Loyalty4Life

If you had stopped at 5-6 years I would be with you but come on, Cam was the culture. For a few years there it felt like we had the Lebron of the NFL.

Before the season I thought we would win 5-7 games. Tracking.

Man, if Cade's performance against Lawrence is any indication we may already have our starting center. Way too soon to tell but that is a great single game against one of the best DT in the NFL.

Last few years it seems more teams are letting a QB sit and learn. Many have pointed to lack of college development. I'll add a win now, immediate results mentality as well. Mahomes, Love, Purdy, Maye. I think it will be a growing trend.

I knew you'd be proud.

Can confirm. I've met a number of them IRL. Most are exactly as you imagine.

I say hope til you drop. Kinda the whole point to watching sports. Be somewhat realistic. I only want improvement. Canales has already shown with his benching he isn't going to put him on the field without good reason which to me would be best chance of winning or learning and getting better.

Don't shoot the messenger but I fully agree with his points on today's expectations.

Here. Maybe JC Horn can say it better than I can although I'm not going anywhere near as far as JC is but I would expect him to see the situation better than I can.

Bryce Woung. My mistake. LOL. I really should care enough to proof read better.

Maybe. https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/5683925/2024/08/07/nfl-players-pilates-fitness-recovery/ https://www.instagram.com/reel/CniQuHTJIDg/?utm_source=ig_embed&ig_rid=076cb6f3-e2a5-4dca-8e9e-8106dabd5b25

Yes, absolutely but I would throw out the first two games except to say that is how bad he started out. If I'm Canales I'm looking forward from that. What is different? Did sitting and watching improve him in any ways? Confidence, becoming more familiar with the system, a new coaching staff, new players? Since that reset Canales and Morgan have repeatedly said they have a plan for Bryce. We've seen that plan over the last three games and we've seen improvement. That is literally all I'm looking for at this stage. Is he improving each week? Is the team growing? Is a culture developing. Ya'll keep acting like I'm trying to convince you Bryce Young is great and has no flaws or that he's ready right now to lead us to the playoffs and super bowls. All I'm saying and keep repeating is give Canales a chance to do what he did with Geno and Baker and enjoy a win without poo posting.

Sigh. Literally the very next paragraph, you cherry picking troll. "Of course, you don't end up winning a Heisman or being picked first overall if you're too good at laying about doing nothing. And he admitted that sleeping in lasted all of about a week, at which point he got back to morning workouts and getting ready for the physical challenges to come." He goes on to talk about his growth, path towards improvement, etc.

I've said that over and over. Bryce may very well be exactly what we are seeing. I've also repeatedly said that my argument isn't really about BW. Pick any widget. Pick any player. I would not bet my job on any evaluation based on last year. I think that our coaching staff, players (especially oline) and scheme (Frank's was beyond awful) are better than last years. Then we trot Bryce out in the first two games and he played HORRIBLE. BAD. YUCK. Based on those first two games he regressed greatly from his rookie year. So, Canales benches him to see if he can fix him and begin to put him on a path toward improvement. Canales was hired in part because of his work with similar QB's who struggled. Canales saw he was horrible. Benched him. Realized he had some things from his rookie year he needed to undo. He developed a plan and path that is in progress now to see if he could turn into something. All I keep saying is let's find out. Beats riding out the year with Dalton or some random UDFA and man what if Canales does do what he did with Geno or Baker? Geno was so bad he was a back up for 7 years. We got Baker because no one else, except Matt Rhule, wanted him and even when we did get him the Browns paid most of his contract.

Yeah, it's hard for me not to act like an asshole considering the entire thread begin as a troll job and one that has been beat to death to the point that a lot of fans here complain about so much it's almost like an inside joke.

My whole point is finding even a decent NFL QB is hard. No reason to give up on one with potential until you find someone better. Throw out his rookie year. If anything it hurt him as I think we can all agree the first 2 games of the year he looked and played the worst football of his NFL career. Judge him like a rookie in Canales's system from week 8 on. Here are more. All of these are not mirror copies of Bryce. My argument is the NFL is hard and the path to being a quality NFL starter isn't always a straight one and guys can get better, especially guys who work hard and are willing to learn like Bryce. Alex Smith, Rich Gannon, Vinny Testaverde, Jim Plunkett, Brett Favre, Ryan Tannehill, Doug Williams, Tommy Maddox, Jake Plummer, Josh Allen, Jordan Love, Geno Smith.

I don't want to go to fast for you. Here is number three and it might be the worst start for a HOF QB ever who went on to win multiple superbowls. 1970: Starts: 8 Record: 3-5 Passing: 1,410 yards Completion %: 38.1% Touchdowns: 6 Interceptions: 24 1971: Starts: 13 Record: 5-8 Passing: 2,259 yards Completion %: 47.7% Touchdowns: 13 Interceptions: 22 Combined two-year totals: Record: 8-13 Passing: 3,669 yards Touchdowns: 19 Interceptions: 46 Passer Rating: 36.1 (1970), 54.9 (1971)

Our next contestant was so bad the team drafted another first round QB after only 2 seasons but this short stack still went on to improve and become one the NFL's best passers. 2002: Starts: 16 Record: 8-8 Passing: 3,284 yards Completion %: 60.8% Touchdowns: 17 Interceptions: 16 2003: Starts: 11 Record: 2-9 Passing: 2,108 yards Completion %: 57.6% Touchdowns: 11 Interceptions: 15 Combined two-year totals: Record: 10-17 Passing: 5,392 yards Touchdowns: 28 Interceptions: 31 Passer Rating: 67.5

1985: Starts: 5 Record: 1-4 Passing: 935 yards Completion %: 52.2% Touchdowns: 8 Interceptions: 7 1986: Starts: 14 Record: 2-12 Passing: 2,282 yards Completion %: 53.7% Touchdowns: 8 Interceptions: 13 Combined two-year totals: Record: 3-16 Passing: 3,217 yards Touchdowns: 16 Interceptions: 20 Passer Rating: 63.1 This HOF player went on to be traded after his second year and went on to win multiple super bowls.

I don't like or put too much stock in answers with excessively different variables.

If you don't want me to write a novel then don't make me dispute things that easily found. I just posted the reputable sources who said that teams have called about Bryce. I won't go out of my way to explain why his play isn't to any degree that other players are worried for their safety outside of the NFL norm. It would actually be difficult to do that with how little we throw and most of the throws are on the conservative side. Slants, crossing routes over the top, outs, etc That is just gaslighting and grasping at straws. My optimism isn't toxic. It's realistic. It's lets take the chance to find out. That is why he is starting games for us. That is why the Panthers continue to say he is in their future plans although that plan can change quickly. I'm under no illusion. This entire plan to start Bryce could only be to try to up his trade value from a 4th or 5th rounder to a 3rd. Very possible and a good idea regardless, in case he doesn't improve. If we draft a qb and trade Bryce after this year I've got no issue with that. A full year with Canales is the least I'd expect to really evaluate him and give him a chance with a better system, staff, surrounding players, etc. Hell, I don't sell stock when it's down especially if there is a probability of it improving or if I can do things to improve it's value. If Bryce ends up sinking or swims my argument is still the same.

Ian Rapoport, Jay Glazer, Dianna Russini. https://thespun.com/nfl/carolina-panthers/report-4-nfl-teams-tried-to-trade-for-bryce-young https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/5892177/2024/11/02/nfl-trade-deadline-teams-players/ https://x.com/awfulannouncing/status/1837890344198832222 I realize the team can lie but add Dave Canales and Dan Morgan.

No. Not a chance with his current play. Do I think he could improve to become that. Yes. Because the NFL is hard and dozens of other Qb's have some back from starting just as bad and we've got nothing to lose by trying.

I don't see BW getting white knighted. I see people beating a dead horse even when that horse shows signs of life. I am not and have not said BW is or will be the savior. I have only argued that his first year had plenty of circumstances that didn't help him and definitely made it harder for him to improve. So, all in all I give that whole year a wash. I was hugely disappointed with his first two games this year. He was awful. Beyond awful. We can never win or have any type of chance with a QB playing that badly. No question. He deserved to be benched and if it wasn't for the cluster of the entire operation last year, a new coach, new players and new system I wouldn't give much of an argument. The fact that he has begun to improve after this benching and that we don't have any other options and his small sample size with Canales as his coach makes me want to see if this could turn out like other QB's who started out badly (see previous list). That's it. No savior. No statement that he is the future of our franchise. Just the best chance we currently have. Your argument is he sucks and has no value or potential to become a quality starter. My argument is he's shown flashes, improvement and still has upside if for nothing else than it hasn't been proven for a long enough period of time. If he plays like this in year 7, no one is even calling. What is the potential upside? What is the potential downside? We are not a good team. We can't afford to give up on any player too soon especially a high draft pick with a new coach and where his rookie year was a cluster in numerous areas outside of his control that impacted his development. He may very well be exactly the player you think he is but he might not be. It's possible he was screwed up by the year of Frank. Why not try to turn him into a success story? Tons to gain. Not much to lose.

Were there circumstances last year that made it more difficult to judge BW? Was it possible we didn't put him the best situation to improve and grow? Was it worth not cutting him last year to see how he played under better circumstances? I have never one said BW's play was excellent or that we should put all our eggs in the BW will be the franchise savior. If this was his 2nd year with the same staff and in the same system I'd been much less argumentative. It's also not just about cutting bait. It's the BW option right now vs Dalton or an UDFA or anything else we could come up with. No one is calling to trade for Kyle Allen. People don't see the possibility of him improving beyond his current abilities. Myself, Canales, and at least 4 other teams do see potential and that is all I'm arguing for. He is currently our best chance for a starting level QB in the future. It's just a chance. I'm playing the probabilities with no expectations. As long as he is improving and we don't have better options why not do everything you can for that player to succeed?