toughness back into the team, discreetly find their ideal HC to marry to a new QB, he'd probably have gone for that.

1st quarter of this year. It is all there in a condensed time frame, the stuff Canales or whoever had him working on was there on his first drop back, maybe 12 snaps later when the 1st quarter runs into the 2nd quarter forget about it. I don't remember how many plays we ran in that 1st quarter, but they weren't all pass plays so it really happened over the course of just a few plays. Complete unraveling.