Gapanthersfan

2 minutes ago, Jackie Lee said:

 

Darnold. I never understood the vitriol some still have for him. A good sports psychologist could have turned dude in to a straight stud. 

3 minutes ago, WhoKnows said:

Who’s getting cost money? Young is awful, said that last year but acting like there is hidden talent that might be balling out elsewhere is laughable. Call me out when TMJ gets his 2nd contract after showing out.

TBH, there are a ton of guys on this roster who wouldn’t even be playing if it weren’t for us trading Burns, CMC, Moore and a few draft picks for Young. He's made guys like Sanders money because we dumped all our good guys and didn’t pick up starters from the 1sts and 2nds we wasted.

It is not possible to evaluate offensive talent with Bryce at qb. Deep threat WR will never be able to showcase his skills? TEs that own the middle of the field? RBs? If all opposing the defense has to do is play up close and run stunts knowing that 90% of the time it will work… it’s a wrap. What offensive play is going to go hard for that every play? 

Im not saying we have studs and these guys are playing for 20 mil contracts, but a 5 mil for 3 years for what looks like quality depth is a very real situation for some of these dudes that may not happen with Bryce under center. Plays are over before they even start. 

5 minutes ago, Shotgun said:

Does Young even want to play in the NFL? His body language says no. Why doesn't he just fake an injury and call it a career if he doesn't want to be out there?

I don’t believe he does. He’s got his money, and he knows he’s only one play away from a life changing chronic pain type injury when he gets hit by a giant. I don’t know if there is a forfeiture clause in players contracts, but I could see him sucking so bad that he has to get benched and probably never have to play again. 

33 minutes ago, raleigh-panther said:

Well. They are going to start him

that is the  bottom line

until the locker room of grown ass men realize the $$s he is costing them in contractual incentives, it won’t change 

it is the final  destruction of the fanbase 

This is the unappreciated truth that is lost on most fans. Bryce is costing those dudes, who by and large won’t have a long career in the nfl, their livelihood. They need to be able to show out for contract #2 that hopefully sets them up for life. Any offensive skill position player under Bryce is cooked. Hell, line guys are cooked. You think these bros are cool with getting curb stomped and a QB who can’t make an NFL throw? Where every play is over before it even starts?

I’ve said it over and over and over and hopefully more are coming to realize the fact that T will only hire patsys that he feels he can control. Guys that can be bought. Canales is just another brick in the wall. Same with Dan. I wonder how the weekly meeting will go this week. 

Or is this all going according to plan? 

One of the aspects of the deep ball that is missing from the conversation is… what does his deep throw look like. Does he need to release at a 40 degree trajectory to hit the mark when most other QBs can make it happen at 30 degrees with the same target yardage? I’m 100% sure Bryce can throw the ball 40 yards in the air, but is it the type of throw he can make when the receiver only has 2 steps on a speedy db. 

My hope is that his improved mechanics show up in the speed of his throws. It’s the threat of the deep ball, yes, but it’s really the threat of a good deep ball that matters. Do his throws draw double coverage past 30 yards or is the safety free to roam? 

He doesn’t have to have a cannon, but it has to show a lot better than last season. 

Hurney through draft and free agency put some DUDES on this team, and largely kept them here. Hardy going psycho may have cost us a Super Bowl. With him still on the team,  we don’t lose that game. He got us Norwell. Prohel Jake, Ginn, Olsen kalil, Kris, agent 58, kuechly, hardy, and probably many more that I can’t remember. Leaders. Winners. Guys who never quit. Fox. He kept many past their prime but we had an identity. 

1 hour ago, pantherclaw said:

George Seifert. 

I know he was the main influence, but Marty had to agree. I think George told him at his first practice to not f this up. 

1 hour ago, t96 said:

Aside from McCaffrey Hurney’s picks are the best…

Yup. All GMs miss, but Hurney was a pretty good one aside from contract mgt. never thought I’d say that. To me, SS89 in the third will forever be the most important pick in franchise history. The number of games won due directly to the influence of that 1 man will never be equaled by this team again. 

42 minutes ago, gakonline said:

I believe this is why they were not afraid to depart with Burns. Burns openly said he was afraid of getting hurt at times meaning he did not play 100%. Brown got paid because he did play 100% even when games were out of reach. 

It shows character. Who is a quitter. Who is out for the $$. Burns, in this, showed big time character issues. No thank you. 

A new GM and new head coach are not long for this league unless they come in guns blazing. I like the moves and it seems like things are progressing nicely, but everything is fluid and all regimes grow stale eventually. Injuries happen to fan/coach/GM/owner favorites and they they’re almost never 100% the same.

The vital blow is center, left guard or and/or QB. Without talent at all 3, the offense goes nowhere. Always. Find me an annual contender with suck at those 3 positions. Neglect those spots in the draft great peril. No team in this age wins games 17 to 10 on the regular. These spots have to have serious revaluation at every draft. There always has to be good next man up talent at those spots. 1st/2nd rounders from top 10 college programs.

Showing confidence in mediocre/bad talent in a ‘good lunchpail guy’ at these 3 spots…it’s a wrap. Hard breakup, especially with the ‘give him 1 more season’ mentality. That’s what creates ‘the answer is in the roster’ coach speak. Hand a big contract to a free agent coming off a big or frequent injury history as a desperation move at any of these 3 spots, and it almost NEVER works out. 

Depth issues at anywhere else, safety, lb, dt, rb, whatever…  normally team is pretty ok at least for then with good position coaches. Mediocre guards and RT… trouble, but typically a good offensive coordinator can scheme around that, it’s still probably a 7-10 win team with a stud center, lt, and qb. Teams that neglect or draft bad here don’t win on the regular. 

1 hour ago, Mage said:

Frankie Luvu is what we all thought Shaq Thompson was going to be.

This. And I don’t think Luvu has peaked.

I don’t know if it is because we overestimated Shaq’s high gear or if it was doomed by injury. Sadly, the only aspect lacking for him to become elite… was elite ability. He was a really good player. A starter. Not a JAG. Not a star player. Not an All pro. He is a JAG+ with elite leadership qualities. 

If we were to sign a free agent LB who had an identical resume and career stats for big money, this place would burn to the ground. 

Shaq’s biggest asset is locker room, not on the football field. Look, I love Shaq. This is not a knock.  I’m glad we’ve kept him, but a first rounder is supposed, one hopes, to be a game changer. Keeps coaches awake at night. Hard to scheme around. Puts a game away at a critical juncture. He never has been. I think it’s because we haven’t seen one in so long we’ve forgotten what that looks like. 

flame away  

I have immense respect for Shaq, especially for sticking through as one of the very few who stuck it out to fill the leadership void in the hostile takeover that was selling the team. His drive is unquestioned. His leadership is unquestioned. I think his injuries played a more substantial role than realized. Heck of man. Never complains or dogs on any of his teammates. 

TD is godlike. Folklore. Our enforcer. Pseudo goon. Agent 58. Tough act to follow. 

13 minutes ago, Ricky Spanish said:

Looking back, I don't think there are 64 players better than Shaq in that draft.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2015_NFL_draft

Some made pro bowls like once but have been JAGs the rest of their careers and bounced around the league or are out of it now. I'd take Shaq over the likes of Vic Beasley, Laken Tomlinson, Jameis Winston or DJ Humphries - All pro bowlers at one point but not better than Shaq has been over the course of his career imo.

As would I. Beasley.  It’s hard for me to hate him, even though I (we all) should. he’s a good Adairsville man. He’s local to me. He killed our undefeated season and showed the Broncos the roadmap. Why can’t the panthers ever win in the ATL?

There is a long line of players overdrafted that I wouldn’t take for shaq either. I wouldn’t take Vic for him. My point is that he was overdrafted for where he was actually selected, judging by his year over year production. I have been longing to see out of Shaq the high gear that Luvu showed last season. Shaq balled out against the Cowboys one game that I will be eternally grateful for. He was an animal that game. 

My hope and expectation was to have Thomas Davis like production once he assumed the throne. IMHO, we never saw it. 
 

10 minutes ago, t96 said:

lol dude you are absolutely high if you believe this.

Hallucinations don’t normally start until later. Gotta get the mixture right as pool road players used to say. 

I don’t recall a game that we won because Shaq took a game over and wrecked shop. There may have been one, I’m sure there was, but I can’t recall. Was he ever an all pro? I honestly can’t recall. Did he have a run of first team probowl selections? 

He had heart. I love the dude and almost bought his jersey, but nobody had to game plan around Shaq. Leader, no question. This is why he’s not just a jag, he plays well, he makes plays, but he’s not a DUDE. A closer. Someone offensive coordinators stay awake thinking about.

Playmaker? Yes. Game changer? Unfortunately, I feel like he has always left us wanting to see more. He’s a JAG+. 

Just my $.02

JAG+ 

Will Witherspoon-ish with stronger leadership qualities. 

Likable guy, redraft would have been a late 3rd rounder, probably. 

I have been and will continue to be Bryce skeptical, but I’m also fair. 

Improvements  I saw:

1. Footwork and his patience in the pocket was tremendously improved. Even on scrambles, you saw him turn his hips and plant his feet. 

2. confidence: I’m sure everyone already knew what play was going to be called, but he looked better in this regard. 

3. did he looked a bit bulked up or was it just me?

4. accuracy

He has a long way to go and I’m still skeptical but that was a good look. It was watchable. 

TinFoil hat theory that I’ve stuck to ever since about game 4 last year. This is long. 

Frank’s body language and overall lack of enthusiasm at any point in his tenure here showed that Bryce was not his guy. He was probably another con job victim of T, but T had to have 1. Someone he could push around and 2. Someone with local ties to try to ease the PR and team morale disaster that was letting Wilks go the way that he did. Putting the band back together was the new narrative.

Frank thought he would get CJ. The team loaded up personnel to coach CJ. Then they pick Bryce. It didn’t take long before Frank went in to ‘I don’t need this ish mode.’ You could see it with the very first TC interviews. He’s on the sunset of his career, he has money, but T gave dude a lot of money.

Most contracts at least in my industry have verbiage to the effect of if you quit without material breach of contract by the employer, the prorated GROSS amount of the bonus paid up front will be owed back to the employer. No company is going to pay a large sum up front without strings attached. That’d be dumb. 

 So, the taxman taketh. Say you get a $10million. Make the math easy. Call it govt takes 40%. You get $6m, but if you quit without employer breech,  you cough up $4m of your own to cover the difference because you owe the gross back, not the net. They gave you 10, they want 10, you only got 6. Now, there may be a tax loophole that makes my point entirely moot, I  don’t think so, but I’m not an accountant. So that’s a hell to the naw ghost rider. You rarely see NFL coaches quit and I believe this is a factor.

Frank knew he had to get fired without breaching his side of the contract. Losing probably wouldn’t be enough. T is loaded, but all the same, it’s an embarrassing hit to his ego to Fire a coach that soon. Nope. 

Ickey got Frank fired. Game after game, he’s beat like a drum, but glaringly, he never really got help to beat the speed rush. Frank knew that they would never win a game this way, and that Bryce would eventually get murdered. He forced T’s hand. Fire me or I get the kid you traded the world for killed. It was a standoff between the 2 sides, but it was only a matter of time. T had to, it was only a matter of time. The other coaches that didn’t want Bryce needed their out as well. Speed rush on the left side was that out. If Smitty helped, Frank probably bought him another G Wagon out of gratitude. 

Is this complete speculation on my behalf that the internal voices helped me compile? Yes, but I’ve stuck to my meds this time around and I trust my man Russell. He’s always been one of the few that I can trust. 

Kris Jenkins was such a beast in 2003. He was a legit HOF talent. Very Aaron Donald like. 

There’s more than enough talent on this team to go at least .500 with a JAG+ QB. Bryce right now I’d put as a JAG-, but I’m really interested in seeing how things go this year.

There are dudes on this offense with big play ability. The talent around him at WR and RB ain’t bad. the defense seems like it could be formidable this year. Evero is about to show what good coaching and dawg attitude looks like and what it’s capable of. We do have some DUDES on that defense despite what people may say. The Browns picked in the top 5 for years and were still losers. 

 With Bryce, it’s going to be attitude. This meekness ish has to go. If he rushes for a first down, takes a nasty shot, springs up a la Smitty and spins the ball on the ground while staring daggers at homeboy, I will jump for joy. 

A team that waiting for a savior is like the low self esteem high school kid waiting for a decently looking girl to ask him to prom. 

Losing is NEVER ok. In racing terms, you run what you brung. That is not how a team builds a culture of winning and pride. 

If Canales pulls a John Fox and pulls Young at half… huddle would need to find an additional data center 

42 minutes ago, strato said:

Jake to Proehl. 

Greatest Panther season to me. Ahead of 2015. 2015 team may have been better but that year was just freaking great. 

To me it’s not even close. 2003. The whole season was something out of a movie

4 hours ago, Khyber53 said:

Figuratively, anything could happen with this season. Might as well tune in, cheer for the team and enjoy hope for as long as we have it. 

That's football. 

And, yeah, sometimes hope only lasts until that first game, partway through the first quarter.

And then sometimes they send in some nobody back up QB who'd never got a shot before and he wins that game. And then he goes on to march the team to a Super Bowl.

I mean, lightning could strike twice.

 

That team broke the matrix. If Jake doesn’t come in at half, the season never happens. Big Kris blocking kicks. Double OT X clown. Ricky manning jr 3 picks in Philly, beating Manning in Indy, coming back in the SB and taking a lead against the GOAT in the 4th quarter. 2 HOF’ers, All pro Stephen Davis for peanuts. Some no name who played backup to Kurt Warner in NFL Europe? 

It’s one of the greatest NFL stories of all time. 

Reminds me of when I was 20 and tried my first, and last dip. 

But in the spirit of the thread, I’m really looking forward to seeing how the young talent on defense grows and develops.